bblhd672 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 22, 2019 10:16 am
So Bonnen lied/exaggerated/mischaracterized/politicized whatever you want to call it. Most politicians do that without a second thought.
What Bonnen didn't lie about was McNutt going to his and other legislators homes while they were in Austin for the legislative session. And that is the crux of what McNutt did to reflect badly upon himself and law abiding gun owners in Texas who want less restrictions on their 2nd Amendment rights. That he did it in the nicest, gentlest manner possible doesn't mean he was right in doing it.
No elected official is going to go after the Speaker in an effort to oust him during the legislative session over this.
What he did and how he did it are examples of passive aggressive behavior. He drove across the state to show up at their homes and neighborhoods while the legislators weren't home to let them know he and his followers know where they live.
What he did is a passive aggressive method of doxing and intimidation.
I'm surprised by these comments. So we should accept bonnen's slanderous behavior/character attack as fine/normal, but someone acting as a gentleman having a conversation with a State Trooper is problematic?
I also missed the doxing and intimidation part? The trooper put the flier on the door, after a pleasant and light conversation. The fact the TXGR's own person delivered it is no more "intimidating" than hiring a person to go door to door.
Is this different than a politician sending political canvassers to my home asking for a vote. They have my address and know my name. Door hangers/fliers are now aggressive? I guess I should feel really threatened by about 50 different politicians.
Where have I indicated anything close to accepting Bonnen's slanderous behavior? Just because I disagree with McNutt driving across the state to show up at legislators' homes and publicizing it on the internet through his facebook group to thousands of his followers (doxing) doesn't mean I accept Bonnen's behavior. I have been against Bonnen before he was elected speaker and was blasted for it on here and scolded like a child. I think if you actually read my comments, some of which were part of a thread that has been locked or deleted, you would realize I take issue with how both men have handled themselves and the situation.
As McNutt said, he has thousands of followers in his facebook group and he has admitted to sharing the home information about 3 legislators through that group in order to put pressure on the legislators. The only reason he had a conversation with the trooper is because they intercepted him because McNutt has publicized his visit to two other legislators' homes and planned to visit Bonnen's. If he hadn't publicized his activities, the Troopers would not have been there in the first place.
Showing up at a political adversaries home when you know he is not home, which is private property, and publicizing it through the internet is not the same as sending something via mail or having random volunteer canvassers deliver something to be hung on a door. Just because you believe in the cause, doesn't mean the means is justified. Again, I am no fan of Bonnen and am in no way defending him, his actions, his comments or his conduct. I just do not agree with showing up at a political adversaries home, especially, when it is known he is not there.
Think of it this way. Let's say you and I have a serious disagreement over an issue and I am really upset that you disagree with me and then I happen to show up at your house to deliver a written explanation of my position. Oh, and I also deliver it to your neighbors hoping they would put pressure on you to agree with me. Then you find out I publicized it to 250,000+, or however many followers McNutt claims, would that change your opinion about me just canvassing your neighborhood?
Bottom line, Bonnen is a lying turncoat that played the system, got the power he wanted and then screwed many that supported him. McNutt crossed a line that he shouldn't have.
You're right, prior attempts to contact Bonnen were simply ignored. Now everyone paying attention to state politics can see him for what he actually is.
This was not a threat, intimindation, or Doxing, it was calling The Speaker out publicly and holding him to account. In return both Bonnen and his wife lied through their teeth in order to defame the man and his cause.
There are two people at fault here and neither of them are McNutt.
NRA Life MemberNRA Certified Instructor RSO, CRSO, USCCA Certified Instructor TX LTC licensed Instructor Personal/Family Protection and Self Defense Instructor. Without The First and Second Amendments the rest are meaningless.
There is absolutely ZERO wrong with going to put a flyer on a politician's door at their home whether they are there or not. Actually not even anything wrong with knocking on the door and talking about the issue with anyone that chose to answer the door (which didn't even happen) these politicians aren't Gods or emperor's that can't be bothered to be soiled by the presence of the people they want to rule. They sure as hell don't have a problem coming to MY door when I am not home and leaving literature on my door or knocking on it to talk to me about voting for them. Someone explain to me why you think THAT is no problem but us doing the same thing is a problem.
That being said, if ANYTHING about him being armed, harassing his wife or anything like that were true I would be against it and say it's wrong but that didn't happen. Also, I personally wouldn't have done it simply because it gave Bonnen the chance to do what he did. So it was bad strategy even if there is actually nothing wrong with doing it.
In the end Bonnen is demonstrated liar and should be removed from office however soon that can be and censured by the RPT. The act of putting one of the worst DemonRAT anti gun reps as the chair is reason enough. I am telling my rep and any others I talk to that they have to make Bonnen a one term speaker next session or I will withhold my vote and funds from them.
baytownb wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2019 11:15 am
There is absolutely ZERO wrong with going to put a flyer on a politician's door at their home whether they are there or not. Actually not even anything wrong with knocking on the door and talking about the issue with anyone that chose to answer the door (which didn't even happen) these politicians aren't Gods or emperor's that can't be bothered to be soiled by the presence of the dirt people they want to rule. They sure as hell don't have a problem coming to MY door when I am not home and leaving literature on my door or knocking on it to talk to me about voting for them. Someone explain to me why you think THAT is no problem but us doing the same thing is a problem.
That being said, if ANYTHING about him being armed, harassing his wife or anything like that were true I would be against it and say it's wrong but that didn't happen. Also, I personally wouldn't have done it simply because it gave Bonnen the chance to do what he did. So it was bad strategy even if there is actually nothing wrong with doing it.
