Eliminate Property Taxes?
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
personally, if I were in charge of developing some sort of "public" education....and yes as a homeschooler I do understand that not everyone can do it....there are some situations that simply don't allow for it....so anyway, if I were to develope a plan, I would develope "neighborhood" schools, a very small school in each subdivision, every few blocks, small schools; several rooms, personal attention, parental involvement sports and such would be held with several schools or something like that.
yep, I'm a homeschooler, can you tell?
yep, I'm a homeschooler, can you tell?
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
JALLEN and SewTexas make good points:
In a word, it is about "accountability". In two words, it's about "responsible accountability". In a half dozen or so words, "I ain't responsible for your kids".
Here endeth the lesson. Shabbot Shalom!
In a word, it is about "accountability". In two words, it's about "responsible accountability". In a half dozen or so words, "I ain't responsible for your kids".
Here endeth the lesson. Shabbot Shalom!
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
Property taxes are based on the assessed value, which is calculated using a number of factors such as "comparable sales" (similar properties in similar locations), new construction cost per square foot, size of lot, added value such as pools, privacy fencing, shop buildings, etc...but comparable sales is the top factor. Theoretically, the appraisal SHOULD be the actual market value based on that data for the previous 12 month period, and in an "up market", the appraised value will increase from year to year as the market value goes up. The sales prices you see on realtors websites are NOT calculated by property taxes, but by what they believe the current market value to be...otherwise, the values would never change up or down. I just saw a friends house in Austin that had two offers OVER the asking price in the first 2 days it was listed for sale...that property's appraisal will obviously go up next year when the new sales data is calculated into the appraisal. In a "down market", like what the country has seen the last few years, the County Appraisal District will not usualy lower your appraisal unless you file a protest and request a hearing, where you can present evidence to the Appraisal Board members to demonstrate that your taxable value should be lowered. The purchase price paid years ago has ZERO bearing on the appraised taxable value. The only way you could see a big increase from the value of an estate would be that a persons tax RATE is locked in at whatever it is when they turn 65..they don't stop paying the taxes...their rate just doesn't increase from that point forward. About the only way I could envision a property increasing from $10k to $650k upon death would be if someone had a house on acreage and the land had previously been taxed as agricultural, but at time of death was determined to currently have greatly increased value as commercial property do to its location. I'm not a realtor, but I have considerable experience dealing with property taxes and the Appraisal District Boards.WildBill wrote:I am not familar with the details Texas property taxes, but over a period of time the assessed values go up when average sales prices increase for a certain area. The assessed values are usually a certain percentage of the market actual value. The sales prices that you see on realtor websites are calculated by the property taxes. Perhaps one of the realtors on the forum can explain it better than me.Topbuilder wrote:In my dealings with real estate and property, you are charged based on the county assessed value. There is no connection between the sale price and the county figure unless you protest and use that to make your case. The county is not supposed to have access to the actual sale price. The county recorded deed says "10 and no/100 dollars"WildBill wrote:But a change in ownership requires the new owner to pay higher taxes the next year based on the new sales price, correct? That is my point.sunny beach wrote:Property taxes are paid for a full year in Texas. A change in ownership doesn't require paying for the same year twice.WildBill wrote:My parents bought their house for $10,000 and paid property tax based on that value. When my mother died the house was worth $650,000. That was below the one million for the death tax, so we didn't have to pay that, but we did have to pay property tax on a $650K house, rather than a 10K house.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
I'm wondering how many of the people who responded asking how they would make up the revenue actually took the time to click on the link and read the article. The linked website spells out pretty well how they will replace the income - and it's NOT with a state income tax.
They would eliminate property taxes. Additionally, they would eliminate state corporate taxes.
They would replace it with an increase in the state sales tax, keeping the combination of state/city/local taxes in the single digits. They would also implement a state version of the fair tax on businesses to replace the corporate tax.
They would then send a percentage of the taxes collected to the State so the State can fund its constitutionally required functions. All remaining collected taxes would remain at the local/county level, for the local government to use. This replaces all taxes going to the State and the State then redistributing money to the counties.
Regarding education funding, the article says this:
They would eliminate property taxes. Additionally, they would eliminate state corporate taxes.
They would replace it with an increase in the state sales tax, keeping the combination of state/city/local taxes in the single digits. They would also implement a state version of the fair tax on businesses to replace the corporate tax.
They would then send a percentage of the taxes collected to the State so the State can fund its constitutionally required functions. All remaining collected taxes would remain at the local/county level, for the local government to use. This replaces all taxes going to the State and the State then redistributing money to the counties.
