Texas' Open Carry Concerns

[tiger1279]

? It may not be what YOU would do, and you may think they are hurting the prospects of our rights, but they are exercising their right, so what's the problem?

I do think they are hurting "the prospects of our rights." The problem is there is a difference between "legal" and "smart". Walking into a store carrying a rifle is a dumb way to make your point. It's bound to scare people and it only makes you look like a terrorist. It's also a good way to get shot!

[Swoops1]

I joined their FB page. If you disagree with some OCT folks get down right ugly. I can understand their message it just their methods I don't totally agree with. I've been in LA and MS quite a bit I recall seeing 1 open carry in MS. I must admit if I were somewhere and someone walked in with an AR slung at low ready my Spidey senses would go up a level.

[mojo84]

I'm not an OCT person but from the video's I have seen they didn't do anything legally wrong. It is hard to preach for open carry hand gun laws and then condemn folks that are walking around in stores on the streets with open carried rifles. It may have freaked some folks out, but if they can legally do it, why condemn them? It may not be what YOU would do, and you may think they are hurting the prospects of our rights, but they are exercising their right, so what's the problem?

How about we put it in different terms and see if helps some relate.

Think of a beautiful well endowed woman walking through the mall in the smallest teeny weeny bikini, you know the one that just has three little cloth patches attached by strings, one can get. It is legal but is it appropriate? How about a well endowed man in the smallest tightest g-string or speedo one can get? It's legal but is it appropriate? How about a young couple sitting in the next booth and they are just going to town kissing, groping and making out? Legal but appropriate? How about the group of guys at the next table laughing, being loud and using foul language that everone including your wife and children can hear? Legal but inappropriate. I could go on and on but hopefully you get the picture.

All of these people are just exercising their rights. Are you ok with this behavior in a public place? Does it help you understand just because something is legal it may not be appropriate? There are times and places that carrying a rifle just are not appropriate even though it is legal. To you think the property owner has the right to make rules against such behavior on or in their property?

[Right2Carry]

I'm not an OCT person but from the video's I have seen they didn't do anything legally wrong. It is hard to preach for open carry hand gun laws and then condemn folks that are walking around in stores on the streets with open carried rifles. It may have freaked some folks out, but if they can legally do it, why condemn them? It may not be what YOU would do, and you may think they are hurting the prospects of our rights, but they are exercising their right, so what's the problem?

The way they went about exercising their right was completely wrong. Their tactics poisoned the well and turned folks off. They weren't helping second amendment rights they were hurting them!

[Jeff B.]

It's my opinion that the well worn and dis-proven "wild west" scenario is being hyped by the Anti's. In the end, the hullaballo will prove to be nothing and folks will get used to the OC rules and occasional OC'er. I like many here, don't plan to OC. I feel that CC is the best policy and practice FOR ME.

ONTOH, I also believe that OC should be legal without a permit, as it is in many other states. But, that's simply my opinion. I'm not going to attack anyone for disagreeing or having a different opinion. I save my bile and venom for those who would infringe, impede, revoke or suspend my rights to keep an bear arms.

I or anyone here should make a mental note to dig up this topic in a year and see if we can reflect on what's occurred.

Regards,

Jeff B.

[Vol Texan]

I'm not an OCT person but from the video's I have seen they didn't do anything legally wrong. It is hard to preach for open carry hand gun laws and then condemn folks that are walking around in stores on the streets with open carried rifles. It may have freaked some folks out, but if they can legally do it, why condemn them? It may not be what YOU would do, and you may think they are hurting the prospects of our rights, but they are exercising their right, so what's the problem?

We're not saying they broke the law, but what they did was not prudent. Their childish antics did not improve the image of 2nd Amendment supporters here in Texas.

[OlBill]

Businesses are apprehensive about open carry in Texas because of OCT, OCTC, CATI, etc. The stunts they pulled in advance of and during the legislative session was a PR nightmare for gun rights. Add in a complicit media that was all too happy to show hours of video of "all of those yahoo gun nuts", and you have business owners and trade groups aggressively researching what to do to keep "them" out. To the uninitiated, the above named groups are the only gun owners they've been aware of seeing. And that ain't a pretty picture.

This is spot on.

