Campus Carry revived, attached to open carry

[TXBO]

. . . it's hard to NOT be a card carrying Libertarian. . . . What's not to like?

Pretty much everything. Libertarians love to promote only two or three of the Libertarian Party's Platform planks like gun rights and smaller government. The vast majority of its Platform is either dangerously naive or outright crazy.

https://www.lp.org/platform" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Chas.

May I ask which points in particular you don't like?

There's plenty. One example is their platform of "Economic Liberty". It's not only an idealistic impossibility, it's downright dangerous to capitalism.

I guess I don't see that.

Here's some examples:
1) No government involvement means no patents. Completely removes the motivation for research, development and innovation.
2) No anti-trust legislation. Can you imagine what our country would look like today if Standard oil had been allowed to continue with it's predatory practices? The Rockefellers would rule the country.
3) It is impossible to completely remove government from any macro-economic equation as long as it has taxing authority.

[anygunanywhere]

Libertarianism is essentially the ultimate subjective reality where everyone gets to do what they want where they want when they want under the guise of personal freedom and the absence of consequence for actions.

[TexasJohnBoy]

Lets just hope that these bills (both of them) get to the floor in some form. I truly don't care if Campus carry is an amendment or a full on bill. Let's just get it moving!

[XinTX]

I've always supported the Liberian party vs the same old R and D.

Make no mistake... I'd guess that the majority of us who are libertarians are NOT, in any way, shape, or form, affiliated with the Libertarian Party. It's unfortunate that we share a name.

Yeah. The few "Big L" Libertarians (party members) I've met seem to be the real tin-foil hat type kooks. I wish there were a party whose core principle was personal liberty. I think a lot of people could get behind that.

[mojo84]

I think anything to the extreme is detrimental. I agree with many of the libertarian principles. However, I also believe taking them to the extreme is dangerous.

[CJD]

. . . it's hard to NOT be a card carrying Libertarian. . . . What's not to like?

Pretty much everything. Libertarians love to promote only two or three of the Libertarian Party's Platform planks like gun rights and smaller government. The vast majority of its Platform is either dangerously naive or outright crazy.

https://www.lp.org/platform" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Chas.

May I ask which points in particular you don't like?

There's plenty. One example is their platform of "Economic Liberty". It's not only an idealistic impossibility, it's downright dangerous to capitalism.

I guess I don't see that.

Here's some examples:
1) No government involvement means no patents. Completely removes the motivation for research, development and innovation.
2) No anti-trust legislation. Can you imagine what our country would look like today if Standard oil had been allowed to continue with it's predatory practices? The Rockefellers would rule the country.
3) It is impossible to completely remove government from any macro-economic equation as long as it has taxing authority.

Those are good examples, thanks. And yes I fully understand that any form of Libertarianism will never be realized, there will always be something that needs to be banned for the betterment of society I think, though, that even though it is an idealistic impossibility, it's still, for the most part, the right direction to aim.

[safety1]

Wising this would get back on topic

[txcharvel]

Wising this would get back on topic

[TexasCajun]

Wising this would get back on topic

[locke_n_load]

Terry Holcomb of Texas Carry stated on facebook today that 910 is moving forward this week, but they are removing the amendment that prohibited officers from asking for ID without probable cause.
:/

[safety1]

Terry Holcomb of Texas Carry stated on facebook today that 910 is moving forward this week, but they are removing the amendment that prohibited officers from asking for ID without probable cause.
:/

Movement is good, if this is true
and thanks for the update on this topic lock_n_load !!!!!

[Tracker]

Terry Holcomb of Texas Carry stated on facebook today that 910 is moving forward this week, but they are removing the amendment that prohibited officers from asking for ID without probable cause.
:/

After thinking about this amendment I don't have a problem with it being left out. I think an officer ought to be able to ask. Once the new wears off of OC CHL holders will likely be left alone most of the time. If it's a problem, if your routinely being stopped when in public, then the legislature can deal with it in two years.

[safety1]

Terry Holcomb of Texas Carry stated on facebook today that 910 is moving forward this week, but they are removing the amendment that prohibited officers from asking for ID without probable cause.
:/

After thinking about this amendment I don't have a problem with it being left out. I think an officer ought to be able to ask. Once the new wears off of OC CHL holders will likely be left alone most of the time. If it's a problem, if your routinely being stopped when in public, then the legislature can deal with it in two years.

......now let's move forward with expanding our 2A rights. I hope this thought gathers steam and moves HB910 to the floor!

