Running Serial Numbers of weapons of CHL holders.

[Richard_B]

Do they also run VIN numbers to be certain the vehicle being driven by the CHL holder isn't stolen?

EXCELLENT POINT

Some times, but usually if the plate and vehicle match and comes up clean then the suspicion is less that the vehicle may stolen.

As to the serial number running, I believe it is a stretch for a LEO to take it there, even after disarming a CHL for there own perceived safety. What needs to be done is get rid of the disarming capability and the serial number running will go away also. A few well stated letters to the DA of the county and talk of civil rights violations may also get this type of 'papiere bitte' tactics stopped.

It seems to me that, absent authority to do so, a DPS Trooper is prohibited from doing so. It also seems that the Governor or Attorney General could probably prohibit the practice.

[C-dub]

As it always does, such a suggestion brings out the.... If a person has a CHL, but they place the gun in the center console. .. Is that gun in the car covered under MPA or CHL?.. Can I say MPA and not inform an officer when contacted and asked for ID?.. but then later if I get out, take the gun, place it in my holster and be covered by my CHL?

.

It doesn't matter whether the gun is in the console or on your person while in the car. If you have a CHL you are required to identify that you have a CHL when you are asked to identify yourself.

Then again, there is no penalty if you don't.

No sir, I would have to disagree .

That is not what the law requires..
"GC §411.205. REQUIREMENT TO DISPLAY LICENSE. (a) If a license holder is carrying a handgun on or about the license holder's person when a magistrate or a peace officer demands that the license holder display identification, the license holder shall display both the license holder's driver's license or identification certificate issued by the department and the license holder's handgun license."

And still it is a chicken or the egg deal....
If MPA is law and what is in place for chl is an exception to the law as has been theorized.... Then MPA is valid before CHL stuff even comes into play.

IANAL
SO until a test case hits the courts, it,s just opinions.

That's an interesting position to take. Disagree with someone that says if the gun is in the center console of the vehicle that you must still show your license and then as evidence quote a statute that says, "on or about the license holder's person." Isn't the center console about one's person when they are in the car?

[C-dub]

As it always does, such a suggestion brings out the.... If a person has a CHL, but they place the gun in the center console. .. Is that gun in the car covered under MPA or CHL?.. Can I say MPA and not inform an officer when contacted and asked for ID?.. but then later if I get out, take the gun, place it in my holster and be covered by my CHL?

.

It doesn't matter whether the gun is in the console or on your person while in the car. If you have a CHL you are required to identify that you have a CHL when you are asked to identify yourself.

Then again, there is no penalty if you don't.

No sir, I would have to disagree .

That is not what the law requires..
"GC §411.205. REQUIREMENT TO DISPLAY LICENSE. (a) If a license holder is carrying a handgun on or about the license holder's person when a magistrate or a peace officer demands that the license holder display identification, the license holder shall display both the license holder's driver's license or identification certificate issued by the department and the license holder's handgun license."

And still it is a chicken or the egg deal....
If MPA is law and what is in place for chl is an exception to the law as has been theorized.... Then MPA is valid before CHL stuff even comes into play.

IANAL
SO until a test case hits the courts, it,s just opinions.

The law requires display of the license REGARDLESS of which law (MPA or CHL) the handgun is being carried under. If you're armed, and a LEO asks for ID, you need to display the license.

As long as they actually do have a CHL, right? I'm still waiting for some case law on someone trying to claim they're carrying under the MPA when they have a CHL and it's a prohibited place for a CHL, but not for someone carrying under the MPA.

[TexasCajun]

I could be wrong (it's happened quite a bit since I've joined this board), but I believe "on or about your person" is anywhere within your reach. So carrying in the center console would require you to show your CHL & inform the officer that you are armed. But, as already has been stated, there's no official penalty for not showing the CHL. That's not to say that not showing the liens wouldn't set an unpleasant tone for the rest out the stop, though.

