The Day I’ll Join The NRA – An Open Letter To Ted Nugent

[stevie_d_64]

But, that's akin to arguing whether it's better to be slapped with the left hand, or the right: both sting, and free people should suffer neither.

Absolutely impressive!!!

Obviously if we had a judiciary system that would do its job in applying the Constitution to every law (especially the obvious infringements) we might not be in a 20,000 gun laws situation...

Nit picking whatever cases they do have the potential to opinion on, plays right into the infringing attitude and system the Federal and these State(s) legislature(s) have been doing to us, for way too long...

A lot of clearly un-Constitutional efforts could have been headed off at the pass, if even a cursory threat of a "supreme" judicial review were to be floated around...

I know of an interesting bill drafted, and ready to be filed, for the next Texas Legislative session that will take care of a big thorn thrusted into us by the Feds recently...If enacted, it will give the state of Texas the ability to do a "time out" (if determined to be un-Constitutional, we will not comply) on a lot of Federal laws that are questionable in their Constitutionality...It has fangs, not just teeth...So its application at first will deal with the first problem...Once that is dealt with, well, lawyers love precedence...And this one definitely has the potential to line up the dominos for them to fall with a single push...

I have a copy of the bill, but have been asked to not publish it, or give out any details, till it is filed...I think it is that important to not allow it to be deciphered until it is in work this next year...I really wish I could let y'all see it, it truely will be a very big deal in the next session...

[Chemist45]

This saddens me.
I am an Endowment member of the NRA, a member of GOA, CCRKBA, SAF and JPFO.
My wife belongs to SAS.

I think I will let my membership in JPFO lapse. We don't have the resources to fight each other and I cannot support that.
Again. I am saddened by this.

[TEX]

He is right on every single point. The founding fathers would be disgusted at where we are now in relation to the right to keep and bear arms.

TEX

[74novaman]

The founding fathers would be disgusted at where we are now in relation to the right to keep and bear arms.

TEX

In addition to lots of other things. It took 200 something years (although one could make a strong argument for most of it being since the election of FDR and his successors) to screw up this badly. Its going to take us some time to get things right again.

[pbwalker]

The founding fathers would be disgusted at where we are now in relation to the right to keep and bear arms.

TEX

In addition to lots of other things. It took 200 something years (although one could make a strong argument for most of it being since the election of FDR and his successors) to screw up this badly. Its going to take us some time to get things right again.

Let's start with Social Security...

[A-R]

Very interesting OP and link and I have truly enjoyed PBWalker's commentary throughout

Any organization that is reactionary and abrasive toward criticism has problems. With that in mind, this quote is particularly well-stated, IMHO.

I don't think anyone is denying that the NRA is a valuable resource for gun owners. But what I see is that if you critique the NRA or question anything, the venom pours out. Not really on this forum, but others that I have seen. It's really a "Wizard of Oz - Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" type of situation.

I get much the same vibe regarding the NRA.

I truly think if the NRA wants to rise up to represent ALL gun owners, and not just its current members, then it needs to spend some serious time and money on outreach to non-members and changing its image as nothing more than lobbying pitbull for "those crazy people who want everyone to own a machine gun" (I've seriously heard people say things very similar to this; and not just antis, but people who own a gun or two but have a less-than-stellar image of the NRA).

PBWalker asked a very astute question of Charles regarding this NRA-produced video, which sounds great BTW ..... WHO is actually going to see this? And how/where? If a video like this is only seen by the membership and others who already fervently believe in RKBA and know the content of the video, then what is the point?

And spreading the pro-RKBA message can't merely be Washington-based press releases and point-counterpoint appearances opposite some anti-libtard on a cable news show. There should be an NRA spokeperson ready to be quoted by the LOCAL MEDIA in EVERY county in this country any time a citizen uses a firearm to defend themselves from crime. Web sites such as "The Armed Citizen" should be publicised at every opportunity to the mainstream media. Common people who use a firearm to defend themselves should be lauded and congratulated, even if they're not a member of the NRA. Make a small $1,000 donation or scholarship in the name of each and every citizen who uses a gun to defend themselves from crime. Donations to victims-help services (even those run by libtards) and scholarships in fields of criminal justice, grief counseling etc.

