CHL holder accidently discharges weapon at work question

[Vandelay Ind.]

I agree the shooter was wrong on many levels, but I don't believe in punishing someone for something that almost happened. The main thing is nothing was hurt but the shooters pride. What are the odds he makes that mistake again?

If you swerve off the road with a carload of kids but don't wreck, they don't take your drivers license because you almost........

This guy fouled up no doubt, but he may not be the moron everyone thinks.
I guess I'm more forgiving, been going to church alot lately.

[DONT TREAD ON ME]

I agree the shooter was wrong on many levels, but I don't believe in punishing someone for something that almost happened. The main thing is nothing was hurt but the shooters pride. What are the odds he makes that mistake again?

If you swerve off the road with a carload of kids but don't wreck, they don't take your drivers license because you almost........

This guy fouled up no doubt, but he may not be the moron everyone thinks.
I guess I'm more forgiving, been going to church alot lately.

What do you mean almost happened? It did happen. He broke laws that are Class A and B misdemeanors. One of them being under TPC 42.01. So, yes his CHL should be revoked.

...(4) is not charged with the commission of a Class A or Class B misdemeanor or an offense under Section 42.01, Penal Code, or of a felony under an information or indictment;...

[Vandelay Ind.]

I agree laws and rules were broken and I believe this is a very serious matter. I'm just not ready to hang the guy that's all.

[DONT TREAD ON ME]

I agree laws and rules were broken and I believe this is a very serious matter. I'm just not ready to hang the guy that's all.

If you make an exception for one you must make an exception for all. The law is the law. It states that you cannot be charged with the commission of a Class A or B misdemeanor (he should be). If we are to let that slide for people we might as well not have it as a requirement.

[chuckybrown]

My .02 cents?

1) Be thankful no one was hurt
2) Use this as a life-lesson and LEARN from it.

Those of you chanting "off with his head" should be careful. This was an ACCIDENT. I've been on this earth almost 49 years, and have been handling guns at least 47 of those years. Without going into specifics, I too have experienced OH NO moments. Have enough guns, and handle enough guns, the law of averages plays against you.

Lastly, the police need to be chasing BAD guys. The courts need to be prosecuting BAD guys.

IMHO, this guy needs a good thump on his ear, and that's about it. He's probably way more upset about it than anyone else.

Those of you ready to turn him in? Do you speed? Not stop all the way when making a right on red? Not the same thing? Wait, who was it said "the law is the law". Yea, we can debate level of severity, but come on..... Let's not crucify someone that made an honest mistake.

Make sense?

Peace.

[E.Marquez]

My .02 cents?

1) Be thankful no one was hurt
2) Use this as a life-lesson and LEARN from it.

Those of you chanting "off with his head" should be careful. This was an ACCIDENT..

Disagree completely, this was Negligence, not an accident. Huge difference

Definition of NEGLIGENT
1a : marked by or given to neglect especially habitually or culpably b : failing to exercise the care expected of a reasonably prudent person in like circumstances
2: marked by a carelessly easy manner

[DONT TREAD ON ME]

My .02 cents?

1) Be thankful no one was hurt
2) Use this as a life-lesson and LEARN from it.

Those of you chanting "off with his head" should be careful. This was an ACCIDENT. I've been on this earth almost 49 years, and have been handling guns at least 47 of those years. Without going into specifics, I too have experienced OH NO moments. Have enough guns, and handle enough guns, the law of averages plays against you.

Lastly, the police need to be chasing BAD guys. The courts need to be prosecuting BAD guys.

IMHO, this guy needs a good thump on his ear, and that's about it. He's probably way more upset about it than anyone else.

Those of you ready to turn him in? Do you speed? Not stop all the way when making a right on red? Not the same thing? Wait, who was it said "the law is the law". Yea, we can debate level of severity, but come on..... Let's not crucify someone that made an honest mistake.

Make sense?

Peace.

Take away the fact that he completely failed to clear the gun then intentionally pulled the trigger, he still broke a law...

UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE HOLDER.
(a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder carries a handgun on or about the license holder's person under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code,
and intentionally fails to conceal the handgun...

...(g) An offense under Subsection (a), (b), (c), (d), or (e) is a Class A misdemeanor

You guys that are comparing this with traffic violations are comparing apples and oranges. As I pointed out earlier it is required that one is not charged with the commission of a Class A or B misdemeanor to be eligible for a CHL. Nowhere does it state anything like that for a TDL. That is the point here. The law is very specific about this and he broke the law.

[E.Marquez]

IMHO, this guy needs a good thump on his ear, and that's about it. He's probably way more upset about it than anyone else. .

Really? You think he is more upset at himself then those around him he shot at are? Really?
Do you self a favor, don’t have an "accident" like this near me, my family, or any of my Soldiers.. Trust me, shoot at, near me negligently and guarantee I'll be more upset with you, then you will be with yourself.

[olafpfj]

IMHO, this guy needs a good thump on his ear, and that's about it. He's probably way more upset about it than anyone else. .

Really? You think he is more upset at himself then those around him he shot at are? Really?
Do you self a favor, don’t have an "accident" like this near me, my family, or any of my Soldiers.. Trust me, shoot at, near me negligently and guarantee I'll be more upset with you, then you will be with yourself.

There are some "accidents" that should NEVER happen. I'm thinking along the lines of forgetting to pack your parachute, not tying your rope correctly when climbing, trying to beat the train, stupidly and illegally pulling your gun out at work and almost shooting someone...you know...the "accidents" that you only get to make once!!!

