Shooting on private property...

[Tass]

A friend has a working farm located in un-incorporated Waller County. Some new neighbors moved in (renters - not property owner) and have started shooting into a sometimes dry, shallow pond. The pond is located less than 100' from my friends fence and the only backstop the pond has is the loose dirt that was dumped after digging the pond, maybe 5' tall.

My friend has two concerns; 1) the shooters are shooting in the direction of holding pens (located along the fence) and areas where she works her livestock, and trains clients dogs to work stock. 2) the shooting goes non-stop, well into the night every weekend. Friend has livestock guardian dogs, several are sound sensitive - resulting in panicked dogs who must be locked up, thus removed from the livestock they are supposed to protect. One left the property on Sunday. Not to mention clients who pay for the training and must work in the vicinity and may also have sound-sensitive dogs.

Friend is not an anti or opposed to shooting on personal land, but she tried to explain to the people how their shooting was negatively affecting the dogs and livestock and that she was uncomfortable with their proximity to her working areas. After explaining her position two of the shooters looked at her and asked what was she going to do about it and then proceeded to shoot into the pond, in her direction. As far as I know, nothing impacted on friends side of the fence.

Friend called law enforcement, but they were not interested as shooting on private property is allowed.

Any suggestions for a course of action to get the shooters to change the direction/frequency of shooting? It is definitely not a safe set-up and is affecting her business. I suggested she contact the property owner but other than that it doesn't appear she has much recourse.

Tass

[carlson1]

Shooting in the country on private property is legal however if it proposes a danger and is unsafe then the Sheriff's Department can take action.

I would call LE every round until someone started listening. Maybe she could call the Sheriff personally until she get through or he calls her back.

Let us know how this turns out.

[Soccerdad1995]

Your friend is asking someone to stop doing something they have a legal right to do, on property they control. She asked nicely (I presume) and they declined to stop. So I think she has two alternatives here.

1. Contact the property owner and see if he can require the tenants to limit their shooting or change direction. The property owner may not have the power to actually do this (it would depend on the lease) and may decline even if they do have the power. This approach could also cause more tensions with the renters.

2. Give the renters a better alternative. Is your friend in a position to offer to help pay for part of the cost of building a better shooting range on the property? One with a better backstop and which does not front any other neighbors property (if that is even possible)?

This is a tough situation, but I fear that your friends options may be limited.

[warnmar10]

...
I would call LE every round until someone started listening. ...

This is what I do anytime I see someone open carrying. I just don't like open carry and I don't care if it is a "right".

[Tass]

Warnmar...not reading any sarcasm in that reply. A holstered pistol is not going to jump out and send a ricochet into livestock, dog or human. It also won't cause a sound-sensitive LGD to run into the next county.

[Tass]

Carlson & Soccerdad - thanks for the suggestions. I offered to suggest some backstop/direction alternatives but friend didn't think they would be open to any conversation. I did not get the impression these were disciplined shooters - none had any ear/eye pro on.

[carlson1]

...
I would call LE every round until someone started listening. ...

This is what I do anytime I see someone open carrying. I just don't like open carry and I don't care if it is a "right".

I am assuming you missed the first sentence so I highlighted the part that is important. It isn't LEGAL to place others in danger.

Shooting in the country on private property is legal however if it proposes a danger and is unsafe then the Sheriff's Department can take action.

[carlson1]

Carlson & Soccerdad - thanks for the suggestions. I offered to suggest some backstop/direction alternatives but friend didn't think they would be open to any conversation. I did not get the impression these were disciplined shooters - none had any ear/eye pro on.

Not only that, but they were shooting at water? If the rounds were to hit at a shallow angle, it can ricochet.

[Soccerdad1995]

Carlson & Soccerdad - thanks for the suggestions. I offered to suggest some backstop/direction alternatives but friend didn't think they would be open to any conversation. I did not get the impression these were disciplined shooters - none had any ear/eye pro on.

Disrespectful neighbors can take many forms and they are all challenging to deal with. Loud music, loose / dangerous dogs, etc. It can be a really tough situation all around if they are not open to a reasonable discussion and are also not actually breaking the law.

I sympathize for your friend and I would definitely caution them to be careful. Situations like this have a tendency to escalate.

[bblhd672]

A friend has a working farm located in un-incorporated Waller County. Some new neighbors moved in (renters - not property owner) and have started shooting into a sometimes dry, shallow pond. The pond is located less than 100' from my friends fence and the only backstop the pond has is the loose dirt that was dumped after digging the pond, maybe 5' tall.

My friend has two concerns; 1) the shooters are shooting in the direction of holding pens (located along the fence) and areas where she works her livestock, and trains clients dogs to work stock. 2) the shooting goes non-stop, well into the night every weekend. Friend has livestock guardian dogs, several are sound sensitive - resulting in panicked dogs who must be locked up, thus removed from the livestock they are supposed to protect. One left the property on Sunday. Not to mention clients who pay for the training and must work in the vicinity and may also have sound-sensitive dogs.

