PA: CHL Badge holder charged in murder at church

[philip964]

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/c ... -1.2618098

Disturbance at church over a seat, escalated by a man who walks up with his gun drawn and holding his CHL Badge in his other hand.

He shoots and kills a man in church after the man hits him and says "what are you going to do shoot me".

Charged with Manslaughter.

Giving anti gunners more ammunition.

[TexasJohnBoy]

Sounds like it was not a real concealed weapons permit (or whatever they call it in PA...)

The gun-toting suspect then flashed a Concealed Weapons Permit badge, which the district attorney’s office believes was purchased online.

(emphasis mine)

That's not a thing that should be able to just be 'purchased online' methinks.

[Keith B]

Sounds like it was not a real concealed weapons permit (or whatever they call it in PA...)

The gun-toting suspect then flashed a Concealed Weapons Permit badge, which the district attorney’s office believes was purchased online.

(emphasis mine)

That's not a thing that should be able to just be 'purchased online' methinks.

Easy to purchase online. Just Google it. Here's one http://www.chkadels.com/ProductDetail.a ... aQodPGcN-w

However, this doesn't mean the guy did or didn't have a valid concealed carry permit. That should come out in the future.

No matter, this guy's going to spend time in prison.

[Flightmare]

Maybe I'm weird. I would think that if you wanted it to be a "concealed" permit, you wouldn't want to go around flashing a badge. Don't get me wrong, I'm proud of my plastic. I use it every chance I get to purchase a new gun and skip the background check. But as far as being in the general public? I have no reason to reveal my concealed status.

[warnmar10]

Maybe I'm weird. I would think that if you wanted it to be a "concealed" permit, you wouldn't want to go around flashing a badge. Don't get me wrong, I'm proud of my plastic. I use it every chance I get to purchase a new gun and skip the background check. But as far as being in the general public? I have no reason to reveal my concealed status.

I figure once you draw your gun everyone will know anyway.

[howdy]

This guy had a history:

" His bail is set at $250,000. Storms told police that he was hoping to defuse the situation by showing a gun, which, according to court documents, he's done in the past."

[jmorris]

Maybe I'm weird. I would think that if you wanted it to be a "concealed" permit, you wouldn't want to go around flashing a badge. Don't get me wrong, I'm proud of my plastic. I use it every chance I get to purchase a new gun and skip the background check. But as far as being in the general public? I have no reason to reveal my concealed status.

It's usually marketed along the lines of after a shooting you hold up the badge so the LEOs know who the good guy is. As if they're going to decide who's the good guy is based on that. This guy was just totally in left field.

Besides, we all know the sash is the way to go.



Now if I could just find that darn tiara to go with it.

[Flightmare]

Maybe I'm weird. I would think that if you wanted it to be a "concealed" permit, you wouldn't want to go around flashing a badge. Don't get me wrong, I'm proud of my plastic. I use it every chance I get to purchase a new gun and skip the background check. But as far as being in the general public? I have no reason to reveal my concealed status.

It's usually marketed along the lines of after a shooting you hold up the badge so the LEOs know who the good guy is. As if they're going to decide who's the good guy is based on that. This guy was just totally in left field.

Besides, we all know the sash is the way to go.



Now if I could just find that darn tiara to go with it.

My mistake. Guess I need to get me a sash then. Who needs plastic?

[Countryside]

Upon reading the story...the stupidity of both men makes you just sort of shake your head.

Jesus said "Blessed are the peacemakers."

It appears neither of these clowns fell into that category.

[Flightmare]

http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/loc ... 65671.html

This version seems to have details that make the shooter seem slightly better, but only slightly. Instead of the shooter saying he showed his gun to defuse the situation, he showed his "badge". Sounds like another incident where a person who has their license to carry playing security at best, or wannabe LEO at worst. Either way, definitely poor judgement on his part.

[BCGlocker]

The problem is "Proportionality". You can't introduce a firearm (use of deadly force) into a fist fight. Once again, we see CCWers fail to MYOB (Mind Your Own Business).

[Abraham]

BCGlocker,

You stated: "You can't introduce a firearm (use of deadly force) into a fist fight."

If you're a young, big adult and you start punching a much smaller, elderly man, do you consider that a fist fight?

If so, I guess the smaller man is just supposed to tolerate being punched out...and perhaps die.

I don't consider such a scenario a fist fight.

Yes, fists were part of the equation, but in my opinion, they could be deadly weapons.

I think it could come under the header of deadly assault by the younger, bigger, stronger man.

Agree or disagree with such a scenario?

[BCGlocker]

BCGlocker,

You stated: "You can't introduce a firearm (use of deadly force) into a fist fight."

If you're a young, big adult and you start punching a much smaller, elderly man, do you consider that a fist fight?

If so, I guess the smaller man is just supposed to tolerate being punched out...and perhaps die.

I don't consider such a scenario a fist fight.

Yes, fists were part of the equation, but in my opinion, they could be deadly weapons.

I think it could come under the header of deadly assault by the younger, bigger, stronger man.

Agree or disagree with such a scenario?

"Proportionality" is just one of the consideration for use as a defense from prosecution. Others including disparity of force (old vs young, one vs. multiple assailants, female vs male..etc). If there is no immediate substantial risk of death or serious injury to you or another, deadly force should not be introduced.

[puma guy]

Upon reading the story...the stupidity of both men makes you just sort of shake your head.

Jesus said "Blessed are the peacemakers."

It appears neither of these clowns fell into that category.

Unarmed violent idiot meets violent idiot with a gun!