Show that the NRA is about PEOPLE protecting themselves by utilizing the best tool possible to do so. The NRA is not just about "guns" ... it's about PEOPLE and our rights in this country to be free of fear from criminals, bullies, and despots of all stripes.

[chabouk]

What has GOA accomplished? Nothing, not one single thing.

Chas.

It did achieve something. It made you and the NRA look like moderates.

K.

I hope no one downplays or overlooks the importance of this fact.

If the NRA is the only game in town, if they have no one whom they can point at as advocates of really radical change, they will then have to offer up their own good cop/bad cop bills. One proposing actual radical change, and another that is "reasonable". They haven't done so well with that, tending to seek the achievable and compromising on something less than desired.

I think NRA should be quietly funding big ad campaigns by GOA and JPFO and SAF. That way, they could say, "See? We aren't the radical pro-gun lobby, we're the reasonable ones! Now, let's talk about repealing the Hughes Amendment to FOPA-86... "

[jimlongley]

I truly think if the NRA wants to rise up to represent ALL gun owners, and not just its current members, then it needs to spend some serious time and money on outreach to non-members and changing its image as nothing more than lobbying pitbull for "those crazy people who want everyone to own a machine gun" (I've seriously heard people say things very similar to this; and not just antis, but people who own a gun or two but have a less-than-stellar image of the NRA).

One problem is that back in the 60s the NRA was attempting to accomplish that "We represent ALL gun owners, whether they are members or not!" image, and there were those of us who were members then who thought that the organization should work harder to represent the membership. After some upheaval and name calling the organization turned right, formed a lobbying arm, and ceased trying to be all things to all people.

It doesn't matter much what the NRA does, there will be those who see it as either too radical or not radical enough, just as there are idiots out there who will say "I have my gun, I don't care if they outlaw yours." and refuse to join for that reason, but the simple fact remains that the only way to change it is from the inside, and to do that you have to: A) Join; B) Be active and; C) Be prepared for inertia.

[The Annoyed Man]

Again quoting from the article:

NEXT: I’ll join the NRA…

3. When the NRA calls for the complete and unconditional disbanding of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (BATFE). Gun owners should be appalled at the NRA leadership’s incestuous “good cop/bad cop” dance with the BATFE. For decades there has been a symbiotic, and liberty threatening, “good ole’ boy” relationship between NRA and BATFE.

They should instead be mortal enemies.

The BATFE’s abuses are legion and despicable. These criminal acts crested like a bloody wave with the horrific deceit and treachery the agency displayed at Ruby Ridge, Idaho, and then at Waco, Texas.

JPFO has produced a documentary about the BATFE called “The Gang” for which you kindly donated footage, showing you teaching teenagers how to use firearms safely. As you know, “The Gang” is not specifically about Ruby Ridge or Waco, it’s about how, with deliberate regularity, the BATFE criminally harasses honest gun owners.

Did you know that, back during the Administration of Ronald Reagan, President Reagan actually wanted to dismantle the then “BATF”? Who stopped him? The NRA! See this Time Magazine article that reports this hypocrisy.

The NRA has publicly stated that it wants to “work with” BATFE to punish the criminal use of guns, see: copy of NRA response letter. Let the local police, county sheriff, State police, or the FBI, do what they were assigned and sworn to do in the first place.

We don’t need these bucket headed, jack booted paramilitary goons playing cops in our lives.

And then there’s the firearms. This means “gun control”, and every single threat to our freedom that comes along with it.

On top of that, tobacco is a drug. Alcohol is a drug. Give that authority to the FDA. Explosives? Wasn’t that an FBI specialty already?

I submit the following from the NRA-ILA:

BATFE Reform Bill Introduced In U.S. Senate

Friday, May 01, 2009

Senators Mike Crapo (R-Idaho) and Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.) introduced S. 941 -- the "Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives Reform and Firearms Modernization Act" -- on April 30. Senator Leahy is chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, to which S. 941 has been referred.

S. 941 represents the first time such BATFE Reform legislation has been introduced in the Senate. However, the House passed similar legislation (H.R. 5092) in the 109th Congress by a 277-131 vote. A majority of the House -- 224 congressmen -- cosponsored a similar bill (H.R. 4900), in the 110th Congress.

