Police confiscated my weapon

[SA_Steve]

I never thought anything about MC's before Waco and this thread.

Sounds like the members of MC's have a lot of time on their hands to be constantly validating each others cuts/patches/rockers/%.

Would not be much fun for me.

[Abraham]

Stew,

If you want to be believed and accepted here, you'll have to work a bit harder at convincing the members you're being mistreated by LE by being more forthcoming.

If not interested in being accepted here, O.K., but the perception at this point is you are quite possibly a member of an outlaw biker gang and as such few here will provide you much sympathy or support.

If you're not part of an outlaw MC, why not provide enough information to exonerate yourself in the eyes of the members here?

[MONGOOSE]

First of all, I have had my issues with motor cycle ( club/gang members. ) However, this is a slippery slope. Lookike a thug to who? I'm sure some of the anti gunners would classify all of us a diviant thugs. If someone is legally exercising their 2A rights legally ( CHL for now). I don't care what club or gang they belong to or what they look like.....next all AQHA members.....we abuse animals don't you know.

[VoiceofReason]

Stew,

If you want to be believed and accepted here, you'll have to work a bit harder at convincing the members you're being mistreated by LE by being more forthcoming.

If not interested in being accepted here, O.K., but the perception at this point is you are quite possibly a member of an outlaw biker gang and as such few here will provide you much sympathy or support.

If you're not part of an outlaw MC, why not provide enough information to exonerate yourself in the eyes of the members here?

So, what you are saying is that if someone is a member of an outlaw biker gang with no record, It is OK for the police to arrest them for no turn signal, search their bike, take their legal firearm, refuse to return it and have their CHL revoked?

Just asking.

[EEllis]

Do you belong to a recognized "MC"? Did you have any patches visible that would lead the PD to believe you were?

I'm interested in your case from a purely non partisan perspective. I have friends who ride in clubs and have no association with known outlaw "clubs".

Thanks.

He has used the "lingo" that people use when trying to give the impression they belong to an "outlaw" club but denies it is such, nor will he just state the name of the club. To me it sure seems like he is either trying to give a certain impression or he is in a club, or tributary club, that could very well meet the definition of a "Gang". Heck he won't even confirm or deny that he wears a 3 patch cut. If he is playing the same game with the cops then no wonder he didn't get his gun back.

EElis,

Get off the gas why don't cha. My patch is a 3 piece patch along with every other law enforcement motorcycle club who wears a 3 piece parch but are not profiled as such so it's obviously you know nothing of the mc culture so I won't debate that with you. I don't need to state the name of my club or the name of my job or my full name on a open forum that's irrelevant. I'm simply speaking on the CHL issue and not engage in a motorcycle club debate that's for a different site.

Yep confirms my belief. Sure there are several LEO and Fire clubs that have 3 piece patches, and more that don't, but it's pretty rare generally speaking and in all but a few cases the non outlaw 3 patch wear the patches together so at a distance it looks like one patch. The cops get to wear them because 1% won't mess with them and they don't really compete with a 1% club. Generally speaking only outlaw, public service, and affiliated MC get to wear a third patch without concern for reprisals. The shooting at Twin Peaks a little while ago was because a MC added a bottom rocker. 7 of their members were killed. So yea it is relevant and also relevant that you wanted to frame your story and just give out the info that you allow us to have and then seem disgruntled when questions get asked about other factors. I get that I'm calling into question your, call it status, but I've stated why and instead of saying you disagree and leaving it alone or fully explaining the situation you have basically attacked . I'm wrong because I know nothing about MC's. Except I obviously do know a bit and you haven't stated anything that I have gotten wrong or where your belief that I know nothing comes from. Heck you may belong to a christian MC because I've know more than a few guys who do, though I've never met any with a full three patch w/ a separate bottom rocker. I'm just saying that your behavior and the way you avoid questions while dropping little bits of info lead me to think there is more to the story.

[EEllis]

Stew,

If you want to be believed and accepted here, you'll have to work a bit harder at convincing the members you're being mistreated by LE by being more forthcoming.

If not interested in being accepted here, O.K., but the perception at this point is you are quite possibly a member of an outlaw biker gang and as such few here will provide you much sympathy or support.

If you're not part of an outlaw MC, why not provide enough information to exonerate yourself in the eyes of the members here?

So, what you are saying is that if someone is a member of an outlaw biker gang with no record, It is OK for the police to arrest them for no turn signal, search their bike, take their legal firearm, refuse to return it and have their CHL revoked?

Just asking.

I'm saying that gang members can't carry by law. That members of MC's can in some circumstances be considered gang members. If that is the case here, and we haven't really been told why they cops are trying to have them pull the CHL, then it is a matter of fact to be decided by a court.

