Houston Rodeo BBQ No Carry Allowed?

[Keith B]

Carrying at the State Fair of Texas? Sounds fine to me, but aren't we forbidden to carry in amusement parks?

Frankly, I'm a little confused. I think the DPS FAQ's are out of date. For instance, they way we can't carry on the premises of a hospital or nursing home, but in my CHL class I was told I couldn't carry in a hospital if 30.06 was posted. Odd, that one kind of place would be specifically mentioned as 30.06-compatible, so to speak, but that's what my instructor said.

http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/RSD/CHL/faqs/index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; also says we can't carry at any meeting of a government entity, but I thought meetings like City Council meetings had to have 30.06 posted before we were required to disarm.

I need to do some more reading. In the meantime, I'll err on the side of caution.

An amusement park has a specific requirements in 46.035

(f) In this section:
(1) "Amusement park" means a permanent indoor or outdoor facility or park where amusement rides are available for use by the public that is located in a county with a population of more than one million, encompasses at least 75 acres in surface area, is enclosed with access only through controlled entries, is open for operation more than 120 days in each calendar year, and has security guards on the premises at all times. The term does not include any public or private driveway, street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area.

The State Fair of Texas is not in operation more than 120 days a year.

As for the the FAQ's, yes, they are out of date. See 46.035 (i) that says:

(i) Subsections (b)(4), (b)(5), (b)(6), and (c) do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice under Section 30.06.

So, Hospitals (b)(4), Amusement Parks (b)(5), Churches (b)(6), and Meetings of Government entities (c) must have a 30.06 sign posted to be off limits.

[treadlightly]

Thanks, Keith!

Reassuring, fewer traps out there.

[C-dub]

Thanks, Keith!

Reassuring, fewer traps out there.

And, hopefully, after this session there will be even fewer.

[PaJ]

Just got home for the 3rd day in a row. Had to go ad part of work. I asked the LEO at the tent I was in. He said they were wrong to take away my knife and he didn't know anything about the entire grounds being posted 30.06. He suggested asking for an officer since the people working the metal detectors are minimum wage workers with no training.

I wish I had thought through it better. As said before I was disarming anyway so that didn't bother me. Not asking for clarification on the knife is slightly different, not because of value but principle.

[C-dub]

Just got home for the 3rd day in a row. Had to go ad part of work. I asked the LEO at the tent I was in. He said they were wrong to take away my knife and he didn't know anything about the entire grounds being posted 30.06. He suggested asking for an officer since the people working the metal detectors are minimum wage workers with no training.

I wish I had thought through it better. As said before I was disarming anyway so that didn't bother me. Not asking for clarification on the knife is slightly different, not because of value but principle.

Several of us went through similar junk with the Texas State Fair years ago. I even e-mailed several members of the Dallas City Council at the time and a few responded with questions to clarify and show them the law. I did and I know at least one other person on this forum also did. Possibly many others. It changed dramatically the following year to the disappointment of the Platinum Security folks.

If the place should not be posted due to being owned by the city then it can't hurt to start e-mailing some folks and pointing a few things in the law out to them. It also couldn't hurt to notify the TSRA.

[PaJ]

I just looked at their website concerning entrance security. It says a 30.06 will be posted at entrances. I didn't see it but may have missed it. Here's the link.

http://www.rodeohouston.com/GuestServic ... y-measures" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[TexasCajun]

They may be waiting until the actual rodeo starts to post 30.06. Most people attend the entire event with tickets that allow you into the rodeo/concert as well as the fair and livestock show. So the 30.06 would be an unenforceable reminder that concealed carry at a professional sporting event is prohibited. I suppose that if you buy tickets for only the fair and livestock show then asking for the on duty LEO in charge and showing your chl would be in order.

[jimlongley]

I just looked at their website concerning entrance security. It says a 30.06 will be posted at entrances. I didn't see it but may have missed it. Here's the link.

http://www.rodeohouston.com/GuestServic ... y-measures" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If it's a "professional sporting event" they don't need to post, and if the event isn't happening and the property is not privately owned, they don't get to post.

[Keith B]

I just looked at their website concerning entrance security. It says a 30.06 will be posted at entrances. I didn't see it but may have missed it. Here's the link.

http://www.rodeohouston.com/GuestServic ... y-measures" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Even if the listing is posted at the gates, it just says firearms with an asterisk under the list of prohibited items, and then at the asterisk they have the 30.06 penal code in English only. Not valid by the statute to present it in this way. Must be on a sign with 1" letters in English and Spanish or a card or paper they hand you.

[srothstein]

Keith,

I partly agree and partly disagree. You are correct that the notice must be in English and Spanish. But I disagree with your definition of the way it must be presented. I think the court would find that the web site constitutes "other document" within the meaning of the law. Of course, there is the problem of proving that you in particular saw the web site when you were carrying, but it you admitted to it, I think it would hold up as written notice.

[Keith B]

Keith,

I partly agree and partly disagree. You are correct that the notice must be in English and Spanish. But I disagree with your definition of the way it must be presented. I think the court would find that the web site constitutes "other document" within the meaning of the law. Of course, there is the problem of proving that you in particular saw the web site when you were carrying, but it you admitted to it, I think it would hold up as written notice.

I really wasn't meaning the website Steve. I would tend to agree with you that if you were required to go to the website before being allowed to buy a ticket, and had to post that you agreed to the terms, then yeah, it would be legal.

What I was referring to is they were going to supposedly post the list of prohibited items at the gate in the form it was on the website, which would not be legal without the Spanish and in the right block lettering at least 1".

[C-dub]

If we're talking about notice by way of the website, wouldn't the effective notice of that be even more questionable than a proper 30.06 sign at a door other than the one we entered?

[nightmare]

aren't we forbidden to carry in amusement parks?

Astroworld has been gone ten years but even back when it was in operation it was separate from the BBQ cookoff and livestock show grounds.

[Keith B]

aren't we forbidden to carry in amusement parks?

Astroworld has been gone ten years but even back when it was in operation it was separate from the BBQ cookoff and livestock show grounds.

He was talking about the State Fair being an amusement park.

[J.R.@A&M]

I just looked at their website concerning entrance security. It says a 30.06 will be posted at entrances. I didn't see it but may have missed it. Here's the link.

http://www.rodeohouston.com/GuestServic ... y-measures" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Even if the listing is posted at the gates, it just says firearms with an asterisk under the list of prohibited items, and then at the asterisk they have the 30.06 penal code in English only. Not valid by the statute to present it in this way. Must be on a sign with 1" letters in English and Spanish or a card or paper they hand you.

Just to confirm, there is incomplete and undersized 30.06 signage posted high and to the left, above the booths where we bought our tickets. This is near the westerly entrance to the carnival grounds.