Spokane WA: Manslaughter charge in stolen car shooting

[sodchemist]

here is the criminal's obituary (the first criminal, perhaps, if you are inclined to think of it that way). the details of this obituary might not mean much to you, but i grew up in spokane and also went to mead high school (one of the best in the state). it is sad that this guy stole the old car and lost his life over it. his father (Brian) was also arrested for stealing a police car after his son was killed.

KALUZA- GRAHAM, Brendon Tyler (Age 25) Passed away March 25, 2013, way too young. Born in Spokane, WA on October 16, 1987 to Angela Graham and Brian Kaluza. Brendon graduated from All Saints Grade School, attended high school in the Mead School district and also studied at SCC. He enjoyed playing sports, especially baseball. He loved camping at Priest Lake and traveling many places with his family. He was an avid reader, especially history and other non-fiction. He liked working and skiing with his Grandpa and fishing with Dad and brothers. He was a talented landscaper who took great pride in his work. Brendon was very involved with his big family and was really good with the little ones. Brendon is survived by Mother, Angie (Graham) Jenkins and father, Brian Kaluza. Siblings include Connor, Allyson, Ryan Kaluza and Garrett Graham. Grandparents are Yvette and Bob Graham, Ann and Mike Kaluza. He is also greatly missed by many aunts, uncles and cousins. A memorial service and celebration of his life for family and friends, will be held at St. Mark’s Lutheran Church, 24th and Grand Ave, Spokane WA. The family would respectfully accept contributions to Brendon’s memorial or a charity of your choice.

[baldeagle]

I am seeing a trend.

Call it the Zimmerman Trend if you like.

Some people in America (I include prosecutors in this ) have a belief that, death or injury by a citizen is not the appropriate punishment for a crime. That the life of a criminal is important. Important enough to save from harm while they are committing their crime.

Stopping a crime is not worth the life or injury of a criminal. A criminal's life is too important.

Citizens have no right to stop a crime in progress, even if it is against them. They must wait for the police and (if they are alive) go through the proper legal channels to seek redress.

These Americans believe that criminals have rights, those rights must be upheld. The rights of an honest citizen is secondary. Criminals have a right to be rehabilitated by society, no matter their crime.

To me, this explains this and other similar incidents that have recently occurred.

Fortunately this is still not the case in Texas, yet.

You are absolutely correct. It doesn't matter what the law says if the state can prosecute you anyway. They can destroy your life with impunity, even if you're found not guilty as Zimmerman was.

[VMI77]

I am seeing a trend.

Call it the Zimmerman Trend if you like.

Some people in America (I include prosecutors in this ) have a belief that, death or injury by a citizen is not the appropriate punishment for a crime. That the life of a criminal is important. Important enough to save from harm while they are committing their crime.

Stopping a crime is not worth the life or injury of a criminal. A criminal's life is too important.

Citizens have no right to stop a crime in progress, even if it is against them. They must wait for the police and (if they are alive) go through the proper legal channels to seek redress.

These Americans believe that criminals have rights, those rights must be upheld. The rights of an honest citizen is secondary. Criminals have a right to be rehabilitated by society, no matter their crime.

To me, this explains this and other similar incidents that have recently occurred.

Fortunately this is still not the case in Texas, yet.

It's the British disease.

[VMI77]

here is the criminal's obituary (the first criminal, perhaps, if you are inclined to think of it that way). the details of this obituary might not mean much to you, but i grew up in spokane and also went to mead high school (one of the best in the state). it is sad that this guy stole the old car and lost his life over it. his father (Brian) was also arrested for stealing a police car after his son was killed.

KALUZA- GRAHAM, Brendon Tyler (Age 25) Passed away March 25, 2013, way too young. Born in Spokane, WA on October 16, 1987 to Angela Graham and Brian Kaluza. Brendon graduated from All Saints Grade School, attended high school in the Mead School district and also studied at SCC. He enjoyed playing sports, especially baseball. He loved camping at Priest Lake and traveling many places with his family. He was an avid reader, especially history and other non-fiction. He liked working and skiing with his Grandpa and fishing with Dad and brothers. He was a talented landscaper who took great pride in his work. Brendon was very involved with his big family and was really good with the little ones. Brendon is survived by Mother, Angie (Graham) Jenkins and father, Brian Kaluza. Siblings include Connor, Allyson, Ryan Kaluza and Garrett Graham. Grandparents are Yvette and Bob Graham, Ann and Mike Kaluza. He is also greatly missed by many aunts, uncles and cousins. A memorial service and celebration of his life for family and friends, will be held at St. Mark’s Lutheran Church, 24th and Grand Ave, Spokane WA. The family would respectfully accept contributions to Brendon’s memorial or a charity of your choice.

And all he had to do was not steal a car.

[magicglock]

We can argue GZ and the law all day and opinions will vary. GZ legally did nothing wrong. Depending on state law, this guy may or may not have done anything illegal. Bottom line is that use of force was not required in either case if they would have followed one rule, be a good witness. This one should have filed an insurance claim. The political trend is only aided by the stupidity of those who can't stand to just be a witness. And we wonder why CHL badges get sold?

[cb1000rider]

philip,
You gave a pretty dramatic portrayal there.. I'll tell you what I believe and this may or may not change how you see it.

Some people in America (I include prosecutors in this ) have a belief that, death or injury by a citizen is not the appropriate punishment for a crime. That the life of a criminal is important. Important enough to save from harm while they are committing their crime.

