Kenosha Wisconsin Shooter discussion

[jerry_r60]

Watching some of these witnesses it seems they try to spar with the attorneys, trying to guess what they are trying to get at and not answering directly, instead being coy with their answers. It seems in just about every case, the lawyers end up getting to what they want and the person has just undermined their credability just a bit instead of just letting the facts they have to share speak for themselves.

It doesn't negate the facts they have to say but it seems more times than not to dull what they have to give.

[philip964]

https://nypost.com/2021/11/11/lebron-ja ... -in-court/

Le Bron James mocks Kyle crying on the stand.

More reasons to not watch professional sports.

[AndyC1911]

It's annoying watching these lawyers spar over the fact that, when Kyle shot people, he didn't intend to kill them. The prosecutors are trying to hem the fences in towards a false dichotomy of either he meant to kill or he didn't.

Where's the whole middle ground of "I shot to stop the attack"?

[Beiruty]

It's annoying watching these lawyers spar over the fact that, when Kyle shot people, he didn't intend to kill them. The prosecutors are trying to hem the fences in towards a false dichotomy of either he meant to kill or he didn't.

Where's the whole middle ground of "I shot to stop the attack"?

I was disgusted to watch the lawyers debating when the defendant shot only in self-defense, and he was not an active shooter nor spraying bullets left and right.

[striker55]

I wish Rittenhouse had said he feared for his life. I didn't watch it all.

[G.A. Heath]

I wish Rittenhouse had said he feared for his life. I didn't watch it all.

Rittenhouse did say that if Rosenbaum got his gun then he was certain he would have been killed by the deceased. He didn't use the phrase, but he did say as much.

[rtschl]

Rittenhouse repeatedly stated he shot to stop the threat to his life and I think he also more than once said he was in fear of his life. I thought almost every prosecution witnesses ended up benefiting the defendant. But late yesterday and today I'm sure defense was flustered at what the judge was allowing in.

Jury instructions were interesting this morning. The state got very favorable Jury Instructions in my lay opinion.Two stood out:

1. Reckless endangerment charge (not sure of exact wording of count) of first shooting of Rosenbaum - all four rounds hit Rosenbaum, which is the guy chasing him and grabbed his weapon. But apparently one went through and bounced near reporter following (McGinnis).

2. Claim that Rittenhouse pointed his rifle at another person named Ziminski (who is facing other charges and was not called by the State). This apparently was the whole point of defense video expert - besides showing how fast the entire event happened from start of Rosenbaum chasing him to his attempted surrender to police. State's enhanced FBI drone footage they claim show Rittenhouse pointed gun at Ziminski which made him the one provoking the incident. Defense argues you can't tell from that grainy blown up photo. I would agree - not clear enough.

In the first one above, judge mentions the fact that he used FMJ instead of hollow point, that a jury could conclude he was reckless because he should have known that round could go through and he is going to let jury decide. See first tweet below.

Second one is puzzling to me but internet sleuths last night came through and if looking at photo unaltered - it looks like he is carrying like he always was. Otherwise to believe he pointed it at Ziminski is really a stretch at all the photos and video I looked at during the trial even with manipulated enhanced, do not convince me he pointed it at Ziminiski. See 2nd and 3rd Tweets below.

[AndyC1911]

Whichever way it goes, it's a fascinating look at how any of us could be painted by a prosecutor in a SD shooting - a graphic reminder to do our best to avoid as much as humanly possible.

[FastCarry]

Whichever way it goes, it's a fascinating look at how any of us could be painted by a prosecutor in a SD shooting - a graphic reminder to do our best to avoid as much as humanly possible.

And how your actions will be analyzed by teams of experts frame by frame. In a 30 frames per second video thats every .033 seconds.

[Deitz83]

All Kyle needs is 1 or 2 jurors to not agree. I can't see all of them agreeing on a guilty verdict.

[G.A. Heath]

All Kyle needs is 1 or 2 jurors to not agree. I can't see all of them agreeing on a guilty verdict.

The problem is the jury is from Kenosha where the majority of people think he's guilty just because he was there and the media told them so. The defense has worked very hard to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory on this one, they didn't even comfort or talk to Rittenhouse when he came off the witness stand.

[srothstein]

It's annoying watching these lawyers spar over the fact that, when Kyle shot people, he didn't intend to kill them. The prosecutors are trying to hem the fences in towards a false dichotomy of either he meant to kill or he didn't.

Where's the whole middle ground of "I shot to stop the attack"?

The difference between shot with the intent to kill and shot with the intent to stop the threat is the difference (in Texas) between murder and manslaughter. I would be very surprised if it was not the difference in Wisconsin between first and second degree homicide. That is why the prosecutors and defense argue so much on this.

That is why Amber Guyger, the female Dallas officer, was convicted of murder. She testified she intended to kill when she pulled the trigger.

[rtschl]

Not sure if the defense can put this in since evidence portion is closed. It sure makes one wonder about the FBI "losing" the HD footage:

1st video is pretty clear he kept rifle down.

2nd video keeps timing out - bet a lot of people are watching this one.

[rtschl]

And more:

[rtschl]