Regarding education funding, the article says this:
Our draft legislation (written during the 82nd legislative session in 2011) calls on the comptroller to determine which portion of the new taxes are necessary to provide revenue neutral funding to meet the state’s constitutional obligations to fund public education and then allocates the additional revenue back to local government. It is believed that this state-wide funding mechanism would provide adequate support of the foundation school program and finally put to rest litigation challenging public education funding. It further provides a means for local, independent school districts to fund enrichment programs at the local level as determined by parents and local communities.
The remainder of the tax (that above what is necessary to fund public schools) becomes a local tax much like there is a local component to the sales tax in Texas. That local tax revenue will be available to and appropriated at the local level, not Robin Hooded out of Austin. This tenant of the plan is a huge victory for local control and effectively eliminates the Robin Hooding taking place with tax dollars in Austin today.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
The Texas Supreme Court has ruled the property tax unconstitutional twice, in 1995 and 2005, IIRC, on the basis that that way it is structured now in relation to educational mandates constitutes a statewide ad valorem property tax.
How they would replace the revenue is mostly irrelevant. If it's unconstitutional, it's unconstitutional and needs to go. Making the government live within it's means, reducing the scope of public education back to education itself, and restoring local funding and oversight to public education would all have to take place as a matter of course. Public education has extended itself so far beyond the "general diffusion of knowledge" required constitutionally that it has even failed at that minimum standard.
How they would replace the revenue is mostly irrelevant. If it's unconstitutional, it's unconstitutional and needs to go. Making the government live within it's means, reducing the scope of public education back to education itself, and restoring local funding and oversight to public education would all have to take place as a matter of course. Public education has extended itself so far beyond the "general diffusion of knowledge" required constitutionally that it has even failed at that minimum standard.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
Good post!reverendxlt wrote:The Texas Supreme Court has ruled the property tax unconstitutional twice, in 1995 and 2005, IIRC, on the basis that that way it is structured now in relation to educational mandates constitutes a statewide ad valorem property tax.
How they would replace the revenue is mostly irrelevant. If it's unconstitutional, it's unconstitutional and needs to go. Making the government live within it's means, reducing the scope of public education back to education itself, and restoring local funding and oversight to public education would all have to take place as a matter of course. Public education has extended itself so far beyond the "general diffusion of knowledge" required constitutionally that it has even failed at that minimum standard.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
I would love a property tax free State for several reasons, first the property taxes are so arbitrary where if you want to live in the city and not spend hours driving to work and back you have to pay more, not only that I hate having a large percentage of my taxes go to pay for schools free education in America my ass, we pay for the rest of our lives even if you dont have kids which ends up being quite an expensive education in my book, secondly you have to fight the freakin city every couple of years by going down and protesting your tax rate at the local tax office otherwise they will raise your taxes ridiculous amounts and their valuations are very skewed for the homes in your area and very arbitrary. Secondly, the government should never have the right to take away your home, the bank is the only one you should have to be a slave to until you pay off your house and even that I hate. At least with a sales tax you know exactly how much you are paying and everyone pays the same amount accross the board. The death/estate tax is completely unconstitutional and illegal and should have been overruled by the supreme court years ago as this is a double tax, the taxes have already been paid on the house that your parents owned and shouldnt be taxed again period. I would love to see this happen in Texas although i am considering a move to Alabama partially because the property taxes there are much lower. The problem is that I doubt they can do it honestly. Back when they voted in the Lottery, they said it was going to go to pay school taxes. I dont believe it ever went to pay school taxes as we are still paying school taxes at high levels today. So basically the government lies in everything and about everything so I would be surpised if they ever did anything properly and honestly.
Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
It is not double taxed. Yes the money your parents earned was taxed as income to them when they earned it. However when they die and it goes to you then it becomes income to you as yet untaxed by you. You were not in posession of the money or property till their death so now that you have income you must pay taxes on it. However, that being said I think estate taxes are out of line and should be abolished. If it must be kept then the rate should simply be the same as your regular tax rate.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
Yeah, technically speaking you may have a point but in the sense that everything my parents make during their life and during my life growing up with them its a shared experience and their estate is in essence owned by the family as a whole and therefore it is in spirit a double tax as the taxes that were paid the first time around also had an impact upon the family as a whole regardless of who paid them, and I think most people would agree with me.rm9792 wrote:It is not double taxed. Yes the money your parents earned was taxed as income to them when they earned it.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
So you also support sales tax at garage sales?rm9792 wrote:It is not double taxed. Yes the money your parents earned was taxed as income to them when they earned it. However when they die and it goes to you then it becomes income to you as yet untaxed by you. You were not in posession of the money or property till their death so now that you have income you must pay taxes on it. However, that being said I think estate taxes are out of line and should be abolished. If it must be kept then the rate should simply be the same as your regular tax rate.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
I'm of a split mind on this. Taxing things at resale (that is, not the initial sale of the item) is double taxation. For example, an item is taxed once when it's originally purchased. It shouldn't be taxed again at each additional resale.Jaguar wrote:So you also support sales tax at garage sales?rm9792 wrote:It is not double taxed. Yes the money your parents earned was taxed as income to them when they earned it. However when they die and it goes to you then it becomes income to you as yet untaxed by you. You were not in posession of the money or property till their death so now that you have income you must pay taxes on it. However, that being said I think estate taxes are out of line and should be abolished. If it must be kept then the rate should simply be the same as your regular tax rate.