Agreed

[OlBill]

I'm not an OCT person but from the video's I have seen they didn't do anything legally wrong. It is hard to preach for open carry hand gun laws and then condemn folks that are walking around in stores on the streets with open carried rifles. It may have freaked some folks out, but if they can legally do it, why condemn them? It may not be what YOU would do, and you may think they are hurting the prospects of our rights, but they are exercising their right, so what's the problem?

They didn't. Neither are the stores that are putting up the signs. They wanted a reaction, the stores are reacting.

It is not a question of legality. What they did only works if the other side can only react one way. That isn't the case here.

[Charles L. Cotton]

I'm not an OCT person but from the video's I have seen they didn't do anything legally wrong. It is hard to preach for open carry hand gun laws and then condemn folks that are walking around in stores on the streets with open carried rifles. It may have freaked some folks out, but if they can legally do it, why condemn them? It may not be what YOU would do, and you may think they are hurting the prospects of our rights, but they are exercising their right, so what's the problem?

There's a question I often ask allegedly pro-gun folks who are more "aggressive" than is prudent in the political arena. (I'm not referring to you, but to the few in OCT leadership and in their "membership" who caused untold harm to the open-carry cause.) "Do you want to make a different, or merely a point?"

You are correct, carrying rifles and shotguns into stores, restaurants and on public streets is legal, but it was not prudent. The motivation in the eyes of the nonaligned public was to scare and intimidate, not to educate as OCT claimed. OCT was telling the Legislature "if you won't let us openly carry handguns, then we'll carry things that scare the public even more." Whether this was the actual motivation is irrelevant, it is what the public perceived as their motivation. The vast majority of Texas gun owners realized the negative impact of OCT tactics, yet their calls for restraint and statesmanlike campaigning for open-carry fell on deaf ears. OCT made passage of licensed open-carry much more costly in terms of political capital. The widespread posting of 30.07 signs and no open-carry statements by businesses are the direct result of imprudent tactics used by OCT. Their conduct, while perfectly lawful, was damaging to Texas gun owners not only prior to and during the 2015 Texas Legislative Session, but now during the implementation of open-carry. This is why rational gun owners condemn OCT, OCTC, CATI, TC, etc.

The fact that OCT, Grisham, Carry Texas and Terry Holcomb now take credit for passing licensed open-carry adds salt to the wound. Everything they wanted in an open-carry bill did not happen. They wanted unlicensed open-carry, but they didn't get it. They wanted TPC §30.06 amended to apply to both open and concealed carry, but they didn't get it. They spoke long and loud against any licensed open-carry bill because that would be "begging for permission slip" and a "tax" on a constitutional right, but licensed open-carry (NRA/TSRA's HB910) is what passed.

Back to OCT's position on amending TPC §30.06 for a moment. If OCT had gotten its way, we'd be seeing 30.06 signs popping up instead of 30.07 signs. The end result would a huge blow to self-defense because stores would have been forced to ban concealed-carry if they wanted to ban open-carry. This is precisely what OCT wanted!

Legal doesn't necessarily mean prudent in the political arena. It would be legal for me to go to a legislative hearing in the Capitol wearing cutoff shorts and a t-shirt, but it wouldn't be prudent. My imprudent conduct would not help pass the bill on which I was testifying. Make no mistake, OCT tactics were designed to put CJ Grisham in the public eye, not to pass open-carry. He got his 15 minutes of infamy while the NRA brought open-carry to Texas.

Chas.

[SA_Steve]

"It's legal" they say

not for long if they keep it up

[SewTexas]

And I was in TN in Oct and did not see a single OC. What I did see were three separate places that I had to go back to the car and disarm or leave. One a super large mall, one a major restaurant and the other a small business (RC models and radios). So?

interesting, I was there in June, I don't remember seeing a single sign. I didn't go to a super mall though, we've got those here, and some of them are posted.....so that's not any different

[NavyVet1959]

The problem here in Texas is that we've lived under the yoke of Yankee oppression for so long that people who *claim* to be pro-2nd-Amendment actually think that "some" infringements upon our natural right to bear arms is acceptable. What part of "SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED" is so hard to understand?

[cb1000rider]

Pretty sure it wasn't the Yankees that did this to us...

[Breny414]

Carpetbaggers?

[jed]

Pretty sure it wasn't the Yankees that did this to us...

I think it was. Texans lost almost all gun rights during reconstruction.