How About Open Carry

[txinvestigator]

I bow to your superior knowledge of Texas criminal statutes. My point remains, that an accidental exposure of your weapon is not likely to be viewed as a threat by most people. That does not mean all people will be as tolerant. All it takes is one person who sees the weapon you should be concealing and feels threatened by it, to create a situation that bodes nothing but ill for you.

I agree with you. I even wrote it was good to be careful. Why the hostility dude?

[Kyle Brown]

I know the reason that some say Concealed is good. I know the reason that some use for Open being good. I would like the Open just for the fact if that if reaching up or etc. . . the gun is exposed I am still legal. Does anyone think Open would ever be legal in Texas? I understand it is legal Louisana.

This question comes up regularly in most of my chl classes.

I have administered the proficency test for many years now and have observed that some students do not appear to be "ready" or able to defend their weapon against someone who would attempt to take the gun away by attempting to grab it from an open holster.

IMHO, if we are to have open carry in Texas, I feel we should have another "level" of licensing which would require the license holder to prove proficency in defense of the weapon. In order to accomplish this, the license holder attempting to qualify for carry open could be required to complete training and be tested in certain defensive skills taught to LEOs.

[gigag04]

IMHO, if we are to have open carry in Texas, I feel we should have another "level" of licensing which would require the license holder to prove proficency in defense of the weapon. In order to accomplish this, the license holder attempting to qualify for carry open could be required to complete training and be tested in certain defensive skills taught to LEOs.

I see your point entirely, but I couldn't disagree more. Here's why - we should be able to carry open, concealed or any other way we see fit because the 2nd Amendment says so. The fact that I even need a license to exercise this "right" at all is an abomination.

Show me someone who has thier free speech license. And to take the above analogy farther, if you are going to be a reporter, then you need a special level of free speech license.

My sarcasm's only purpose serves to illustrate the irony that the 2A is the only "right" which we must be licensed to exercise. I am in no way trying to be a jerk.

-nick

PS - some soldier to a homeowner: "can I see your license to prevent quartering of troops please? "

[jbirds1210]

I agree with everyone that has claimed Pro-Choice!!
I can see where open carry would create a distraction in the mall or grocery store. I think concealed is a better practice because it does not allow an agressor to plan an attack to disarm you. The element of surprise when someone sees the handgun is priceless.....kind of like the mastercard commercial.
However, when I am on my private property in Centerville.....you bet I carry openly!! I am concerned about the bad guys with fangs! If anyone shows up out there to surprise me....I am sure they would not (nor do I care if they are) offended or surprised by my carrying.

[Kyle Brown]

And, I see your point as well Nick. However, speech is not without regulation. For instance, you cannot stand in a crowded theather and yell "Fire."

[tomneal]

I have a Texas CHL because I wanted to carry a handgun while traveling. Yes, I know Texas law says you can carry while traveling BUT...
I wanted very clear laws to be on my side so, I got my CHL.

Over time, I have found having a handgun with me, all the time, is comforting.


I often carry a handgun openly. At IPSC matches, on my on property, and when I am deer hunting with a handgun. (For 5 years, the lease had a county road dividing it in half. If I crossed the road...)


When I carry openly, the laws aren't as clearly on my side. A LEO could hassle me because I have a CHL and my handgun isn't concealed. I don't think it would stand up in court BUT, the charges would cost me money.


I would prefer that the Texas Legislature allow me to decide wheither to carry openly or concealed.


While I wouldn't carry openly in a crowded store, I might carry openly
- at the ATM
- in an nearly empty store
- at the highway rest stop
- while driving
- other places where risks were higher and crowds were smaller.


I am informed enough to make that decision on my on.


My ultimate goal is "Alaska Carry".
Pack-em-if-you-got-em.
Get a license if you want to pack out-of-state, or avoid the instant check system.


Open carry for CHL holders is just a step along the way.

[Charles L. Cotton]

Over the years, I have had several conversations with a very pro-CHL lawyer. The reason he gave for keeping the Texas CHL as a Concealed Carry License, was that Open carry would motivate the anti-guners.

Tom is being kind and discrete. I’m the guy he’s talking about. I oppose open carry for one reason only and it’s a political one. The battle to pass the CHL statute in 1995 was bitterly fought. Passage of amendments to improve the statute was easier to accomplish, as CHL rapidly became a non-issue - exactly what we want!