[TexasCajun]

Did a search and found this thread....



Is the best eay to handle this to avoid serial numbers being ran.. When you see the blue and reds behind you. Just unholster and stick your gun in a safe place under your seat etc? Then you are not armed if pulled over?????

Ive had my serial number ran twice out of 5 stops. I only get warnings tho:-). Still i dont like the snooping. Same reason i tell them now when they ask to look inside. I feel like we should have the right to say no to a serial search...


So is disarming while being pulled over but before leo gets to your window the answer to noot getting disarmed or sn ran?

I think that all of the extra movement necessary for what you suggest could raise the leo's alert & cause the stop to go south in a hurry. Especially since you'd be trying to hide a firearm.

[sjfcontrol]

You are considered armed if the firearm is on or about your person. In a car, this is typically considered the "lunge area". If you were to lock it in your trunk, then you would most likely be considered unarmed. But it's not likely that an officer would allow you to do that.

[Ziran]

It is much easier and safer to "shake down" some honest citizens and make yourself look like you are tough on crime. Going after hardened criminals on the other hand is hard and dangerous work.

[LSUTiger]

Do they also run VIN numbers to be certain the vehicle being driven by the CHL holder isn't stolen?

EXCELLENT POINT

I am sure it's a point the anti-gun crowd will make when they try to argue this. They can run my VIN, no problem. I don't wan't them running the serial no. off my gun. It's not my car they want to confiscate.

Serial number gets run, goes into a database so they know where to look to confiscate it later. Same as registration.

[MeMelYup]

The question is why are they checking CHL's for stolen guns? I wonder how many they have found.

[jmra]

The question is why are they checking CHL's for stolen guns? I wonder how many they have found.

I was told by an LEO once that he believes by running the gun through the system he is providing a service for the CHL holder who might have unintentionally purchased a stolen gun.

[texanjoker]

Do they also run VIN numbers to be certain the vehicle being driven by the CHL holder isn't stolen?

EXCELLENT POINT

I am sure it's a point the anti-gun crowd will make when they try to argue this. They can run my VIN, no problem. I don't wan't them running the serial no. off my gun. It's not my car they want to confiscate.

Serial number gets run, goes into a database so they know where to look to confiscate it later. Same as registration.

When you run a gun it is a serial number check only.. No names, ect are input with the inquiry.

[HK_USP_45]

I will preface this by saying I was a Texas peace officer for 35+ years. I stop you for some traffic offense and determine you have a CHL (you show it or TCIC indicates it). So I asked about the weapon. I ask you to hand over the weapon for my safety. I have already (or will) run your DL and the car registration to verify if it is accurate and current. Why, because I witnessed you using those things. In doing so, I automatically get a warrant check on you and a stolen vehicle check on the car. If all that checks out, I should issue a warning (writen or verbal) or citation on the traffic offense, return your weapon and cut you loose.

But, I decide to run the weapon to see if it is stolen. I didn't observe you using the weapon. The weapon has no connection to the offense for which you were detained. You complied with the law and showed valid authorization to have the weapon in your possession. I know the CHL is valid and current and yours because I have a DL to go with it.

You have a laptop in your car. Why don't I run the serial number on that? Might be stolen. You have a Rolex watch on. Why not run the serial number on that? Why not ask to see all the money in your wallet to make sure none of it is counterfeit? Maybe run the serial number of your car radio. Ask to see the receipt for all the stuff you have in those Target bags in the back seat. Run all your credit cards.

Point is why would I single out one object in your possession over all others that have the same chance of being illegal in some respect or other? If it is doing you a favor to make sure your gun is not stolen, why not go all the way and run everything in your possession with a number in the name of customer service?

I believe most of this is inspired by cops (or their supervisors) that are not happy with citizens being allowed to carry a weapon. Just my 2 cents. But, I wouldn't push the issue on the street. I would comply and then write a letter or consult an attorney.