The best carry ammo for a .45

[Paladin]

That is not an FBI test, and your data is SIX years old.

So "best" depends upon yuour interpretation. I know hydras are not bonded, and I am fine with that.

They are different, not worse or better.

Believe what you will. I'm providing the info for everyone else.

[Paladin]

A nice photo of an expanded Winchester Ranger can be seen here:

http://www.tacticalforums.com/cgi-bin/t ... 8;t=000964

{second photo: 45 ACP 230gr = .74"}

The post also got a nice quote:

"-- Bullet designs like the Silver Tip, Hydra-Shok, and Black Talon were state of the art 10 or 15 years ago. Modern ammunition which has been designed for robust expansion against clothing and intermediate barriers is significantly superior to the older designs. The bullets in the Federal Classic and Hydrashok line are outperformed by other ATK products such as the Federal Tactical and HST, as well as the Speer Gold Dot; likewise Winchester Ranger Talons are far superior to the old Black Talons or civilian SXT's."

[Syntax360]

That is not an FBI test, and your data is SIX years old.

So "best" depends upon yuour interpretation. I know hydras are not bonded, and I am fine with that.

They are different, not worse or better.

Are you aware of any design changes in the Hydra-Shok's in the past six years? The data may be old, but the facts only change if the design does as well. ?

If you want to go Federal, I would stick to the Hi-Shok Tacticals. Rangers, Gold Dots, Bonded Golden Sabers are all good.

[Mike1951]

I guess I'm still using HydraShoks because I can't afford the ammo to prove a new load through all of my .45's. One of these days, I'll start one by one.

Federal thinks they improved on the HydraShok with their Tactical Hi-shok Two.

TACTICAL® HST®
The next generation in high performance duty ammunition.
HST offers consistent expansion and optimum penetration for terminal performance. A specially designed hollow-point tip won’t plug while passing through a variety of barriers and this bullet holds its jacket in the toughest conditions. HST is engineered for 100% weight retention and impressive expansion—it’s the ammunition you’ve been waiting for

Here are the results of three wound ballistic workshops on Federal's site:

http://www.le.atk.com/pdf/Pierce%20Coun ... rkshop.pdf

http://www.le.atk.com/pdf/San.pdf

http://www.le.atk.com/pdf/PortlandReport.pdf

[Paladin]

Thanks for the info Mike!

That's some pretty impressive expansion with the HST's. None of my critiques of HydraShok was meant to apply to HST's. Federal makes several grads of ammo that are significantly different from one another. I own several boxes of Federal Tactical.

[Thane]

I shoot Hornady XTP 200-g +P. I have no idea how well it performs once it hits the target, but it shoots well out of my Kimber 3", and recoil is quite manageable. It also feeds and functions rather well out of my Rock Island. Surprising to me, considering the ogive of the round is more of a truncated cone hollowpoint than most.

I've just about shot up all that I have, though, and haven't found any more locally. I need to load up some at home (as soon as I clean off the loading bench ).

[KRM45]

I carry Speer Gold Dot in all but my .380. I carry FMJ in that.

In my .45 I use 185g +p.

in my 9mm I use 115g +p

[Venus Pax]

I didn't mean to start an argument.

[longtooth]

I sure wish that I could get those Speers to feed through my Kimber.

I've heard nothing but good things about them.

They feed fine in my Pro CDP. I use Wilson mags.
Which K do you shoot & whose mags? Just curious. Never heard of that combination being incompatable.

[G.C.Montgomery]

I didn't mean to start an argument.

Don't feel bad, Venus. You didn't start the argument on best bullets...it's been going since before either of us was born

The only solid advice remains test Hydrashok or whatever in your gun. If it runs reliably then you are good to go. It may be an old design, as is the 1911, but both work just fine.

[longtooth]

I didn't mean to start an argument.

Don't feel bad, Venus. You didn't start the argument on best bullets...it's been going since before either of us was born

Correct. Now if you want to rekindle another argument that you did not start, ask which gun you should carry? 1911 or the G word.

