Required Classroom Topics

[sjfcontrol]

This is in response to another posting, here: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=32248&p=603998#p603998" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The person who posted in that thread implied that an instructor would be at fault if he didn't spend the minimum 10 hours teaching the 4 required subjects. I was about to respond that as long as the instructor covers the 4 topics, the instructor is free to fill the remaining time with related subject matter of his own choosing -- though I believe the "guest instructor" comment is probably valid.

In support my response, I found section 411.188(b)

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(b) Only a qualified handgun instructor may administer a handgun proficiency course. The handgun proficiency course must include at least 10 hours and not more than 15 hours of instruction on:
     (1) the laws that relate to weapons and to the use of deadly force;
     (2) handgun use, proficiency, and safety;
     (3) nonviolent dispute resolution; and
     (4) proper storage practices for handguns with an emphasis on storage practices that eliminate the possibility of accidental injury to a child.

However, my interpretation of that section agrees with the poster, as I see nothing that would allow for other topics, at least during the minimum 10 hours.

Am I mistaken in the class requirements? Have I missed something somewhere that would allow for other topics? I could have sworn this was mentioned in the Austin Instructors class, but that was over a year ago.

Note that this would mean that the new CHL-100 "Time Allocation" section had best add up to at least 10 hours in the first 4 categories (which I gather roughly correspond to the 4 sections mentioned above).

[apostate]

That's how I read it. An instructor must spend at least the minimum time on those subjects. I suspect the off-topic stuff was the prime motivation behind the space for times on the new CHL-100 but I could be wrong. I don't work for DPS and it has been several years since I was a CHL instructor.

[MasterOfNone]

Fortunately, just about anything you would want to cover in a CHL class could be considered part of "handgun use" if you think of it as "everything you need to know to use a handgun" instead of just the technical operation of a handgun. Worst case, you have a really large block of time for "handgun use, proficiency, and safety" on the form.

[sjfcontrol]

Fortunately, just about anything you would want to cover in a CHL class could be considered part of "handgun use" if you think of it as "everything you need to know to use a handgun" instead of just the technical operation of a handgun. Worst case, you have a really large block of time for "handgun use, proficiency, and safety" on the form.

The original post was complaining about spending a hour of time with somebody pushing "Self Defense Insurance". I don't see that insurance would fit into any of the 4 categories. (Non-violent dispute resolution, perhaps? )
However, in general I agree that "Handgun use" is a rather broad category.

[MasterOfNone]

Fortunately, just about anything you would want to cover in a CHL class could be considered part of "handgun use" if you think of it as "everything you need to know to use a handgun" instead of just the technical operation of a handgun. Worst case, you have a really large block of time for "handgun use, proficiency, and safety" on the form.

The original post was complaining about spending a hour of time with somebody pushing "Self Defense Insurance". I don't see that insurance would fit into any of the 4 categories. (Non-violent dispute resolution, perhaps? )
However, in general I agree that "Handgun use" is a rather broad category.

I think the topic of prepaid legal could fit into handgun use the same way discussing auto insurance fits into a driver's ed course. Though in this case coverage is not required, the existence of such programs is one aspect of being a handgun user.

[boba]

If a sales pitch for prepaid legal qualifies, so should watching movies like The Way of the Gun, Heat, Collateral, Tremors...

[sjfcontrol]

If a sales pitch for prepaid legal qualifies, so should watching movies like The Way of the Gun, Heat, Collateral, Tremors...

And perhaps the Buggs Bunny cartoon where he prevents Elmer Fudd from shooting him by plugging the shotgun barrel with his finger?

[boba]

And perhaps the Buggs Bunny cartoon where he prevents Elmer Fudd from shooting him by plugging the shotgun barrel with his finger?

At least it's not a sales pitch to a captive audience. What's next? Spend an hour trying to sell new guns to the students? A three hour marketing presentation for a shooting range timeshare?

[MasterOfNone]

I think the TOPIC of prepaid legal, or defense funds, or whatever name they may take is valid material to make students aware of. However, any PITCH for a particular organization would have to done on a break with it made clear to the students that it is not required material and they are not required to be present for it.

[TSUalum05]

How are folks doing renewals on the required topics?

[Charles L. Cotton]

How are folks doing renewals on the required topics?

I can't address specifics for other instructors, but we obviously have to cut the time spent by 60%. This means we have to either spread the cut across all subjects (virtually impossible), or make a judgment call as to which subjects get cut. In my classes, everyone gets the full discussion on use of force, so the renewal students get a much shorter discussion on other selected subjects. Since they have to take the same test, everything has to be covered albeit not in as much detail.

In my view, this is more evidence that a single 4 hr. course excluding the range portion is sufficient.

Chas.

[longtooth]

I would sure like that.

[MoJo]

I would sure like that.

Yeah, Me too

[Seabear]

Yeppers