This bipartisan reform legislation is the culmination of efforts to address BATFE abuses and problems that were highlighted in several congressional oversight hearings in 2006. (To read more about these hearings, please click here.) S. 941 represents NRA-ILA's latest efforts to pass legislation that will make it easier for lawful gun owners and dealers to comply with federal law and regulations, while ensuring that those who break the law are punished accordingly [emphasis mine- TAM]. This bipartisan bill also serves as a vital step toward modernizing and improving BATFE's overall operations. The bill would roll back unnecessary restrictions, correct errors, and codify longstanding congressional policies in the firearms arena, and is a vital step needed to modernize and improve BATFE operations.

A fact sheet on S. 941 can be found here. The House companion to S. 941 will be introduced next week.

Please be sure to contact your two U.S. Senators and ask them to cosponsor and support S. 941! You can call your U.S. Senators at (202) 224-3121.

Again, the guy who wrote the original screed is ignorant at best, and deliberately uninformed at worst.

[RHenriksen]

And spreading the pro-RKBA message can't merely be Washington-based press releases and point-counterpoint appearances opposite some anti-libtard on a cable news show. There should be an NRA spokeperson ready to be quoted by the LOCAL MEDIA in EVERY county in this country any time a citizen uses a firearm to defend themselves from crime. Web sites such as "The Armed Citizen" should be publicised at every opportunity to the mainstream media. Common people who use a firearm to defend themselves should be lauded and congratulated, even if they're not a member of the NRA. Make a small $1,000 donation or scholarship in the name of each and every citizen who uses a gun to defend themselves from crime. Donations to victims-help services (even those run by libtards) and scholarships in fields of criminal justice, grief counseling etc.

Show that the NRA is about PEOPLE protecting themselves by utilizing the best tool possible to do so. The NRA is not just about "guns" ... it's about PEOPLE and our rights in this country to be free of fear from criminals, bullies, and despots of all stripes.

This is beautiful, AR. When I'm around pro-gun people who are more focused on the *firearm* than on its utility (protecting oneself & family, or food on the table, or a fun hobby) I'm not as comfortable - think 'mall ninja' or worst case, a potentially scary personality. Think about how anti-firearms people react even more strongly to that same vibe.

The people who just want to get on with their lives, and consider the pistol on their hip simply as a useful accessory to ensure their important goals (career, family, living a long happy life) are safeguarded, don't cause that same sense of unease.

I've never seen 'fire extinguisher porn' threads, or 'seat belt porn' threads, of people posting lovingly staged beauty pictures of their car's seat belts, or fire extinguishers, or insurance policy documents. Not that there'd be anything WRONG with that... but given that the whack jobs responsible for mass shootings probably exhibited fetish-like behavior over their firearms, it's a troubling parallel. And I can't really throw stones at anti-2A people who key on that parallel.

So... let's focus on the *people*. Our family members, our neighbors, our friends. Not the tool, but about the individuals' lives that the tool has been used to protect. I think this is why Oleg Volk's posters resonate so strongly.

http://olegvolk.net/gallery/technology/arms" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[SQLGeek]

I've never seen 'fire extinguisher porn' threads, or 'seat belt porn' threads, of people posting lovingly staged beauty pictures of their car's seat belts, or fire extinguishers, or insurance policy documents.

Do the people that post pictures of their souped up cars, paintball guns, meticulously detailed rail road models or extensive stamp collections bother you in the same manner?

[RHenriksen]

I've never seen 'fire extinguisher porn' threads, or 'seat belt porn' threads, of people posting lovingly staged beauty pictures of their car's seat belts, or fire extinguishers, or insurance policy documents.

Do the people that post pictures of their souped up cars, paintball guns, meticulously detailed rail road models or extensive stamp collections bother you in the same manner?

Nope.

[A-R]

I've never seen 'fire extinguisher porn' threads, or 'seat belt porn' threads, of people posting lovingly staged beauty pictures of their car's seat belts, or fire extinguishers, or insurance policy documents.

Do the people that post pictures of their souped up cars, paintball guns, meticulously detailed rail road models or extensive stamp collections bother you in the same manner?