[fishman]

Lets not forget this was not a near miss, that bullet hit something. Bullets don't miss they always hit.

[Seabear]

Been there done that, and I will have to agree the guy is probablly pretty shook up by his negligence. Wether more or less than the others involved, who knows, but I can assure from experience he is pretty upset. Heck, I'm so cautious that I nearly puked one day leaving the range when I noticed I had one round left in a magazine that was IN my locked open Mini 14. I could have sworn it was not there. That was 3 years ago and I still use it as a reminder to triple check things, and then check one more time.

I agree it was an stupid move on his part, however all you guys that are getting the lynch mob together can't tell me that you have not had a ND if you haven't, just wait. If you think it is impossible for you to have one, better not let the attitude bite you in the butt.

The one thing I can say for the guy is at least he had it pointed in a safe direction when he tried to "hammer down".

As stated by someone else, he should have had his friend meet him at the range , however I bet if we took an honest poll there would be more than a few here that have pulled their concealed weapon to show a friend a new weapon.

[Bulldog1911]

Ridiculous, the whole situation. Concealed means concealed, and since when do you pull the trigger to clear the chamber??????

Wrong on so many levels. Someone said something about having him check out this "debate". There is no debate. He is in violation of the law and company policy.

[canvasbck]

OK, I now have a list of folks I DONT want on the jury if I'm ever in a bind! The guy made a mistake, no doubt about that and there is no arguing that his mistake had huge potential for disaster. I agree that given the policies that were in place at this company, he should lose his job. Criminal charges are going to a bit of an extreme. Yes, he intentionally failed to conceal........how many on this board have sold a firearm face to face in a parking lot? Should we take the CHL from everyone who has done that, or did you not allow the purchaser to see the firearm?

I have owned and handled firearms for virtually my entire life. Three of the four rules were deeply engrained from an early age. (let's face it, our parents said the words "keep your finger off the trigger" but it was not nearly engrained the way muzzle control and treating a firearm as if it were loaded were) No where in those three rules were things like proper technique in clearing a firearm, heck most of our "instructors" (parents) weren't even all that proficient in proper clearing techniques, they just said make sure it's empty.

After I got my CHL, I decided that if I was going to carry this thing, I would make sure that I was proficient enough to never finish in second place should I ever be involved in a gunfight. So, I found out about someone who was offering defensive clinics at a local range and I started to attend. Shortly thereafter, I started participating in IDPA. I have discovered that I had a long list of bad habits and luck had prevented me from having a ND for most of my life. I looked back at a not so old picture of myself posing with a new firearm and low and behold there is my finger in the trigger guard! I have been wrapped up in a stage I just shot and neglected to drop the mag prior to pulling back the slide, my visual check of the chamber kept me from doing exactly what this guy had done. I have lately been used as a SO for our local club matches and I can tell you that it is a fairly common mistake among new shooters. I have also seen that many shooters do not reflexively remove their finger from the triggger guard while moving, reloading, clearing, ect. When I say new shooters, I mean new to shooting sports. Many of these new shooters have been shooting in hunting situations their whole lives.

OK, I used a lot of words to say don't crucify this guy for a mistake that is much more common than you may think. Unfortunately, the vast majority of firearms owners have not had the formal training to make things like properly clearing a weapon second nature.

[E.Marquez]

I agree it was an stupid move on his part, however all you guys that are getting the lynch mob together can't tell me that you have not had a ND if you haven't, just wait. If you think it is impossible for you to have one, better not let the attitude bite you in the butt.

1: I never advocated a lynch mob, prison time or anything so silly. to this person of topic.

I have simply said, it was not an accident, and he should be held responsible for his actions, loss of license until he can prove proficiency at least.
2: I most certainly can say I’ve never had an ND;
Not in my personal life, 38 some odd years out of 45 owning, having, carrying, using weapons of all descriptions.
Never an ND in my professional life, 25 years as a US Army Service Infantryman, carrying loaded condition Amber and mostly RED or using weapons for days, or months or many times a year at a time, actual use in action against not nice people more times than can be counted and I have NEVER had an ND.. Nor any soldier I have trained in 25 years.. NONE, ZERO.. and that is the standard, anyone who makes excuses for why an ND “will happen” or “can happen to anyone” is just making excuses for a short coming that is inexcusable in my opinion.
Im not perfect, I might have an ND one day, it will be though negligence, I will not be as mad at myself as those I negligently shoot at, I will deserve to be punished, or in some other way admonished with some form of censorship and retraining. My self loathing and disappointment in myself would not ever be sufficient or acceptable in it self for my actions of an ND.

[sugar land dave]

The problem is, when working with CHL classes I see numerous students who are 'adequate' at shooting and safety. They properly handle the firearm and don't do anything that would keep them from passing, but they are far from 'extremely proficient'. That doesn't mean they or even someone with tons more training won't pull a dumb stunt and do something like this. Discipline is discipline, and there are those that get it, those that don't, and those that feel they don't need it.

Just because you have had firearms training doesn't mean you can and will be an expert in safety. I have seen current and ex-military and LEO's that have had tons of training do things that make my skin crawl because they got careless or just weren't thinking.

And, if you add enough time to properly train them, then you will double or triple the time required to teach, and the cost, and in turn we will see too many start looking for an alternative (like they already do) other state license that doesn't require shooting and costs less.

Fully. The CHL class is just a beginning not the end. I would hope that everyone would realize that.