Consider this: What if you catch someone stealing beer out of your garage? Could be a 14 year old kid or an 18 year old adult. Are you willing to cause death or injury to stop that crime? I'm not. Legally, there might be defense from prosecution there, but it's not worth it to me.

Does this mean you can have all the free beer you want out of my garage? Sure. If you can get past the fence, the German Shepherd, and the security cameras. I won't shoot you for stealing beer with my gun. I might or might not stop you by other means.

Stopping a crime is not worth the life or injury of a criminal. A criminal's life is too important.

Here's where we get a little wonky. I've got some respect for life, even for the life of a criminal. Some more than others. Kids, especially, do stupid stuff, myself included. It's not my job to figure out which people are good and which people are bad.

However, it's not that I consider a "criminal's life" too important. It's simply that I'm selfish and consider my life too important. I'm too important to be put on trial in front of the media. My family is too important to have our financial resources exhausted by the legal system. I personally am too important to be put in front of a jury that just might decide, regardless of the law, that shooting someone for stealing something isn't an action that they're willing to excuse.

Citizens have no right to stop a crime in progress, even if it is against them. They must wait for the police and (if they are alive) go through the proper legal channels to seek redress.
These Americans believe that criminals have rights, those rights must be upheld. The rights of an honest citizen is secondary. Criminals have a right to be rehabilitated by society, no matter their crime.
To me, this explains this and other similar incidents that have recently occurred.
Fortunately this is still not the case in Texas, yet.

I've seen various cases in Texas where people are prosecuted for stopping or attempting to stop a crime in progress. Again, it's not that I think it's unjust to stop a crime against someone else's property, it's just that it incurs too much personal risk.

No one really believes that the rights of a criminal dominate the rights of honest citizens. That may be the way things fall due to our legal system or some of the fears that I bring up above.

Texas has the dealth penalty. Factually, these are criminals that the justice system isn't trying to rehabilitate. As such, not all have the right to rehabilitation regardless of crime.. Besides, does anyone really think our criminal justice system rehabilitates anyone?

I do get the point that you're trying to make. I can just tell you that it's our legal system that has responsibility in root cause. It's not just a "liberal" or backwards thinking society.

[VMI77]

No one really believes that the rights of a criminal dominate the rights of honest citizens. That may be the way things fall due to our legal system or some of the fears that I bring up above.

Sorry, but you're just wrong on this count. The left does indeed believe it and it was the status quo in the former Soviet Union. Collectivists believe the honest citizens are the cause of crime, by victimizing those of the lower classes, and causing them to be criminals, and they definitely believe, as victims, that their rights are superior to the rights of honest citizens. The once Great Britain is an example of this ideology in action.

[JSThane]

Bottom line is, know what is legal, and know what you're willing to go to jail over. The two sometimes cross over more than what one might expect.

If you're willing to go to jail over a car, no matter how righteous your case, that's fine. You are assuming the risk of prosecution, just as the thief assumed the risk of airborne lead.

If you're not willing to defend your property, that's fine. It's your property, and your right to decide if it's worth possible prosecution over.

If you're not willing to defend yourself, that's also fine. Your life is your property, and it's your right to defend it or not.

I have no sympathy for the car thief. He assumed the risk when he took the car. Reasonable use of force or not, people DO defend property with violence, and he chose to commit theft any way. His life, his choice.

I have some sympathy for the car owner and shooter. He may be in a completely legally defensible situation, and still get railroaded with charges. I sympathize too, in that he decided his property was worth fighting for. That is his right, as is his right to face the consequences of the fight. If his actions were truly legal per Washington State laws, I wish him well in his defense.

That being said, I doubt I'd be willing to pull the trigger in this situation myself. I like my car. I really like my car. But it's not worth -that- much to me, regardless of legality of the use of force. And that is my right.

[cb1000rider]

Sorry, but you're just wrong on this count. The left does indeed believe it and it was the status quo in the former Soviet Union. Collectivists believe the honest citizens are the cause of crime, by victimizing those of the lower classes, and causing them to be criminals, and they definitely believe, as victims, that their rights are superior to the rights of honest citizens. The once Great Britain is an example of this ideology in action.

VM,
You've already called me a Collectivist. You've called me liberal (left).
I'm telling you that I don't believe any of those things. Either stop labeling me or stop telling me what I believe. You get to pick one, not both.

[VMI77]

Sorry, but you're just wrong on this count. The left does indeed believe it and it was the status quo in the former Soviet Union. Collectivists believe the honest citizens are the cause of crime, by victimizing those of the lower classes, and causing them to be criminals, and they definitely believe, as victims, that their rights are superior to the rights of honest citizens. The once Great Britain is an example of this ideology in action.

VM,
You've already called me a Collectivist. You've called me liberal (left).
I'm telling you that I don't believe any of those things. Either stop labeling me or stop telling me what I believe. You get to pick one, not both.

Well, I suppose you can logically make that linkage, but my intent was merely to point out that there are people who do indeed place more value on the life of a criminal (besides the criminals themselves that is). And just as there are left-wing gun nuts, I'm sure there are at least some collectivists and liberals who don't place that value. More specifically, when I make this kind of general political statement I'm talking about the leadership. Most followers of any ideology don't really understand the ideology itself, they just want to be part of the tribe.