When is a school a school?

[Texas1836]

I've looked and cannot find this answered before. My kid attends a private K-12 school that is on a church campus and connected to the main church building. The church is not posted 30.06 or 30.07. According to the county appraisal district (which probably means nothing from a legal perspective), the entire parcel of land is owned by the church. However, the church uses the school building on Sundays for Sunday School classes for kids and adults.

Walking from the church into the school portion, there is no sign informing someone the building is a school. Since my kid attends school there, I know that building is a school but not everyone would have that knowledge. So my question is, when is that building a school for purposes of concealed carry? Is it still considered a school on Sundays? What about during the summer? I would love to legally carry there on Sundays but right now do not because I don't want to risk a felony.

I guess I could ask for permission to carry although I'm not sure if it would be the church or the school who would/could grant consent. Doing so could also cause negative consequences such as 30.06/30.07 signs going up at my kid's school which I definitely want to avoid.

[SewTexas]

a couple of comments, that may or may not really matter....
1. is it "accredited?"
2. I'm thinking that others who have mentioned church schools here have said that the state have said that they were told where to post which signs.
3. personally....I don't know, I think if there is no school going on there shouldn't be a problem, but I think that of public school too. so....

[Texas1836]

Yes it is accredited. My guess is the law may not address this specific situation. Or perhaps there’s an agreement between the church and school which specifies control, maintenance, etc. Of course the general public would have no knowledge of what is in such agreement. Again, there could be negative ramifications to asking either the church or school.

[ScottDLS]

Simple. When it is a zoo a library or a museum, or an amusement park. That’s when a school is a school.

[Keith B]

There is no full definition or case law on this. However, since the school is accredited, that pretty well nails it down that it is considered a private school per the Texas Education Association. If the church has a defined area that is used for classes and the school, then I would definitely stay clear of that area while carrying. If it is joint use area, then I would not enter that area when being used as the school. If the area is used strictly by the church, then I would argue that would be OK to carry with no 30.06/30.07.

[SewTexas]

There is no full definition or case law on this. However, since the school is accredited, that pretty well nails it down that it is considered a private school per the Texas Education Association. If the church has a defined area that is used for classes and the school, then I would definitely stay clear of that area while carrying. If it is joint use area, then I would not enter that area when being used as the school. If the area is used strictly by the church, then I would argue that would be OK to carry with no 30.06/30.07.

[Texas1836]

It pretty much is a joint use area. The school uses it exclusively M-F, and the church uses it exclusively Sunday mornings for Sunday school classes. The church also uses it on Wednesday nights.

Could a prosecutor charge you with a felony for carry in the building during Sunday morning? Is it worth the risk?

Hopefully the bill Mr. Cotton wrote will get passed and make this issue obsolete.

[treeman]

I wouldn't hesitate to conceal carry when church is going on and school is not in scession. In my opinion, considering some of the recent shootings, yes, I think it is worth the very small risk. Besides, concealed is concealed.

[Keith B]

It pretty much is a joint use area. The school uses it exclusively M-F, and the church uses it exclusively Sunday mornings for Sunday school classes. The church also uses it on Wednesday nights.

Could a prosecutor charge you with a felony for carry in the building during Sunday morning? Is it worth the risk?

Hopefully the bill Mr. Cotton wrote will get passed and make this issue obsolete.

If the building is owned by the church, and at the time you are carrying is being used for church functions, I don't see any way you would be charged for carrying in a school. You would want to stay out of those areas when school functions are going on though.

On a similar note though, many churches use schools to hold services when they first get started. A school building is ALWAYS a school building because of ownership, so don't get caught in that trap and accidentally carry at church (school).

[The Annoyed Man]

My church hosts a preschool during weekdays. It is also posted 30.07. On Sundays, I feel free to carry in any part of the building - including in the children’s areas. Nobody is going to say squat even if they did know I was carrying, but I carry concealed there anyway because of the ‘07 signs at all of the entrances.

[ScottDLS]

My church hosts a preschool during weekdays. It is also posted 30.07. On Sundays, I feel free to carry in any part of the building - including in the children’s areas. Nobody is going to say squat even if they did know I was carrying, but I carry concealed there anyway because of the ‘07 signs at all of the entrances.

Aren't you worried about "taking the (proverbial) ride". What if you run into a cop/ADA combo with a "bad attitude"?

[The Annoyed Man]

My church hosts a preschool during weekdays. It is also posted 30.07. On Sundays, I feel free to carry in any part of the building - including in the children’s areas. Nobody is going to say squat even if they did know I was carrying, but I carry concealed there anyway because of the ‘07 signs at all of the entrances.

Aren't you worried about "taking the (proverbial) ride". What if you run into a cop/ADA combo with a "bad attitude"?

Well, I never turn down a chance to take a ride, so......

[Venus Pax]

Our church also has a school; I've carried in the sanctuary on Sundays for years.

[Flightmare]

I ran into an interesting situation when a homeschool group rented our church sanctuary last month to have their 2018 highschool graduation ceremony. Then they hired me to run audio/video. I carry every sunday with no problems, just like many others there. However since I was participating in a "school sponsored activity", it dawned on me that it was "off limits" for the first time.

[SewTexas]

I ran into an interesting situation when a homeschool group rented our church sanctuary last month to have their 2018 highschool graduation ceremony. Then they hired me to run audio/video. I carry every sunday with no problems, just like many others there. However since I was participating in a "school sponsored activity", it dawned on me that it was "off limits" for the first time.

ummmm, homeschools do and don't count as "schools" when it counts as "school sponsored activites" and you would probably be surprised by how many guns are walking around homeschool co-ops. Homeschool moms are fierce. Homeschools are considered "private" schools and are not accredited.
All that to say....the activity was not "off limits".