[cprems]

First of all, I have had my issues with motor cycle ( club/gang members. ) However, this is a slippery slope. Lookike a thug to who? I'm sure some of the anti gunners would classify all of us a diviant thugs. If someone is legally exercising their 2A rights legally ( CHL for now). I don't care what club or gang they belong to or what they look like.....next all AQHA members.....we abuse animals don't you know.

The distinction between exercising your 2A rights and being associated with an OMC is night and day. There is a question on the form for CHL that expressly asks "if you are a member of a gang" WE don't get to define what "gang" is, the DPS and LEO/FBI do!

So, if he is a member or associate of a known OMC, he can expect the full force and weight of law enforcement to be brought against him. A CHL does not shield you from any "gang" associations regardless if his record is squeaky clean. Being a member or associate is cause for revocation.

If he's not, I support him 100% and hope this turns out well.

If I misunderstood your question or comment, please feel free to clarify or correct me. At this point in time, the OP has been vague with answers. That is his right but it leads to interpretation and that interpretation is where the law and most posters fall.

[Abraham]

VOR,

Is that the sum of it?

He IS an outlaw bike gang member and essentially has been framed?

No, I don't think it right to arrest anyone for no turn signal, search their bike, take their legal firearm, refuse to return it and have their CHL revoked.

I do it find rather odd such an individual (if in fact he is an MC outlaw and I don't think that's been admitted to) would come onto a forum such as this one (comprised of a very law abiding bunch of bourgeois burghers) and complain about LE mistreatment.

It doesn't add up...

[MONGOOSE]

I don't remeber the gang affiliation question on my CHL app. I don't doubt your word that it is there. I do have a problem with a bunch of State or Federal buerocrates defining what an outlaw gang is.

[E.Marquez]

So, what you are saying is that if someone is a member of an outlaw biker gang with no record, It is OK for the police to arrest them for no turn signal, search their bike, take their legal firearm, refuse to return it and have their CHL revoked?

Just asking.

Yes, correct, if you are affiliated with a criminal gang, ie street gang, drug gang, or MC designated as a Gang by law enforcement...then the following applies

PC §46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS.
(C) a member of a criminal street gang, as defined by Section 71.01
and
Section 71.01
(d) "Criminal street gang" means three or more persons having a common identifying sign or symbol or an identifiable leadership who continuously or regularly associate in the commission of criminal activities.

You may not agree, you may not like it, but if the state or feds have designated the group you associate with as a gang you are not able to lawfully carry a concealed handgun. Doing so will likely cause confiscation and criminal proceedings.
None of which is obviously relative to the OP as he has refused to state what MC he is associated with. Without that piece of info,,, there is no way to say if he is statutorily worng, or being done an injustice.

[E.Marquez]

I don't remeber the gang affiliation question on my CHL app. I don't doubt your word that it is there. I do have a problem with a bunch of State or Federal buerocrates defining what an outlaw gang is.

I don't see it in the CHL application
http://txdps.state.tx.us/InternetForms/ ... HL-78A.pdf
But you do have to sign an afidavitd that states you understand the applicable laws
http://txdps.state.tx.us/InternetForms/Forms/CHL-86.pdf

And clearly it is part of the law...as cited above in another post.

So as part OF the application PROCESS you are acknowledging you are not in violation of the law,, or committing perjury (false statement,,or something not sure what law would cover it) by signing that affidavit knowing you are affiliated in a MC that is designated as a gang by law enforcement.

[EEllis]

None of which is obviously relative to the OP as he has refused to state what MC he is associated with. Without that piece of info,,, there is no way to say if he is statutorily worng, or being done an injustice.

I don't want to claim that he is wrong or a 1% or anything like that personally. I'm just not going to worry about it because he clearly doesn't want to clear up the issue.

[E.Marquez]

None of which is obviously relative to the OP as he has refused to state what MC he is associated with. Without that piece of info,,, there is no way to say if he is statutorily worng, or being done an injustice.

I don't want to claim that he is wrong or a 1% or anything like that personally. I'm just not going to worry about it because he clearly doesn't want to clear up the issue.

Same here.. Im curious ...well because mistakes, personal opinion (on a LEO's, ADA, Judge) do sometimes rear thier ugly head when it is the law that should reign supreme.. and sometimes a person who is in the worng and unknowingly,,,or knowingly pushing for something that have no rights to.

[carlson1]

We can make assumptions all day long. The OP has stated he was looking into a civil law suit so I doubt he is going to answer all of the cross examination questions at this time.

[cprems]

I don't remember the gang affiliation question on my CHL app. I don't doubt your word that it is there. I do have a problem with a bunch of State or Federal bureaucrats defining what an outlaw gang is.

My apologies, I had to go research the question. It's in the CHL hand book on page 44 under PC §46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. I thought it was on the application, it isn't on the new one.