In the end Bonnen is demonstrated liar and should be removed from office however soon that can be and censured by the RPT. The act of putting one of the worst DemonRAT anti gun reps as the chair is reason enough. I am telling my rep and any others I talk to that they have to make Bonnen a one term speaker next session or I will withhold my vote and funds from them.
FIFY
"When democracy turns to tyranny, the armed citizen still gets to vote." Mike Vanderboegh
"The Smallest Minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." – Ayn Rand
baytownb wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2019 11:15 am
...That being said, if ANYTHING about him being armed...
You know, I just assumed that he had a gun but I went back and watched it again, and I did not see a gun, or even a bulge under his (fairly snug) shirt... further, he said he flew to Austin from lubbock and was in a rent car. So I have to ask, did McNutt actually have a gun or even say he was armed? (if he did, I missed it)
They did a press conference yesterday and he again stated he was not armed. Also, as you said he flew in and rented a car, said the flight records would show he didn't check a gun. Sure as heck didn't have a "machine gun" as Bonnen's wife who apparently never even saw him was quoted as saying. All I have to do is look how DPS was acting with him. They CLEARLY saw nothing wrong with his behavior and didn't see it as intimidating at all. They appeared to enjoy talking to him. I trust DPS and if they didn't see any reason to ask him more questions or detain him and actually helped him put the flyer on his door and took one for themselves then who are any of us to say essentially that DPS was incompetent and let a threatening pyscho that was threatening Bonnen go? Because that's what you have to believe if you think what he did was threatening or dangerous.
It's wrong when crowds of idiots surround Cruz or McConnell at dinner and it's wrong when one idiot shows up at a Bonnen's door. Those activities are personal and outside of acceptable political discourse and should be mocked and punished as necessary.
Bonnen's lies are immaterial to McNutt's foolishness.
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if you have a problem with how someone is doing business you visit them where they conduct business unless you know them personally. If you know them personally then you pull them off to the side and have a heart to heart conversation.
With that said, the way that the speaker, his associates, and the media are playing this is entirely wrong. I suspect that the speaker may find himself in a situation similar to Ma' Richards last term unless he makes some serious and heartfelt changes.
How do you explain a dog named Sauer without first telling the story of a Puppy named Sig?
R.I.P. Sig, 08/21/2019 - 11/18/2019
G.A. Heath wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2019 7:01 pm
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if you have a problem with how someone is doing business you visit them where they conduct business unless you know them personally.
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if politicians don't want voters to contact them at home, they shouldn't contact voters at home.
G.A. Heath wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2019 7:01 pm
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if you have a problem with how someone is doing business you visit them where they conduct business unless you know them personally.
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if politicians don't want voters to contact them at home, they shouldn't contact voters at home.
Matthew 7:5
But the point is that Bonnen wasn't at home, if McNutt wanted to contact him then McNutt would have been in Austin. This wasn't an effort to contact Bonnen, at best it was a publicity stunt gone wrong and in politics publicity stunts backfire more often than not.
How do you explain a dog named Sauer without first telling the story of a Puppy named Sig?
R.I.P. Sig, 08/21/2019 - 11/18/2019
G.A. Heath wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2019 7:01 pm
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if you have a problem with how someone is doing business you visit them where they conduct business unless you know them personally.
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if politicians don't want voters to contact them at home, they shouldn't contact voters at home.
Matthew 7:5
But the point is that Bonnen wasn't at home, if McNutt wanted to contact him then McNutt would have been in Austin. This wasn't an effort to contact Bonnen, at best it was a publicity stunt gone wrong and in politics publicity stunts backfire more often than not.
Your right! After countless phone calls and trying to talk to him he gets no answer. How dare he campaign neighborhoods! (Sarcasm)
"Jump in there sport, get it done and we'll all sing your praises." -Chas
Is Bonnen's home within his district? That's still a "thing", right?
If so, there is nothing wrong with putting out those flyers to inform the Speaker's constituents of his failure to pursue the GOP agenda. I thought that was how politics is supposed to be played.
Putting one on Bonnen's door just sends the message, "We're letting the people who elected you know you're letting them down."
Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence. - John Adams
G.A. Heath wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2019 7:01 pm
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if you have a problem with how someone is doing business you visit them where they conduct business unless you know them personally.
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if politicians don't want voters to contact them at home, they shouldn't contact voters at home.
Matthew 7:5
But the point is that Bonnen wasn't at home, if McNutt wanted to contact him then McNutt would have been in Austin. This wasn't an effort to contact Bonnen, at best it was a publicity stunt gone wrong and in politics publicity stunts backfire more often than not.
G.A. Heath wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2019 7:01 pm
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if you have a problem with how someone is doing business you visit them where they conduct business unless you know them personally.
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but if politicians don't want voters to contact them at home, they shouldn't contact voters at home.
Matthew 7:5
But the point is that Bonnen wasn't at home, if McNutt wanted to contact him then McNutt would have been in Austin. This wasn't an effort to contact Bonnen, at best it was a publicity stunt gone wrong and in politics publicity stunts backfire more often than not.
Uh, McNutt didn't do anything wrong.
May have not been wrong, but it sure wasn’t smart.
What he did and how he did it are examples of passive aggressive behavior. He drove across the state to show up at their homes and neighborhoods while the legislators weren't home to let them know he and his followers know where they live.