[safety1]

Terry Holcomb of Texas Carry stated on facebook today that 910 is moving forward this week, but they are removing the amendment that prohibited officers from asking for ID without probable cause.
:/

After thinking about this amendment I don't have a problem with it being left out. I think an officer ought to be able to ask. Once the new wears off of OC CHL holders will likely be left alone most of the time. If it's a problem, if your routinely being stopped when in public, then the legislature can deal with it in two years.

and if you are not breaking the law...who cares??? The new will wear off and this will be a good thing for Texas gun owners who choose to OC.

[Charles L. Cotton]

. . . it's hard to NOT be a card carrying Libertarian. . . . What's not to like?

Pretty much everything. Libertarians love to promote only two or three of the Libertarian Party's Platform planks like gun rights and smaller government. The vast majority of its Platform is either dangerously naive or outright crazy.

https://www.lp.org/platform" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Chas.

May I ask which points in particular you don't like?

Okay, here goes.

• 1.0 Personal Liberty
  Individuals should be free to make choices for themselves and to accept responsibility for the consequences of the choices they make. Our support of an individual's right to make choices in life does not mean that we necessarily approve or disapprove of those choices. No individual, group, or government may initiate force against any other individual, group, or government. [Unworkable, naïve and dangerous.]
  
  1.1 Self-Ownership
  Individuals own their bodies and have rights over them that other individuals, groups, and governments may not violate. Individuals have the freedom and responsibility to decide what they knowingly and voluntarily consume, and what risks they accept to their own health, finances, safety, or life. [Dangerously naive approach that has proven devastating throughout history.]
  
  1.2 Expression and Communication
  We support full freedom of expression and oppose government censorship, regulation or control of communications media and technology. We favor the freedom to engage in or abstain from any religious activities that do not violate the rights of others. We oppose government actions which either aid or attack any religion. [So no laws against Sharia Law.]
  
  1.3 Privacy
  Libertarians advocate individual privacy and government transparency. We are committed to ending government’s practice of spying on everyone. We support the rights recognized by the Fourth Amendment to be secure in our persons, homes, property, and communications. Protection from unreasonable search and seizure should include records held by third parties, such as email, medical, and library records.
  
  1.4 Personal Relationships
  Sexual orientation, preference, gender, or gender identity should have no impact on the government's treatment of individuals, such as in current marriage, child custody, adoption, immigration or military service laws. Government does not have the authority to define, license or restrict personal relationships. Consenting adults should be free to choose their own sexual practices and personal relationships. [Yes, the government most certainly does and every government in recorded history has enacted such regulations. “Anything goes” does not create a country or environment any normal person wants to live in and raise their children. While LP anarchists don't want God in government, most Americans do.]
  
  1.5 Abortion
  Recognizing that abortion is a sensitive issue and that people can hold good-faith views on all sides, we believe that government should be kept out of the matter, leaving the question to each person for their conscientious consideration. [So much for personal freedom! The LP doesn’t even want laws protecting the most vulnerable from being murdered. Why stop at the unborn, LP? Why not allow the killing of anyone under the age of majority?]
  
  1.6 Crime and Justice
  Government exists to protect the rights of every individual including life, liberty and property. Criminal laws should be limited to violation of the rights of others through force or fraud, or deliberate actions that place others involuntarily at significant risk of harm. We favor the repeal of all laws creating "crimes" without victims, such as the use of drugs for medicinal or recreational purposes, since only actions that infringe on the rights of others can properly be termed crimes. Individuals retain the right to voluntarily assume risk of harm to themselves. We support restitution to the victim to the fullest degree possible at the expense of the criminal or the negligent wrongdoer. We oppose reduction of constitutional safeguards of the rights of the criminally accused. The rights of due process, a speedy trial, legal counsel, trial by jury, and the legal presumption of innocence until proven guilty, must not be denied. We assert the common-law right of juries to judge not only the facts but also the justice of the law. [So, are DWI laws “unjust” in the eyes of the LP? How about fire codes, building codes, elevator codes, etc.?]
  
  1.7 Self-Defense
  The only legitimate use of force is in defense of individual rights — life, liberty, and justly acquired property — against aggression. This right inheres in the individual, who may agree to be aided by any other individual or group. We affirm the individual right recognized by the Second Amendment to keep and bear arms, and oppose the prosecution of individuals for exercising their rights of self-defense. Private property owners should be free to establish their own conditions regarding the presence of personal defense weapons on their own property. We oppose all laws at any level of government restricting, registering, or monitoring the ownership, manufacture, or transfer of firearms or ammunition.
  