I fully understand the point both of you are making, and agree in some ways with both. I don't have as big a problem with "gun porn" so to speak, but I am a bit turned off by the whole extremist/survivalist mentality (especially when it's shoved in my face at gun shows) and the whole "mall ninja" thing is just stupid really. Live and let live and all that, but as RH said if WE are a bit turned off by it, how does the average fence sitter feel when confronted by a guy with 17 years of food stored up, 20 "assault rifles" (remember this is viewpoint of an ill-informed fence sitter), who always seems to be wearing hunting clothes.

The problem - I think - that antis and fence-sitters have relevant to above is that by drooling all over gun porn and such, it puts guns into the category of cars, fashion etc. (basically just swag) even though to these people guns are VERY DANGEROUS objects to be flaunting in this manner. rhenricksen's point is good that if we wish the "rest of the people" to see things our way, we need to consistently send the message that guns are sobering tools of safety, much like the seat belts and fire extinguishers mentioned above. They can ALSO be fun swag as well - going to a shooting range or other safe place to shoot is FUN. It's a tricky dichotomy that must be presented the right way.

This is why I promote dealing with these issues on a local level (and not on high from Wash DC). There is certainly a place for NRA bigwigs to lobby the politicians. But more focus should be placed on grassroots local efforts to "spread the good word" about gun ownership and gun rights and guns as a tool for safety and self-defense. When meeting new people who may have an issue with guns (if it comes up) I always like to start by honestly and forthrightly asking them why they feel this way, and leading them to divulge any past "bad experiences" with guns. You'd be amazed how many people are antis because of some past tragedy - their uncle was killed with a gun, they were mugged at gun point , etc.

And when - Thank God - someone WANTS to learn more about guns, maybe go shooting, or "try it out". I am ALWAYS happy to oblige and show them what I know in a very non-threatening way.

NRA should support these efforts in a way that doesn't thrust N R A into people's faces nor initially solicit donations or talk about all the "important" stuff like RKBA rights and "what have you done to defend 2A today?" etc. Let people enter the fray in their own time and their own way. I realize the NRA needs to raise vast amounts of money, but many are turned off by these efforts (NRA pamphlets in every new gun box etc). We get it, you want us to join and pledge money, but show us WHY we should join and stop laying guilt trips.

apologies for going off on a few tangents above ...

EDITED TO ADD: an idea of the type of "grassroots" efforts I'd like to see .... spread some of the NRA giant cash warchest around to local gun clubs, ranges etc with the purpose that they host a monthly free or discount "come learn to shoot" day. Have NRA members meet novices at the range and offer to let them shoot their guns or range rentals and let the range time be discounted or free, maybe even a free box of ammo. Spend a few dollars to advertise this in regular media (not on gun forums, except to find "instructors"), at churches, civic groups, try to reach moms, dads, regular folks at the hardware store, grocery store, Wal Mart, Target etc.

[seamusTX]

There should be an NRA spokeperson ready to be quoted by the LOCAL MEDIA in EVERY county in this country any time a citizen uses a firearm to defend themselves from crime.

This is a good idea. Every time I hear Paul Helmke on a radio program (after I dispose of the barf bag) I regret that no one from the NRA was there to refute his lies.

But who is going to do it? And to the extent that it has to be paid for, where is the money going to come from?

Not everyone can put in a good TV appearance. Most people who have no training or experience look clueless. It's difficult in an adversarial situation to remain articulate and avoid losing one's temper.

BTW, Alan Gottlieb is very good in this regard.

- Jim

[SQLGeek]

I fully understand the point both of you are making, and agree in some ways with both. I don't have as big a problem with "gun porn" so to speak, but I am a bit turned off by the whole extremist/survivalist mentality (especially when it's shoved in my face at gun shows) and the whole "mall ninja" thing is just stupid really.

I don't like it either but I don't see that as the same as somebody that collects and enjoys firearms as a hobby. Part of almost every hobby is sharing your collections and pieces with others. I understand that the antis attach a negative morality to guns and our goal as responsible gun owners should be to promote guns as just another tool. Part of that is showing that the vast majority of firearms enthusiasts appreciate them for the same reasons car enthusiasts appreciate their machines.

Now the use of the word "porn" in describing images of guns? I don't care for it myself. Perhaps we agree more than we disagree. I originally objected to the idea that because I have an appreciation for firearms, I may have a "scary" personality.

Sorry for getting off topic from the original thread, I hope this is at least tangentially related.