Fiocchi Ammo Return

[flowrie]

Here is an interesting story.
I purchased some Fiocchi 9mm XTP 147 gr ammo.from Midway. It was on sale and I think I got a pretty good deal.
It was for our church safety team to use and we wanted to make sure it would cycle through everyone’s firearm
Out of the 10 that were at the range, two had firearms the would not cycle the Fiocchi, a CZ and a Glock.
The problem was that the slide would not go to battery. It would get close but not fully close.
The first occasion I was able to extract the round by pulling back on the slide but with great difficulty. The second time it occurred on the CZ I could not extract the round by pulling back on the slide, so I hit the slide hard forward with my hand and it went into battery and I fired the round. After that we ceased using the ammo.
When I returned home I used my dial calipers to measure the COL. readings were 1.355 to 1.360. I emailed Fiocchi and they responded quickly and advised the COL should be 1.100. They want me to send the lot numbers to them and my address so they can send a fedex label to send the ammo back to them. I assume the bullet is not seated deep enough and the bullet was actually contacting the rifling.
Anyone ever run into such a situation with factory ammo?

[Tex1961]

Not really, but a student had a squib with some Maxtech 147g ammunition a few days ago.

[wheelgun1958]

When the 9mm mak silver bear first was available, I bought some. Running it through my Bulgarian mak I had a squib and didn't catch it. The next round left a nice bulge and I had to cut the barrel off to remove the slide. I removed the old barrel and did a die penetrant on the frame and slide. No cracks noted so I installed a new barrel and kept that thing for a couple years longer until giving to my brother. Its still going strong. Those maks are tough. I mentioned it on a makarov board and a factory rep from Russia contacted me about the ammo. I told him he had a potential good product but needs more quality control if they want to sell to the U.S. market. They dropped the heavy hollow point and re-released a lighter one with a shorter oal. I still never bought any more silver bear but hear its ok now.

[Excaliber]

I bought about 10 boxes of ARX Inceptor 9mm ammo from Ammo Shop Online and took it to the range along with my S&W M&P 9MM EZ pistol.

I discovered that the case diameters of this ammo are inconsistent and caused failures to go into battery. Some would feed into the chamber, some would stick going in, and some wouldn’t go all the way into the chamber at all, even with strong pressure. After 4 failures in the first 15 rounds, I stopped using the ammo.

I confirmed that the issue was with the ammo rather than a tight chamber in the pistol by checking the rounds with a Lyman cartridge inspection block which showed the same issue when some rounds would not drop all the way into the 9mm hole. Micrometer checks showed a variation of several thousandths in case diameter among rounds.

I sent a message to ARX through their website and an email to the vendor and asked for a response on how this should be managed. Both failed to respond at all which led me to believe they were aware of the issue and didn't want to acknowledge it.

Needless to say I won't be using either that ammo or that vendor in the future.

[flowrie]

Thanks for the stories.
I assume it is an uncommon occurrence with factory ammo to have issues, but not unheard of.
When reloading, I case gauge each case after I resize it, and then case gauge it again after loading and crimping.
So, what are everyone’s thoughts about reloading your own defensive ammo?
I’ve been hesitant to do so, but now reconsidering it.

[Excaliber]

Last year I encountered an out of spec oversized case in top quality defensive ammo. It was so far out the slide wouldn't go into battery even with considerable force behind it.

The best policy is to drop each cartridge you plan to carry for defensive use into a cartridge gauge block like the ones Lyman makes to make sure they'll feed when you need them.

[Rafe]

The best policy is to drop each cartridge you plan to carry for defensive use into a cartridge gauge block like the ones Lyman makes to make sure they'll feed when you need them.

This. It takes a minute, but I also like to drop range ammo in there, as well. Not infallible, but it's an easy way to see at a glance if something is off spec, and in the long run it's an inexpensive option.

I have three of the Lyman blocks that Excaliber mentioned. These are chunks of aluminum machined to the SAAMI minimum chamber specifications for each caliber. It's faster to do the check if you have a single block per caliber, but that's also more expensive and not as easy to drop into a range bag. I have one for pistol calibers (including .380 ACP, 9x19, 40 S&W, and .45 ACP plus 4 others that I don't shoot); one for rifle rounds that includes .223, 6.5 Grendel, 7.62x39, and 300 Blackout plus 4 others; and one for 6 different rifle rounds including .243, .270 Winchester, 30-30, .308, 30-06, and .300WSM. From memory, these ran around $40 each a few years ago. I bought mine from Midway.

Ammo prices slowed my amount of shooting and purchasing way down, but if I were to turn the clock back 10 years I'd have been better off buying a few single-caliber blocks to save time. If you buy a case of something and want to check every round, it definitely takes a while to drop them into a multi-caliber block one round at a time. But these little machined blocks are a great idea and require no other tools to check the OAL and case width.

[wheelgun1958]

The best policy is to drop each cartridge you plan to carry for defensive use into a cartridge gauge block like the ones Lyman makes to make sure they'll feed when you need them.

Or use a revolver.

[flowrie]

Yes, I use Hornandy case gauges for all of the pistol calibers that I reload, and LE Wilson’s for rifle calibers ( after sizing ) and I check COL when setting up seating dies.
But never used them on factory ammo.
Regarding the issue on my original post; the Fiocchi rounds would have passed a case gauge test, but the bullets were not seated deep enough. I would have needed to measure the COL. Perhaps I should begin sampling factory ammo.

[Excaliber]

The best policy is to drop each cartridge you plan to carry for defensive use into a cartridge gauge block like the ones Lyman makes to make sure they'll feed when you need them.

Or use a revolver.

Oh, the horror!!

[txtaxman]

...Regarding the issue on my original post; the Fiocchi rounds would have passed a case gauge test, but the bullets were not seated deep enough. I would have needed to measure the COL. Perhaps I should begin sampling factory ammo.

Spot checking could miss bad rounds. Removing the barrel and ensuring each bullet intended for self defense will drop in and out of the chamber, before loading the magazine would not take much effort. I have never before felt the need to gauge or "plunk" test factory rounds in the chamber of a semiautomatic pistol with U.S. made ammunition; perhaps it is time to rethink this.

[flowrie]

...Regarding the issue on my original post; the Fiocchi rounds would have passed a case gauge test, but the bullets were not seated deep enough. I would have needed to measure the COL. Perhaps I should begin sampling factory ammo.

Spot checking could miss bad rounds. Removing the barrel and ensuring each bullet intended for self defense will drop in and out of the chamber, before loading the magazine would not take much effort. I have have never before felt the need to gauge or "plunk" test factory rounds in the chamber of a semiautomatic pistol with U.S. made ammunition; perhaps it is time to rethink this.

Good idea! I think I will do just that, for my carry ammo.

[Rafe]

...Regarding the issue on my original post; the Fiocchi rounds would have passed a case gauge test, but the bullets were not seated deep enough. I would have needed to measure the COL. Perhaps I should begin sampling factory ammo.

The Lyman gauge blocks mentioned earlier are machined for depth as well as diameter. Not nearly as precise as a for-purpose COL checker, but if an overall length is noticeably off, you can tell.

[flowrie]

Sent 14 boxes ( 25 per box) back to Fiocchi.
They confirmed the issue, sent me 20 replacement boxes.
Very good customer service IMO.

[puma guy]

Sent 14 boxes ( 25 per box) back to Fiocchi.
They confirmed the issue, sent me 20 replacement boxes.
Very good customer service IMO.