  2.0 Economic Liberty
  Libertarians want all members of society to have abundant opportunities to achieve economic success. A free and competitive market allocates resources in the most efficient manner. Each person has the right to offer goods and services to others on the free market. The only proper role of government in the economic realm is to protect property rights, adjudicate disputes, and provide a legal framework in which voluntary trade is protected. All efforts by government to redistribute wealth, or to control or manage trade, are improper in a free society. [So no laws dealing with foreign trade. Any country an embargo or tax American goods, but the U.S. government cannot respond to protect American manufacturers or merchants.]
  
  2.1 Property and Contract
  As respect for property rights is fundamental to maintaining a free and prosperous society, it follows that the freedom to contract to obtain, retain, profit from, manage, or dispose of one’s property must also be upheld. Libertarians would free property owners from government restrictions on their rights to control and enjoy their property, as long as their choices do not harm or infringe on the rights of others. Eminent domain, civil asset forfeiture, governmental limits on profits, governmental production mandates, and governmental controls on prices of goods and services (including wages, rents, and interest) are abridgements of such fundamental rights. For voluntary dealings among private entities, parties should be free to choose with whom they trade and set whatever trade terms are mutually agreeable. [So, are DWI laws “unjust” in the eyes of the LP? How about fire codes, building codes, elevator codes, etc.? Presumably no HOA rules or deed covenants either, so my neighbor can live in a rat-infested pig pen and I can’t do anything about it.]
  
  2.2 Environment
  We support a clean and healthy environment and sensible use of our natural resources. Private landowners and conservation groups have a vested interest in maintaining natural resources. Pollution and misuse of resources cause damage to our ecosystem. Governments, unlike private businesses, are unaccountable for such damage done to our environment and have a terrible track record when it comes to environmental protection. Protecting the environment requires a clear definition and enforcement of individual rights in resources like land, water, air, and wildlife. Free markets and property rights stimulate the technological innovations and behavioral changes required to protect our environment and ecosystems. We realize that our planet's climate is constantly changing, but environmental advocates and social pressure are the most effective means of changing public behavior. [This section is pretty much babbling with any substance. However, the highlighted sentences were proven wrong in the early days of the oil industry throughout the country. Nothing changed until the government stepped in.]
  
  2.3 Energy and Resources
  While energy is needed to fuel a modern society, government should not be subsidizing any particular form of energy. We oppose all government control of energy pricing, allocation, and production.
  
  2.4 Government Finance and Spending
  All persons are entitled to keep the fruits of their labor. We call for the repeal of the income tax, the abolishment of the Internal Revenue Service and all federal programs and services not required under the U.S. Constitution. We oppose any legal requirements forcing employers to serve as tax collectors. Government should not incur debt, which burdens future generations without their consent. We support the passage of a "Balanced Budget Amendment" to the U.S. Constitution, provided that the budget is balanced exclusively by cutting expenditures, and not by raising taxes. [Interesting. No taxes, therefore no revenue, but a balanced budget? The military is to protect us, but there will be no funds to support military forces.]
  
  2.5 Money and Financial Markets
  We favor free-market banking, with unrestricted competition among banks and depository institutions of all types. Markets are not actually free unless fraud is vigorously combated and neither profits nor losses are socialized. Individuals engaged in voluntary exchange should be free to use as money any mutually agreeable commodity or item. We support a halt to inflationary monetary policies and unconstitutional legal tender laws.
  
  2.6 Marketplace Freedom
  Libertarians support free markets. We defend the right of individuals to form corporations, cooperatives and other types of entities based on voluntary association. We oppose all forms of government subsidies and bailouts to business, labor, or any other special interest. Government should not compete with private enterprise.
  
  2.7 Labor Markets
  Employment and compensation agreements between private employers and employees are outside the scope of government, and these contracts should not be encumbered by government-mandated benefits or social engineering. We support the right of private employers and employees to choose whether or not to bargain with each other through a labor union. Bargaining should be free of government interference, such as compulsory arbitration or imposing an obligation to bargain.
  
  2.8 Education
  Education is best provided by the free market, achieving greater quality, accountability and efficiency with more diversity of choice. Recognizing that the education of children is a parental responsibility, we would restore authority to parents to determine the education of their children, without interference from government. Parents should have control of and responsibility for all funds expended for their children's education. [More meaningless babble. It means no public education which is so ludicrous that only someone smoking hash could come up with this garbage.]
  
  2.9 Health Care
  We favor a free market health care system. We recognize the freedom of individuals to determine the level of health insurance they want (if any), the level of health care they want, the care providers they want, the medicines and treatments they will use and all other aspects of their medical care, including end-of-life decisions. People should be free to purchase health insurance across state lines.
  
