HB195 v. HB??/SB??: Are storm clouds gathering?

[cb1000rider]

As I've said before, the best thing for those that want more firearm restrictions is to get two factions on the other side to in-fight... It's much more effective than any amount of political funding or social agenda.

Charles, one day the OCT/OCTC leadership may change. I hear the frustration with Grisham. If the NRA has already tried reasonable communication, my suggestion would be to hold on and never say never.. Continue to offer a reasonable olive branch consistently and hope that some people can see beyond the point of view of a single person.

[joe817]

I have had time to cool down a bit, so let me explain the problem, then again Charles already did with that very last sentence. If you want to hear Charles, Alice Tripp, and CJ Grisham then feel free to listen to http://GunRightsInTexas.com/010/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (The podcast has since been rebranded from the name used in it).
Compare what CJ says there to the rhetoric he is spewing forth now.

Thanks for posting the podcast link G.A. VERY interesting, educational, and eye opening with regard to the OCT agenda. I'm glad I finally found the time to listen to it & I'm glad I did. Charles and Alice put forth a very compelling presentation on what needs to be done and how.

[infoman]

So I'm a little bit confused on the HB 195. Whether open or concealed carry, I like the fact that there are legal restrictions on who can & cannot carry in public. I like that certain persons are disqualified from this privilage. People who commit crimes, people who get DWI's, etc etc (we all know the current criteria). Also people with certain mental issues. I'm worried that this new bill or possible others like it say that anyone (regardless of background) can openly carry. Am I missing something? I like that applicants must pass a background with DPS before they can be approved. I like that they run their fingerprints. I don't like the idea of just anyone being able to carry in public, regardless of their background.

[Maxwell]

So I'm a little bit confused on the HB 195. Whether open or concealed carry, I like the fact that there are legal restrictions on who can & cannot carry in public. I like that certain persons are disqualified from this privilage. People who commit crimes, people who get DWI's, etc etc (we all know the current criteria). Also people with certain mental issues. I'm worried that this new bill or possible others like it say that anyone (regardless of background) can openly carry. Am I missing something? I like that applicants must pass a background with DPS before they can be approved. I like that they run their fingerprints. I don't like the idea of just anyone being able to carry in public, regardless of their background.

I tend to agree. What are we missing?

[RoyGBiv]

I don't like the idea of just anyone being able to carry in public, regardless of their background.

Think about it this way...... The subset of people that you're worried about don't care whether they need "permission" to carry. They carry anyway. If you keep some required licensing, you won't be preventing those people from carrying. License requirements only limit the law-abiding.

[Charles L. Cotton]

As I've said, something tells me two more open-carry bills are going to be filed; one in the House and one in the Senate. Like licensed open-carry bills already filed, these also will be licensed open-carry. Rep. Stickland has filed HB195 that would remove the requirement to obtain a CHL to carry openly or concealed. HB195 certainly faces an uphill battle.

Radical open-carry supporters will obviously promote HB195, as will I, but with amendments to remove off-limits areas for CHLs. However, my concern is that radical open-carry supporters will not be content with supporting and promoting HB195 and that they will viciously attack NRA/TSRA open-carry bills and their authors, co-authors and supporters. They have vowed to do precisely this. As I've said before, OCT and OCTC don't have any political clout nor can they impact any elections. However, they have proven themselves to be masters at getting negative, counterproductive publicity and if they lash out at pro-gun people they falsely label as anti-gun simply because they support NRA/TSRA open-carry bills, then the political stench they create could doom passage of any form of open-carry. I don't doubt that this is what the leaders prefer, i.e. their way or no way, but I'm equally convinced that all but a small handful of zealots want to see some form of open-carry pass in 2015.

Anyone who wants to see open-carry pass needs to 1) keep emotions in check; 2) support HB195 and the NRA/TSRA bills; 3) communicate their bill preference to their elected officials (when calls-to-action are issued); be willing to vigorously support the NRA/TSRA bills; and 5) be very respectful to all elected officials. This will fall on some deaf ears, but hopefully most people will be heed this warning and avoid what would be a very damaging unlicensed v. licensed war.

