When 51% isn't 51%

[cb1000rider]

At that point you could go back against the department for false arrest and probably get some restitution, but probably not until you have spent money with your lawyer fighting the invalid charges.

What false arrest? You walked past a red sign. It's not the PDs responsibility to call TABC and check on the sign color. The arrest is a reasonable action in such a circumstance.

Any DA that prosecutes it, however, is a special work of art.

[Keith B]

At that point you could go back against the department for false arrest and probably get some restitution, but probably not until you have spent money with your lawyer fighting the invalid charges.

What false arrest? You walked past a red sign. It's not the PDs responsibility to call TABC and check on the sign color. The arrest is a reasonable action in such a circumstance.

Any DA that prosecutes it, however, is a special work of art.

Actually, I believe it would be false arrest. They may have reasonable suspicion since you walked past the sign, but they can't arrest you on reasonable suspicion, they must have probable cause. I do not believe a sign posted by an owner would constitute valid probable cause as the sign is not a legal document of the true status of the business. That would take looking at the license that is posted or checking with the TABC to see if the establishment really was 51% or not.

[threoh8]

An establishment here had the 51% sign up, even though their license said "Gun sign - blue", confirmed through the TABC website. I reported them through that site and avoided the place for a good while.

Recently went back, and there's the nice, almost inviting blue sign ...

I'm not sure why it was corrected and whether I had anything to do with it, but I'm glad it got fixed.

[nightmare]

What false arrest?

If he wasn't committing a crime it was either false arrest or aggravated kidnapping.

[rc-mike]

Good News! I'm happy to report that the 51% sign is gone. Bob's is now CHL friendly... just don't drink!

-Mike-

[locke_n_load]

Good News! I'm happy to report that the 51% sign is gone. Bob's is now CHL friendly... just don't drink!

-Mike-

Having a drink while carrying is ok. Just don't get intoxicated.

[sugar land dave]

Good News! I'm happy to report that the 51% sign is gone. Bob's is now CHL friendly... just don't drink!

-Mike-

Having a drink while carrying is ok. Just don't get intoxicated.

From the Texas DPS chl website:

Texas Penal Code §46.035 states it is unlawful for an individual who is intoxicated to carry a concealed handgun. The Penal Code defines “intoxicated” as not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, a controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance in the body.

There is no definitive blood alcohol number for when a chl licensee is impaired. Any amount of alcohol combined with concealed carry could result in a bad day. I think most of us on the board believe that.

[sjfcontrol]

Good News! I'm happy to report that the 51% sign is gone. Bob's is now CHL friendly... just don't drink!

-Mike-

Having a drink while carrying is ok. Just don't get intoxicated.

From the Texas DPS chl website:

Texas Penal Code §46.035 states it is unlawful for an individual who is intoxicated to carry a concealed handgun. The Penal Code defines “intoxicated” as not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, a controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance in the body.

There is no definitive blood alcohol number for when a chl licensee is impaired. Any amount of alcohol combined with concealed carry could result in a bad day. I

think most of us on the board believe that.

You think wrong. The definition for intoxicated is the same for carry as it is for driving.

Texas Penal Code Sec. 49.01. (2) “Intoxicated” means:
(A) not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, a controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance into the body;
or
(B) having an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more.
This means that if you have a Blood Alcohol Concentration (BAC) of less than .08, but you are not in the normal use of mental or physical faculties due to alcohol, you may still be considered to be intoxicated.

[Keith B]

Good News! I'm happy to report that the 51% sign is gone. Bob's is now CHL friendly... just don't drink!

-Mike-

Having a drink while carrying is ok. Just don't get intoxicated.

From the Texas DPS chl website:

Texas Penal Code §46.035 states it is unlawful for an individual who is intoxicated to carry a concealed handgun. The Penal Code defines “intoxicated” as not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, a controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance in the body.

There is no definitive blood alcohol number for when a chl licensee is impaired. Any amount of alcohol combined with concealed carry could result in a bad day. I think most of us on the board believe that.

Actually, intoxicated is no different for concealed carry than it is for driving. Intoxicated is defined in TPC 49 and is used for both.

Sec. 49.01. DEFINITIONS. In this chapter:
......................
(2) "Intoxicated" means:
(A) not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, a controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance into the body; or
(B) having an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more.
.....................

So, while I agree that if an officer smells alcohol on your breath and finds you carrying, that you could have some 'spainin to do, but the same could go for driving. It will all depend on how you are acting and if you seem intoxicated to the officer.

[troglodyte]

"Or" is a mighty big word in this case.

[Jumping Frog]

I am fairly confident that it would truly be a case of beating the rap and not the ride.

Or it is a case where "concealed means concealed"!

[Keith B]

"Or" is a mighty big word in this case.

Well, it boils down to two methods. If they do a BAC, and you are .08 or higher, then there is no question you are legally intoxicated. In the other method, it is much tougher to prove you are intoxicated and the prosecutor is going to have to prove in court you were actually intoxicated. This will be through testimony of the arresting officer(s), witnesses and any video and audio recordings they might have. That will be a much tougher road to prosecution that through a BAC.

[troglodyte]

"Or" is a mighty big word in this case.

Well, it boils down to two methods. If they do a BAC, and you are .08 or higher, then there is no question you are legally intoxicated. In the other method, it is much tougher to prove you are intoxicated and the prosecutor is going to have to prove in court you were actually intoxicated. This will be through testimony of the arresting officer(s), witnesses and any video and audio recordings they might have. That will be a much tougher road to prosecution that through a BAC.

I'll go along with that as long as you don't use you firearm. If you pull the trigger on someone justifiably and a witness saw you with a drink or there is the smell on you breath I think the DA is going to have a hayday with you. Seems to be an unnecessary risk to hope you can prove you were not impaired.

[Abraham]

My opinion: Avoid drinking alcohol when carrying.

This is a very small sacrifice.

The enormous negative possibilities with drinking and carrying are for me, far too large.

I can live without a glass of wine or a beer with my meal.

Your waist and wallet will thank you too.

[ScottDLS]

Good News! I'm happy to report that the 51% sign is gone. Bob's is now CHL friendly... just don't drink!

-Mike-

Having a drink while carrying is ok. Just don't get intoxicated.

From the Texas DPS chl website:

Texas Penal Code §46.035 states it is unlawful for an individual who is intoxicated to carry a concealed handgun. The Penal Code defines “intoxicated” as not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, a controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance in the body.

There is no definitive blood alcohol number for when a chl licensee is impaired. Any amount of alcohol combined with concealed carry could result in a bad day. I think most of us on the board believe that.

Any amount and driving could end up in a bad day since the standard for both is exactly the same.