Broke a rule....

[Bob in Big D]

I really don't see much difference in some dog charging me or some thug (human kind) charging me. They are both a threat! How many times do you read about some kid or grandma taking a walk, getting mauled or killed by a stray dog that gets out. At least I will have a chance to protect myself if possible. It is the dog owners responsibility, both morally and legally to keep his mutt from attacking people. Keep your dogs in a fenced yard or on a leash and you won't have a problem.
I would at least have a cell phone with me and in my case a pistol. Just my .02

[jamisjockey]

Pedaling away sounds easy. When I was chased the other day I was already at between 18-20mph and was able to sprint up. Being on my road bike helped, those speeds aren't as easy to achieve on a hybrid, cruiser, or mountain bike.
When I was bit, I had just come out of a public bathroom. I needed to turn left onto the public street. I was nearing the end of a very hilly 60 miler (living in Utah at the time), so I was tired. I also had to wait for traffic to clear so I could cross and turn left.
Across from the park where I was, there was a stand of trees. Behind the trees were the backyards of several homes. Maybe 60 yards. Those homes mostly had fenced back yards. One of those had the gate open, and several kids were in the woods playing. That is where the dogs that attacked me lived, and they had followed the kids into the woods.
The park and the woods were situated in a deep draw.
After turning left, I was faced with a short and steep hill. Normally, with the momentum of coming down the other side I could clear the climb out of the saddle at sprint speeds.
Basically, I was a sitting duck. The dogs came out of the woods and confronted me. My speed was probably 5mph. At 5mph I couldn't have outrun an attacking tortise, much less a black lab and a ridgeback mix.
I attempted to dismount and put the bike in front of me as a shield. When I did this, the ridgeback lunged and took a chunk of my gluteus maximus. The dog was approximately 110 pounds. A hundred and ten pound dog could easily kill an adult male. And there were two dogs.
Luckily, the dogs backed off after I began yelling. The kids associated with them called them into the woods. I was able to make contact with the local PD, and the dogs owner. The dog was later put down, as this was the SECOND un provoked incident in which it bit someone.

Dogs will be dogs, and are often only as bad as their owners. But that doesn't exuse the fact that a dog on public property, loose, and trying to separate me from chunks of my flesh, may suffer a case of lead poisioning.

[chasfm11]

I found this

http://www.amazon.com/Mace-Pepper-Gel-L ... 433&sr=8-1

It looks like a gel type product and if it truly shoots 18 feet, that would be a help.

[Abraham]

I tried different pepper sprays until I started using the brand I now use - ALL the others had mixed results...

Also, consider buying some decontamination wipes when you decide on what spray you end up buying because there's always a chance a bit of the spray may land on you too, i.e., spraying into the wind as even the stream type (I know zero about the gel types) sprays will atomize some when sprayed into a high wind. Also, after spraying there's some left on the spray aperture that can get rubbed off onto your hands and then if you touch your face or eyes it can get pretty ugly. Even on bare skin the stuff I use feels like a blowtorch burn. Ouch!

I carry three decontamination wipes with me. I paid a $1.50 for each wipe and worth every penny. I think I paid about $5.00 for the belt clip holder. Also, worth every ... The 4 oz cans cost about $15.00.

In all my dog attack experiences, I've never had one lunge upon me while pedaling. After reading this thread I realize that day may come... It's been my experience when come at me, the attacking dogs seem to get a bit distracted by the action of my pedaling and are not immediately able to decide how to go about biting me. This is the time I use to spray them into leaving me alone. Of course, I try to discourage them from getting that close by spraying well beforehand if I know they're coming. It's the quiet ones I don't realize are coming that really scare the devil out of me...

And yes, I've had a few dog owners watch their dogs come hurtling out their yards after me and utter not a word - until they see the spray can in my hand. Then, a few of them have yelled at ME for defending myself.

Presumably, in their opinion, I ought to let the dog bite. Or, perhaps they assume he's only going to chase and not bite, but how am I supposed to be assured that's the case when it's a pit/rott/ridgeback/dober/German shep/ fill in the blank - that can do serious harm?

All that said, I don't always spray all dogs that come after me. Some dogs do just want to chase for fun and these I can generally intuit as harmless, but if I have doubt, I spray.

[JJVP]

I would carry pepper spray, no offense, but shoot my dog and I might decide my life for yours would be a fair trade.

I hope you don't take offense about what I have said, but I care a great deal about my dog.

..and I suspect that you would not be one of those who allowed your dog to bite someone who was just passing by. I love my dogs, too, but it is my responsibility to control them. There is absolutely no excuse for someone who has a dog out in public that will be bite and not having the owner control it.