My concern with open carry is that many anti-gunners and people who do not care one way or the other will see guns carried in restaurants, stores, theaters, etc. and will put great pressure on businesses to post 30.06 signs prohibiting handguns. If the local Home Depot store manager is faced with a bunch of complaints about customers with guns, he is going to do what he believes is in the best interest of his store to preserve sales and his job. If that means posting a 30.06 sign, then he’ll do it. I also fear it would result in great pressume on the Legislature to expand the locations that are "off limits" to CHL's, although I do not believe the CHL statute would be repealed entirely. Florida tried open carry, but only for one year. I do not know why open carry was repealed, but I suspect it was for the reasons I have stated, at least in part.

We have roughly 250,000 CHL holders in Texas, out of a population of 18 million to 20 million. The Alamo defenders had better odds! We don’t need to stir up opposition that does not currently exist. (I don’t want to have to fight for the same ground twice. )

If Texas had a history of legal open carry and open carry had actually been practiced, then I believe we would face an entirely different situation. However, based upon our history, I think there is a great deal to be said for the “out-of-sight-out-of-mind� aspect of concealed carry.

Regards,
Chas.

[tomneal]

Charles has just presented the best argument against Open Carry that I have ever heard and the only one that I consider valid.

[1TallTXn]

I like the idea of the freedom of open-carry, but Chas has some really good points. That made me rethink my theories.

Based on that how do so many other states have open-carry? did they have a practice of that from pre-CHL time? or is it something else?

I don't really know so I am asking

Thanks

[tomneal]

check out:

http://www.opencarry.org/

[KBCraig]

For instance, you cannot stand in a crowded theather and yell "Fire."

Can you cite the law that forbids you from doing so?

This gets thrown about a lot as if it's true. What's actually true is that you're responsible for your actions: inciting panic, lost revenue to the theater owner, injuries incurred in the evacuation, etc.

Kevin

[jimlongley]

Interesting that NY is shown as "non-permissive open carry" while in actuality if you have a NY state "Carry Permit" you can open carry.

Getting the permit is a whole 'nuther story.

[EricS76]

I oppose open carry for a few reasons. 1. You lose the advantage of everybody else, good and bad, not knowing you have a weapon. 2. There is the possibility of making yourself a target (shoot the guy with the gun first kind of BG thinking). 3. Having to deal with unwanted attention from anti's, LEO's, ect. 4. What Charles said about the 30.06 signs. You can bet that if open carry was allowed, the 30.06 signs would go up like crazy. I see very few pros and many cons to open carry, besides the ever-present "because it's our right to".

[txinvestigator]

For instance, you cannot stand in a crowded theather and yell "Fire."

Can you cite the law that forbids you from doing so?

This gets thrown about a lot as if it's true. What's actually true is that you're responsible for your actions: inciting panic, lost revenue to the theater owner, injuries incurred in the evacuation, etc.

Kevin

I can


Texas Penal Code
§42.06. False alarm or report.

(a) A person commits an offense if he knowingly initiates,
communicates or circulates a report of a present, past, or future
bombing, fire, offense, or other emergency that he knows is false or
baseless and that would ordinarily:

(1) cause action by an official or volunteer agency organized
to deal with emergencies;

(2) place a person in fear of imminent serious bodily injury;
or

(3) prevent or interrupt the occupation of a building, room,
place of assembly, place to which the public has access, or aircraft,
automobile, or other mode of conveyance.

(b) An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor
unless the false report is of an emergency involving a public primary
or secondary school, public communications, public transportation,
public water, gas, or power supply or other public service, in which
event the offense is a state jail felony.

[tomneal]

EricS76

I oppose open carry for a few reasons. 1. You lose the advantage of everybody else, good and bad, not knowing you have a weapon. 2. There is the possibility of making yourself a target (shoot the guy with the gun first kind of BG thinking).

No offense, but on items 1 & 2
It's none of your business.

I am an informed adult and am in better position to decide when and where I will open carry. I could come up with dozens of scenarios where I (and many others on this board) would open carry (if it was legal).

The arguments you have used against open carry could be used against carrying in a fanny pack, wearing a "Shoot me first" / "Photo-Journalist" vest, or wearing an untucked and/or unbuttoned Hawaiian shirt.


Stirring up the anti's and possibly getting more 30.06 signs posted is a legitimate concern for everyone that is Pro-CHL. This is a case where folks walking around in open carry could damage your rights.