Chas.

Any idea when those bills will be filed Charles? It will be great to see all the bills out in the open so we can compare, ask for revisions on the ones closest to our goals, then voice our support for 2, possibly 3 bills when the time gets close to put our weight behind.
I don't want to see the pro 2A crowd continue to be fragmented so that we don't get anything passed. There are so many good people here, we just all need to push in the same direction.

I do not expect to see them pre-filed. It should be shortly after the session begins.

Chas.

[Charles L. Cotton]

As I've said, something tells me two more open-carry bills are going to be filed; one in the House and one in the Senate. Like licensed open-carry bills already filed, these also will be licensed open-carry. Rep. Stickland has filed HB195 that would remove the requirement to obtain a CHL to carry openly or concealed. HB195 certainly faces an uphill battle.

Radical open-carry supporters will obviously promote HB195, as will I, but with amendments to remove off-limits areas for CHLs. However, my concern is that radical open-carry supporters will not be content with supporting and promoting HB195 and that they will viciously attack NRA/TSRA open-carry bills and their authors, co-authors and supporters. They have vowed to do precisely this. As I've said before, OCT and OCTC don't have any political clout nor can they impact any elections. However, they have proven themselves to be masters at getting negative, counterproductive publicity and if they lash out at pro-gun people they falsely label as anti-gun simply because they support NRA/TSRA open-carry bills, then the political stench they create could doom passage of any form of open-carry. I don't doubt that this is what the leaders prefer, i.e. their way or no way, but I'm equally convinced that all but a small handful of zealots want to see some form of open-carry pass in 2015.

Anyone who wants to see open-carry pass needs to 1) keep emotions in check; 2) support HB195 and the NRA/TSRA bills; 3) communicate their bill preference to their elected officials (when calls-to-action are issued); be willing to vigorously support the NRA/TSRA bills; and 5) be very respectful to all elected officials. This will fall on some deaf ears, but hopefully most people will be heed this warning and avoid what would be a very damaging unlicensed v. licensed war.

Chas.

Chas will any of these include a provision whereby OC is limited via a 30.06 sign?

Absolutely not!

Chas.

[Charles L. Cotton]

Charles, I believe you've written this elsewhere, but can you give some insight into how supporting open carry in Texas this session will not result in the infringement on our already restricted concealed carry rights? I'm pretty sure we all agree that the antics of OCT have unwittingly made a lot of businesses decide to post their stores under 30.06.

I support open carry, but I would rather see the restrictions on concealed carry rolled back vs. getting open carry on the books. Having open and concealed carry with restrictions is less appealing when compared with the possibility of concealed carry and no/or fewer restrictions. Campus carry, I believe, is a bigger deal than open carry. Just my two cents of course.

Thanks

Open-carry will not involve additional legal restrictions on CHL, nor will TPC §30.06 apply to both open and concealed carry. We would never let concealed-carry be harmed by open-carry in terms of legislative restrictions. Whether stores post signs that apply only to open-carry (either TPC §30.05 signs, or a new §30.07 sign) is an open question.

Chas.

[CoffeeNut]

Charles, out of curiosity would you ever open carry?

On another note I posted something on Twitter relating to guns and Texas and CJ decided to follow me. I couldn't block the man fast enough.

[Charles L. Cotton]

So I'm a little bit confused on the HB 195. Whether open or concealed carry, I like the fact that there are legal restrictions on who can & cannot carry in public. I like that certain persons are disqualified from this privilage. People who commit crimes, people who get DWI's, etc etc (we all know the current criteria). Also people with certain mental issues. I'm worried that this new bill or possible others like it say that anyone (regardless of background) can openly carry. Am I missing something? I like that applicants must pass a background with DPS before they can be approved. I like that they run their fingerprints. I don't like the idea of just anyone being able to carry in public, regardless of their background.