This isn't about dogs...it is about owners.

I agree that the owner should control the dogs. However, brown stuff happens. You might have the dog in your fenced backyard with the gate locked. Someone, a visitor, the gas guy, water guy, etc could come into your yard while you are away and leave the gate open or unlocked. I had a golden retriever that could open the gate on the backyard fence. I had to put a slide lock on the outside of the fence to keep him from opening the gate. If someone came into the backyard and failed to close the outside lock, he could be a mile away before we even noticed. In the case of my dog the worse you could get was slobber all over you. He was very friendly. Many times we got a call from a neighbor that had found him running around. Bottom line, the owner could have done everything right and the dog still got loose.

[KD5NRH]

I'm just saying shoot my dog and you better be ready to shoot me.

The gun's already out and warmed up at that point, so sure, the victim of your uncontrolled mutt will be ready.

Pedaling away sounds easy. When I was chased the other day I was already at between 18-20mph and was able to sprint up. Being on my road bike helped, those speeds aren't as easy to achieve on a hybrid, cruiser, or mountain bike.

The main issue is road conditions; of the places I tend to have dog problems, at least one will be on a long uphill no matter which direction I'm going. There's no way I'm going to hold much over 15 on my hybrid during those climbs. Then again, on a downhill where I can hit 30+ easily, a dog running in front of the bike can be worse than a bite. These are also county roads with less-than-ideal maintenance, so high speeds aren't really a great idea in the first place.

The Airzound will have a serious effect on a dog that's close by, at least if it's not in full attack yet. For the ones that want to "play" by getting tangled in the spokes, it's usually enough of a deterrent. The U-lock in a quick release on the stem is also easier to use while moving than a pistol.

In general, the P32 with pocket clip works well in the pocket of a pair of cargo shorts worn over the bike shorts. That makes sure it and my DL/CHL are with me if I get off the bike too. When I'm not wearing the cargo shorts, it goes in the bigger compartment of a top bar bag, and the ID in the other.

[chasfm11]

Presumably, in their opinion, I ought to let the dog bite. Or, perhaps they assume he's only going to chase and not bite, but how am I supposed to be assured that's the case when it's a pit/rott/ridgeback/dober/German shep/ fill in the blank - that can do serious harm?

All that said, I don't always spray all dogs that come after me. Some dogs do just want to chase for fun and these I can generally intuit as harmless, but if I have doubt, I spray.

The owner of the Doberman that bit me told me, with blood streaming down my leg, said that his dog would never bite and that I must have kicked at it to provoke it. Any fool should understand that when you are standing up on the pedals, pumping as hard as you can, trying to raise a foot would put you on the ground. I don't often pat myself on the back but it took every ounce of restraint that I had not to beat that guy to a bloody pulp. By the way, I ride a mountain bike. I've have been off onto the ground many times if I was on those skinny road bike tires.

I'm reading "A Nation of Cowards" right now. Some of the arguments against not using a gun to defend yourself against a human BG have apparently spilled over in some dog owner's heads. I'm not supposed to try to defend myself in ANY WAY, (never mind a firearm) from an aggressive dog. A non-aggressive dog isn't at issue here because it would not have approached me at a speed which could be interpreted as an attack. I agree with you that in most cases, I can see a dog 20 yards away and know whether I should worry about it. I also agree with you that the sneaky ones are the worst. Even with a helmet mirror, I cannot see low behind my back wheel and that is where many of them approach.

Based on my experiences over 5 years, pepper spray would not have helped me in almost half the cases. I'm definitely in condition yellow when I'm on my bike (and not just for dogs) so it isn't that I'm not watching and profiling the animals that I see. The problem is that I also have to watch to make sure that I don't hit something with my wheels, don't run off the pavement or hit a curb.

Riding defensively is probably a two person job. Yep, that's it - I need a tandem bike and a weapons officer aboard

[jamisjockey]

I would carry pepper spray, no offense, but shoot my dog and I might decide my life for yours would be a fair trade.

I hope you don't take offense about what I have said, but I care a great deal about my dog.

..and I suspect that you would not be one of those who allowed your dog to bite someone who was just passing by. I love my dogs, too, but it is my responsibility to control them. There is absolutely no excuse for someone who has a dog out in public that will be bite and not having the owner control it.

This isn't about dogs...it is about owners.