Know you have chosen the RIGHT ONE.

[HankB]

IMHO the current "premium" loads from any of the major manufacturers are all fine choices - if the load 1) is absolutely reliable in YOUR pistol, and 2) has satisfactory accuracy in YOUR pistol, then stick with it and don't worry about getting something "better."

I'm comfortable with Federal, Winchester, Remington, and Speer ammo, but Cor-Bon has had intermittent QC problems over the years. I haven't heard anything definitive recently, but their DPX apparently causes hiccups in quite a few guns . . . right now it's not clear if it's a design or QC issue.

For myself, I currently use 230 grain Golden Sabers in my 1911. The load has a good reputation, has shown perfect reliability, and shoots small groups to point of aim. Beyond that, it's a 230, so if for some reason it doesn't expand, I'd expect it to perform like GI Ball . . . and that ain't bad.

[G.C.Montgomery]

...Cor-Bon has had intermittent QC problems over the years. I haven't heard anything definitive recently, but their DPX apparently causes hiccups in quite a few guns . . . right now it's not clear if it's a design or QC issue.

It's largely a design issue I think. The ogive of the Barnes' X bullet provides for a relatively sharp rim at the opening of the cavity. Being all copper, the bullet also has an extremely deep cavity. The bullet is harder than most with only thin guilding metal jackets. The problem is that very same attribute seems to lead to feeding issues in certain platforms.

My 9/357/40cal Glocks and Sigs work just fine with the Barnes' X Bullet. Springfield XD's, HK pistols and Beretta 92/96's and PX4's seem to handle it just fine as well. 9mm and 38 super 1911's with ramped barrels have worked OK with it from what I've seen. But 1911's and the Sig P220 in .45ACP are a different animal it seems. They are the only two platforms I've witnessed have issues with this bullet. In both cases it's the rim of that cavity that's hanging up on feed ramps. I've not seen the problem in HK or Glock .45's.

[WNallG30]

I've been carrying 200gr Hornady's in my Glock 30. I still carry 230gr Gold Dot's in my Kimber Raptor. I've never had a problem with either one. I also recently had to dispatch an attacking dog at our pit/shooting range. I was carrying my G30 with the 200gr Hornady's at the time. It did it's job. I've been using Hornady bullets in my .223 for quite awhile, and recently tried them in my 30.06. I've had many one shot, dropped in their tracks kills while hunting in the past few years. I figure they take the same care in all their bullets, so I decided to try the .45's. I'll buy some 230gr's and probably switch to those in my Raptor as well after I feed some test rounds through her.

[AV8R]

I didn't mean to start an argument.

I like to think that you were the catalyst for a lively discussion which was just waiting for a place to happen.

Some years ago, a TV variety show featured a juggler who successfully juggled a chain saw, sword, bowling ball, and stuffed animal, creating a spinning and bobbing visual cacophony. As he was juggling, he turned to the audience and remarked, "This is hard because they're all such different.....colors."

I think that .45 pistols must feel like that juggler when they see all of the different shapes and lengths of ammo they're asked to shoot reliably. The overall lengths of the different bullet designs and weights vary between a bit less than 1.200" for some of the lightweight hollowpoints (165 grain), up to about 1.300" for some 230 grain hardball. It is very difficult to engineer a pistol, especially a short-slide one, to accomodate this relatively huge variation in commercially available round lengths. When you add the extra complication of bullet nose shape into the equation, you have lots of possibilities to find ammo that works well or poorly for your particular pistol.

The key, as everyone has said, is to find a reliable feeder for your pistol. If it is reliable with practice ammo, like Winchester 230-grain round-nose, move to some 230 grain hollowpoints, try them, and go from there. Make changes based on bullet lengths and shapes if you have to, until you get reliability. That said, I carry 185, 200, and 230 grain Speer loads, and they all work fine in my .45s. If you have a compact pistol, use a "short-barrel load", or a lighter bulet weight, if you can, to help compensate for the velocity loss that happens with a short barrel.