  2.10 Retirement and Income Security
  Retirement planning is the responsibility of the individual, not the government. Libertarians would phase out the current government-sponsored Social Security system and transition to a private voluntary system. The proper and most effective source of help for the poor is the voluntary efforts of private groups and individuals. We believe members of society will become more charitable and civil society will be strengthened as government reduces its activity in this realm. [Read just a few history books and this delusion is quickly dispelled.]
  
  3.0 Securing Liberty
  The protection of individual rights is the only proper purpose of government. Government is constitutionally limited so as to prevent the infringement of individual rights by the government itself. The principle of non-initiation of force should guide the relationships between governments. [More meaningless babble.]
  
  3.1 National Defense
  We support the maintenance of a sufficient military to defend the United States against aggression. The United States should both avoid entangling alliances and abandon its attempts to act as policeman for the world. We oppose any form of compulsory national service. [Perhaps the LP doesn’t realize this is not the 18th century. No U.S. troops, facilities, aircraft or ships outside the U.S. That’s national suicide.]
  
  3.2 Internal Security and Individual Rights
  The defense of the country requires that we have adequate intelligence to detect and to counter threats to domestic security. This requirement must not take priority over maintaining the civil liberties of our citizens. The Constitution and Bill of Rights shall not be suspended even during time of war. Intelligence agencies that legitimately seek to preserve the security of the nation must be subject to oversight and transparency. We oppose the government's use of secret classifications to keep from the public information that it should have, especially that which shows that the government has violated the law. [No classified information? Why have an intelligence agency if everything must be published.]
  
  3.3 International Affairs
  American foreign policy should seek an America at peace with the world. Our foreign policy should emphasize defense against attack from abroad and enhance the likelihood of peace by avoiding foreign entanglements. We would end the current U.S. government policy of foreign intervention, including military and economic aid. We recognize the right of all people to resist tyranny and defend themselves and their rights. We condemn the use of force, and especially the use of terrorism, against the innocent, regardless of whether such acts are committed by governments or by political or revolutionary groups. [These people are flat out crazy! So no alliances, no defense of Israel or any other critical partner.]
  
  3.4 Free Trade and Migration
  We support the removal of governmental impediments to free trade. Political freedom and escape from tyranny demand that individuals not be unreasonably constrained by government in the crossing of political boundaries. Economic freedom demands the unrestricted movement of human as well as financial capital across national borders. However, we support control over the entry into our country of foreign nationals who pose a credible threat to security, health or property. [More lunacy! Open the borders to people and money. Only recently did the LP add the last sentence about keeping out dangerous people, according to their other policies and 3.4, would be impossible.]
  
  3.5 Rights and Discrimination
  Libertarians embrace the concept that all people are born with certain inherent rights. We reject the idea that a natural right can ever impose an obligation upon others to fulfill that "right." We condemn bigotry as irrational and repugnant. Government should neither deny nor abridge any individual's human right based upon sex, wealth, ethnicity, creed, age, national origin, personal habits, political preference or sexual orientation. Members of private organizations retain their rights to set whatever standards of association they deem appropriate, and individuals are free to respond with ostracism, boycotts and other free market solutions. Parents, or other guardians, have the right to raise their children according to their own standards and beliefs. This statement shall not be construed to condone child abuse or neglect.
  
  3.6 Representative Government
  We support election systems that are more representative of the electorate at the federal, state and local levels. As private voluntary groups, political parties should be allowed to establish their own rules for nomination procedures, primaries and conventions. We call for an end to any tax-financed subsidies to candidates or parties and the repeal of all laws which restrict voluntary financing of election campaigns. We oppose laws that effectively exclude alternative candidates and parties, deny ballot access, gerrymander districts, or deny the voters their right to consider all legitimate alternatives. We advocate initiative, referendum, recall and repeal when used as popular checks on government. [The clear motivation for this is the fact that LP candidates typically have so few supporters as to be unable to get on ballots.]
  
  3.7 Self-Determination
  Whenever any form of government becomes destructive of individual liberty, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to agree to such new governance as to them shall seem most likely to protect their liberty.

Now that I've spent an inordinate amount of time dissecting the LP Platform, what parts do you support?

When people take the time to read and learn what the Libertarian Party really is and what it advocates, they run from it like the plague. People who try to make the distinction between Libertarian and libertarian, are making a public relations mistake; you cannot use a name so close to the party and expect to be taken seriously. Come up with a different term -- it's not hard.

Chas.