I agree that the owner should control the dogs. However, brown stuff happens. You might have the dog in your fenced backyard with the gate locked. Someone, a visitor, the gas guy, water guy, etc could come into your yard while you are away and leave the gate open or unlocked. I had a golden retriever that could open the gate on the backyard fence. I had to put a slide lock on the outside of the fence to keep him from opening the gate. If someone came into the backyard and failed to close the outside lock, he could be a mile away before we even noticed. In the case of my dog the worse you could get was slobber all over you. He was very friendly. Many times we got a call from a neighbor that had found him running around. Bottom line, the owner could have done everything right and the dog still got loose.

It sucks, but its the price of ownership. I've been riding a while and I am pretty much able to tell when a dog is just playing or racing, or has ill intent. I'm not usually dawdling along, either, so it usually takes serious intent to give that kind of chase.

[Gyrogearhead]

A long long time ago when I had a paper route in Jr. high (This was back in the middle 50's when no one had heard of leash laws) one of my friend's dad approached me one day to help him stop his dog from chasing bike riders. He wanted me rather than a family member because as he said they had to live with the dog. Long story short, he gave me a water pistol loaded with house hold amonia cleaner and water 50-50. He let the dog out and sure enough it came straight for me. One shot to the head and it was all over. That dog never chased another bike in its entire life and I learned a valuable lesson. DIY chemical warfare can be rewarding.

From then on I carried my neon orange plastic 1911 in my front basket loaded with amonia & water. "Treated" a lot of dogs along my paper route and never had to "treat" the same dog twice. In fact once "treated" the dogs would go hide when they saw me coming down the street. I also found it worked equally well on agressive bullies in the school yard. Got detention and had several 1911's taken away but figured it was better than getting my butt whipped and the bullies usually got real friendly afterward anyway.

The good thing about amonia rather than peper spray is that it evaporates into the air fairly rapidly so there's no irritating residue after a few minutes. Also at the rate I have to "treat" dogs now a $2.00 bottle is a lifetime supply if my water gun doesn't leak. Every year or so I have to buy a new water gun at Wally World because the springs in the water pump corrode but the 1911 style are usually the cheapest ones they have. The 1911 rides in the back pocket of my handle bar bag with the grip standing right at hand. It's good out to about 12 feet and with a little practice to allow for the greater "bullet drop" you can easily keep your shots inside a 6" diameter target of a human or dog face. Also you'll have around 70-80 shots between reloads so you can afford to "blast away" until you hit the face full on.

[chuckybrown]

I've got a weekend place up in East Texas. Many years ago, every time I pulled up to my gate, the dogs from a home across the highway ran over to harass me. I don't think they were full blood pit bulls, but were darn close... Anyway, over time, they got to where they got closer and closer each time they came up to the gate as I pulled up.

I pulled up one day, and the larger of the two literally nipped at my pants legs. My .45 Para came out of my holster, and I shot the dog in the face at about 7' as he was inching toward me in a second attempt to bite me. It toppled over where he was standing. The other dog ran to the other side of the road barking. I drug the dog to the side of the road by the bar ditch, and left it there.

The owners cared so much for that dog, that a week later he was still there (directly in their line of sight as they pulled out of their place) swollen and smelly with his collar still on. The stench was so bad that I had to go to the farm and ranch store, buy a bag of lime, and cover it up.

My ancestors did not climb to the top of the food chain so that I might *consider* animal rights over my own. Nope. Dead dog, every time.

My .02 cents.

[KD5NRH]

Long story short, he gave me a water pistol loaded with house hold amonia cleaner and water 50-50. He let the dog out and sure enough it came straight for me. One shot to the head and it was all over. That dog never chased another bike in its entire life and I learned a valuable lesson. DIY chemical warfare can be rewarding.

Hmmm... " onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

OTOH, the Airzound has the secondary benefit of annoying the owners when their dogs are loose on one of my 4AM rides.

[jamisjockey]

My ancestors did not climb to the top of the food chain so that I might *consider* animal rights over my own. Nope. Dead dog, every time.

My .02 cents.

That might be the one-liner of the year!

[chuckybrown]

My ancestors did not climb to the top of the food chain so that I might *consider* animal rights over my own. Nope. Dead dog, every time.

My .02 cents.

That might be the one-liner of the year!

Amen brother! These days, political correctness has emasculated men to the point they're afraid to stand up. Not me.

And I'm back quiet......

[hoot]

I have ridden bicycles and been attacked and threatened by dogs.
I have jogged and been threatened by dogs (and that one was too close).
I have ridden motorcycles and been chased and threatened by dogs.
Does anybody but me realize how FAST a dog can attack
and how S-L-O-W a human can re-act?
Hoot

[jamisjockey]

Yep. Did you read my attack story? A gun would not have prevented the inital attack, but without one I could have been killed had the attack continued.