If HB195 passes, then anyone who is not prohibited from possessing firearms under state or federal law will be able to carry openly or concealed. That means felons won't be carrying guns, nor will people who have misdemeanor domestic violence convictions.

I understand your concerns, but we now have a 7 year track record with unlicensed car-carry (2007 HB1815 - Motorist Protection Act) that should give some comfort. We heard the same parade of horribles about HB1815 as we did when SB60 passed in 1995 establishing our CHL statute. As with CHL, the Motorist Protection Act has not resulted in any of the problems the anti-gunners shouted from the rooftops. Unlicensed carry has not proven to be a problem in the few other states that allow it, so that adds a bit more comfort.

Most crimes are committed by repeat offenders and a very large percentage of them will be convicted felons, meaning they cannot legally carry. HB195 faces an uphill battle, but there may be no better session to make an attempt.

Chas.

[Charles L. Cotton]

Charles, out of curiosity would you ever open carry?

I can't imagine me doing so outside of a hunting environment and perhaps when pumping gas into my car. I will never walk into store, restaurant, etc. openly carrying a gun. Well, I need to back off of that just a bit. I did confess that I might decide to wear a Colt SAA in a great looking western rig on the day the Houston Livestock Show & Rodeo parade is held each year. I'd fit right in with the rest of the cowpokes.

Chas.

[mr1337]

So I'm a little bit confused on the HB 195. Whether open or concealed carry, I like the fact that there are legal restrictions on who can & cannot carry in public. I like that certain persons are disqualified from this privilage. People who commit crimes, people who get DWI's, etc etc (we all know the current criteria). Also people with certain mental issues. I'm worried that this new bill or possible others like it say that anyone (regardless of background) can openly carry. Am I missing something? I like that applicants must pass a background with DPS before they can be approved. I like that they run their fingerprints. I don't like the idea of just anyone being able to carry in public, regardless of their background.

I tend to agree. What are we missing?

People who can't open carry are already prohibited from owning firearms.

[CoffeeNut]

Charles, out of curiosity would you ever open carry?

I can't imagine me doing so outside of a hunting environment and perhaps when pumping gas into my car. I will never walk into store, restaurant, etc. openly carrying a gun. Well, I need to back off of that just a bit. I did confess that I might decide to wear a Colt SAA in a great looking western rig on the day the Houston Livestock Show & Rodeo parade is held each year. I'd fit right in with the rest of the cowpokes.

Chas.

That's probably the best reason to open carry. To show off a beautiful Colt SAA!

I like the idea for pumping gas as well. I've done the OC thing in New Mexico and didn't like that I had to really keep my head on a constant swivel. I ended up just re-concealing it even though I had no problems and no one seemed to notice. I can see some instances where it would be useful but they're few and far between. Any good bill will get my support however.

[anygunanywhere]

Charles, out of curiosity would you ever open carry?

I can't imagine me doing so outside of a hunting environment and perhaps when pumping gas into my car. I will never walk into store, restaurant, etc. openly carrying a gun. Well, I need to back off of that just a bit. I did confess that I might decide to wear a Colt SAA in a great looking western rig on the day the Houston Livestock Show & Rodeo parade is held each year. I'd fit right in with the rest of the cowpokes.

Chas.

Not even to a BBQ with a fancy 1911 and dressy gun leather to match your gun belt and boots?

[Charles L. Cotton]

Charles, out of curiosity would you ever open carry?

I can't imagine me doing so outside of a hunting environment and perhaps when pumping gas into my car. I will never walk into store, restaurant, etc. openly carrying a gun. Well, I need to back off of that just a bit. I did confess that I might decide to wear a Colt SAA in a great looking western rig on the day the Houston Livestock Show & Rodeo parade is held each year. I'd fit right in with the rest of the cowpokes.

Chas.

Not even to a BBQ with a fancy 1911 and dressy gun leather to match your gun belt and boots?

Okay, maybe on two occasions.

Chas.