mr.72 wrote:I guess I'm old school, I think the Constitution actually means something and we need to abide by it. Due to his refusal to provide the necessary birth certificate, I do think Obama's election is a fraud. It would be so easy to prove he was a natural born citizen, and yet he simply refuses. If he refuses to comply with this provision of the Constitution it is not likely that he will take the rest of it seriously.
The problem is that the majority of the public, and even those on this board, do not think that this provision of the Constitution has any value or merit. Most people don't even understand the difference between a "Natural Born" citizen and a "Naturalized" citizen. We've been through this many times on this forum but you can't teach someone whose mind is already made up I guess.
In reality, there is no precedent for what to do about a man who is elected president and then later found to have been ineligible. This would be the first time. The natural thing to do is not to make Nancy Pelosi the president. The rational thing to do is throw out the election results, some body of the government would have to appoint an interim President (perhaps even GWB, the last man to fairly win a valid election), and then hold a new special election in which Obama would be ineligible to run.
This birth certificate thing would not be any big deal if Obama had not steadfastly refused to provide it, even when ordered by the court to do so. Now of course, if he were ordered by the court to provide the birth certificate right now, and then he refused, he may be found in contempt of court and that would be an impeachable offense. But if we learned anything in the last decade it should be that the American people have a lot more tolerance for crooked and immoral presidents than they do for impeachment hearings and investigations.
And I will close with this. The last thing you want is for the Republicans to be remembered for trying to impeach the first black president over something the public regards as a minor technicality. Either let Obama ruin the Democrat party by leading it off a cliff, or let the Democrats lead a charge to have him impeached for whatever reason, but really, we have to stay out of this fight.
I don't see anything in the Constitution about a "necessary birth certificate" and I bet nobody could produce one for a whole bunch of our presidents. How about someone finding one for, say, Lincoln? Does anyone have a copy of FDR's?
I'll admit that records other than birth certificates are easily faked up these days, but in my lifetime, and I'm not that old, I can cite doctors in the US Army altering birth certificates of children born "at the wrong time" and situations such as my daughters. I still have copies of the birth certificates that were reissued to them after I adopted them, showing me as their father, and I was 10 years old when the older one was born.
A bunch of years ago I had to ask the Army for a certified copy of my birth certificate, and got one eventually from Walter Reed AMC. The problem was, and this problem existed with the previous one I had, that the COPY they sent me had the upper right corner missing. It's missing in a straight line, as if cut, but the last digit of the year is not there. On the copy that I used from childhood, which it turns out was not a "certified" copy and which the State of Illinois refused to accept for my FOID, had the same issue, and very neatly inscribed right under where the year should be, in my father's hand, is written "1946" and it was accepted by everyone.
My newer copy is from a microfiche, and the certificate is slightly askew in the fiche, which cuts off that corner, and someone has written, right under the date line , with white ink on the black background, indicating that the fiche is of a "xerographic copy" to begin with, "1946" in what looks suspiciously like my father's hand, very carefully crafted draftsman's numerals, just like that seen on engineering drawings done by anyone educated at MIT in that era. So how could this happen? I don't know, but I do know that my father was a Major assigned to the Pentagon for some covert stuff around the time I was born, and that an awful lot of high ranking officers attended his wedding. Could a Pentagon Major have enough pull to change a birth certificate?
So, in the unlikely event that I was to run for President, could I provide a "necessary birth certificate"? Probably not, because the only repository for them has nothing but microfiches, probably stored in some digital format now, and the modification would be used by some to prove that I was actually not born here or in the year I use as my birth year (which I remain suspicious of) and any other objection that someone could raise to my obviously forged instrument.
The birth certificate thing is a very weak arguement, there are so many other things to go after, why concentrate on something that just sounds trite?
Start with the facts - he's a Chicago politician, Blago was a crony, Daley is a crony, Burris is a crony, Ryan was a crony, he is practicing cronyism as bad as the worst that Tammany Hall had to offer, just look at his list of appointments.
Don't even bother with the whine about him appointing nothing but anti-gun nuts, that's what we are being protrayed as doing in the media, concentrate instead on things like his campaign against earmarks where he promised to go after them "line by line" and then he signs a bill loaded with them.
Do point out that he promised our guns would be safe from him, but do it concisely, and connect the appointments to a rising suspicion that his words might have been carefully planned to give him deniability "The Congress, the VOICE OF THE PEOPLE" has spoken, and I have no choice but to follow their will and sign into law the most sweeping firearms safety legislation ever submitted by Sarah Brady." JUST DON'T WHINE!
Go after his obvious lies and prevarications, not HB45, which is Bobby Rush's thing (also a crony) and which has been ponied up over and over again for years.
He's got a lot of chinks in his armor, don't concentrate on the surface blemishes, that's just what he wants, so that he can play up how injured he is by these unjustified attacks. It wouldn't surprise me to see someone file a suit to unseal the records, and then find that he has a perfectly legitimate birth certificate, and then have him play the "poor me" sympathy card and how the records were sealed so he could concentrate on the "real issues" confronting him.
He's there, it's a fact, deal with it.