Friend is not an anti or opposed to shooting on personal land, but she tried to explain to the people how their shooting was negatively affecting the dogs and livestock and that she was uncomfortable with their proximity to her working areas. After explaining her position two of the shooters looked at her and asked what was she going to do about it and then proceeded to shoot into the pond, in her direction. As far as I know, nothing impacted on friends side of the fence.

Friend called law enforcement, but they were not interested as shooting on private property is allowed.

Any suggestions for a course of action to get the shooters to change the direction/frequency of shooting? It is definitely not a safe set-up and is affecting her business. I suggested she contact the property owner but other than that it doesn't appear she has much recourse.

Tass

Send your friend the link below. Won't be the desired answer as far as her able to legally do anything, but like most matters, communication between the parties will be the answer.
http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/archi ... 68396.html

[rotor]

...
I would call LE every round until someone started listening. ...

This is what I do anytime I see someone open carrying. I just don't like open carry and I don't care if it is a "right".

You are kidding, right?

[suthdj]

There are laws covering this stuff like acres, distance to population distance to homes, type of round etc.... i dont have links but they are on here somewhere.

[Tass]

Suthdj - she tried looking that up, but it appears Waller County has no restrictions. A quick phone/internet search showed a previous lawsuit filed by neighbors to try to stop a shooting range from being built. The ruling was Waller County had no restrictions regarding these activities. Not sure if the range was ever built.

[C-dub]

I thought the state did have some restrictions on this. Minimum of 10 acres and minimum distance of 300 feet from any structures on others' property. Counties could also have their own, but I thought the state did have these. No?

[carlson1]

I am no lawyer, but maybe this might help. I would guess this is where we hear the 10 acre minimum from.

§ 229.002. Regulation of Discharge of Weapon

A municipality may not apply a regulation relating to the discharge of firearms or other weapons in the extraterritorial jurisdiction of the municipality or in an area annexed by the municipality after September 1, 1981, if the firearm or other weapon is:

(1) a shotgun, air rifle or pistol, BB gun, or bow and arrow discharged:
(A) on a tract of land of 10 acres or more and more than 150 feet from a residence or occupied building located on another property; and

(B) in a manner not reasonably expected to cause a projectile to cross the boundary of the tract; or
(2) a center fire or rim fire rifle or pistol of any caliber discharged:
(A) on a tract of land of Search Term Begin 50 acres Search Term End or more and more than 300 feet from a residence or occupied building located on another property; and

(B) in a manner not reasonably expected to cause a projectile to cross the boundary of the tract.
§ 229.003. Regulation of Discharge of Weapon by Certain Municipalities

(a) This section applies only to a municipality located wholly or partly in a county:
(1) with a population of 450,000 or more;
(2) in which all or part of a municipality with a population of one million or more is located; and
(3) that is located adjacent to a county with a population of two million or more.
(b) Notwithstanding Section 229.002, a municipality may not apply a regulation relating to the discharge of firearms or other weapons in the extraterritorial jurisdiction of the municipality or in an area annexed by the municipality after September 1, 1981, if the firearm or other weapon is:
(1) a shotgun, air rifle or pistol, BB gun, or bow and arrow discharged:
(A) on a tract of land of 10 acres or more and:
(i) more than 1,000 feet from:
(a) the property line of a public tract of land, generally accessible by the public, that is routinely used for organized sporting or recreational activities or that has permanent recreational facilities or equipment; and
(b) the property line of a school, hospital, or commercial day-care facility
(ii) more than 600 feet from:
(a) the property line of a residential subdivision; and
(b) the property line of a multifamily residential complex; and
(iii) more than 150 feet from a residence or occupied building located on another property; and
(B) in a manner not reasonably expected to cause a projectile to cross the boundary of the tract;
(2) a center fire or rim fire rifle or pistol of any caliber discharged:
(A) on a tract of land of Search Term Begin 50 acres Search Term End or more and:
(i) more than 1,000 feet from:
(a) the property line of a public tract of land, generally accessible by the public, that is routinely used for organized sporting or recreational activities or that has permanent recreational facilities or equipment; and
(b) the property line of a school, hospital, or commercial day-care facility;
(ii) more than 600 feet from:
(a) the property line of a residential subdivision; and
(b) the property line of a multifamily residential complex; and
(iii) more than 300 feet from a residence or occupied building located on another property; and
(B) in a manner not reasonably expected to cause a projectile to cross the boundary of the tract; or
(3) discharged at a sport shooting range, as defined by Section 250.001, in a manner not reasonably expected to cause a projectile to cross the boundary of a tract of land.