However, if we do away with property taxes, government would still need some form of revenue, and a sales tax best fits that bill. But what about taxing products after the initial purchase? Eliminating this would create a huge second-hand economy, because people will respond to the no-tax incentive in their purchase. How would this work? Would we not charge sales tax on used cars? After all, they've already been taxed once. Houses? Only the initial purchaser of the house when new would pay sales tax? These would crush the new home and new car industries, as people would only want to buy used cars and homes to avoid the taxes.
Then we'd get into the mode of "What items are taxable at resale?" and this would create a complex code of what used items to charge taxes, and the point of a fair tax is to simplify, not list each item or item category as taxable/non-taxable.
So, for simplicity, perhaps all items - even at garage sales - should be taxed at resale. But then, the person holding the garage sale would probably need a tax permit, adding to the complexity.
Maybe only collect taxes from businesses which have a business license? But that would spawn a black market of people selling items from the trunks of their cars, or from their homes.
There's really no easy, one size fits all answer.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
You should read about the "Fair Tax". http://www.fairtax.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;Kythas wrote:I'm of a split mind on this. Taxing things at resale (that is, not the initial sale of the item) is double taxation. For example, an item is taxed once when it's originally purchased. It shouldn't be taxed again at each additional resale.Jaguar wrote:So you also support sales tax at garage sales?rm9792 wrote:It is not double taxed. Yes the money your parents earned was taxed as income to them when they earned it. However when they die and it goes to you then it becomes income to you as yet untaxed by you. You were not in posession of the money or property till their death so now that you have income you must pay taxes on it. However, that being said I think estate taxes are out of line and should be abolished. If it must be kept then the rate should simply be the same as your regular tax rate.
However, if we do away with property taxes, government would still need some form of revenue, and a sales tax best fits that bill. But what about taxing products after the initial purchase? Eliminating this would create a huge second-hand economy, because people will respond to the no-tax incentive in their purchase. How would this work? Would we not charge sales tax on used cars? After all, they've already been taxed once. Houses? Only the initial purchaser of the house when new would pay sales tax? These would crush the new home and new car industries, as people would only want to buy used cars and homes to avoid the taxes.
Then we'd get into the mode of "What items are taxable at resale?" and this would create a complex code of what used items to charge taxes, and the point of a fair tax is to simplify, not list each item or item category as taxable/non-taxable.
So, for simplicity, perhaps all items - even at garage sales - should be taxed at resale. But then, the person holding the garage sale would probably need a tax permit, adding to the complexity.
Maybe only collect taxes from businesses which have a business license? But that would spawn a black market of people selling items from the trunks of their cars, or from their homes.
There's really no easy, one size fits all answer.
The FairTax is a single-rate, federal retail sales tax collected only once, at the final point of purchase of new goods and services for personal consumption. Used items are not taxed. Business-to-business purchases for the production of goods and services are not taxed. A prebate makes the effective rate progressive.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
Kythas wrote:There's really no easy, one size fits all answer.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
Taxpayers are hoodwinked by paying taxes through payroll deduction and property taxes via mortgage payments. It's a case of "out of sight, out of mind"
One doesnt appreciate the high tax rate or the inordinate bureaucratic waste until having to write a check like any other household expense; a practice in itself that would regulate term limits.
One doesnt appreciate the high tax rate or the inordinate bureaucratic waste until having to write a check like any other household expense; a practice in itself that would regulate term limits.
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Re: Eliminate Property Taxes?
Not true, every time I go to buy a digital TV or other expensive toy I would be reminded of it. The fact is though that the current property tax system is not equal in every city nor is it based any standard that can be said to be fair as the appraisal is done by a person who may or may not have your interest in mind. In fact it is too easy to skew the valuation of your property in favor of raising more money for the city and state.Jim Beaux wrote:Taxpayers are hoodwinked by paying taxes through payroll deduction and property taxes via mortgage payments. It's a case of "out of sight, out of mind"
One doesnt appreciate the high tax rate or the inordinate bureaucratic waste until having to write a check like any other household expense; a practice in itself that would regulate term limits.