Texans Respond to License to Carry

[oljames3]

This is from the first post in this thread:
====================================
Our fellow Texans are not waiting for CHL holders to correct their signage or for LTC holders to show up openly carrying. The discussions are already happening. I feel it is a good idea to know what they are saying.

For myself, I'll continue learning what I can about how my fellow Texans perceive the change that is coming 1/1/16.
====================================

Back to the present:
I am neither an opponent nor a proponent of any mode of carry. I've done my due diligence and made my own decision. I encourage y'all to do your own. As I have stated many times in other threads, I will continue to carry as I always have: open where I can, concealed where best, disarmed if I must. All others can make their own decisions.

I am stating that beating each other up over correcting non-compliant signage is counter productive. Correcting the same is not required and is probably not necessary as the word is already being spread by the media, law enforcement, lawyers, business associations, and educational institutions. I find it prudent to know what is being said.

Commentary:
http://offthekuff.com/wp/?p=69666

Law enforcement to civic group:
http://www.couriernews.com/view/full_st ... tary-Club?

Business management firm:
http://www.businessmanagementdaily.com/ ... -next-year

Security officers and trespass:
http://securitytrainingnews.com/open-ca ... -property/

105 days.

[mojo84]

So what happens when every business post anti gun signs?

How likely do you think this will be?

Since moving to Texas, very likely. You have more laws here than any pro gun state I feel. I'm in San Antonio. We almost got Acevedo as a chief, he hates OC. Our mayor or whatever she is big liberal too. So from what I've seen since moving here...likely. My state had CC and constitutional open carry. We had no problems, and hardly anyone OC. Some did to wal mart or out to eat and no one complained. We've even become a swing state. So I find it odd Texas has so many laws. I need a permit to sell my own _______ in my own yard for Christ sake. We couldn't even carry knives! Of course that contradicts my argument since they just passed a law allowing us to carry in San Antonio again. Still, you see where I am coming from? I won't be open carrying, and I'm glad it's an option. IT just seems we're all accepting unconstitutional laws, like CC permits for example.

The problem I have with your post is using "every". That just isn't accurate. Yes, we will initially see more signs as businesses just don't know what to expect and the subject is getting a lot of attention. However, that will fade over time and we may just end up as gun friendly as whichever state from which you came.

Out of curiosity, what is the origination of your user name? Is it a play on certain words?

[bigity]

Texas Tech here in Lubbock is supposed to have their guidelines for campus carry posted by Oct 1. I'll look for them then and post a link.

bigity, I am actually part of the faculty here at Texas Tech and I have emailed numerous members of the board asking them if there was any open spots for me to sit on it as far as the campus carry guidelines. As you figured, all emails have gone ice cold. Why would they want a law abiding citizen with a CHL to have their input right? lol

I would imagine they feel about the same as every other university. By they, of course, I mean the people 'in charge', not the working stiffs.

[meddafuxa]

So what happens when every business post anti gun signs?

How likely do you think this will be?

Since moving to Texas, very likely. You have more laws here than any pro gun state I feel. I'm in San Antonio. We almost got Acevedo as a chief, he hates OC. Our mayor or whatever she is big liberal too. So from what I've seen since moving here...likely. My state had CC and constitutional open carry. We had no problems, and hardly anyone OC. Some did to wal mart or out to eat and no one complained. We've even become a swing state. So I find it odd Texas has so many laws. I need a permit to sell my own _______ in my own yard for Christ sake. We couldn't even carry knives! Of course that contradicts my argument since they just passed a law allowing us to carry in San Antonio again. Still, you see where I am coming from? I won't be open carrying, and I'm glad it's an option. IT just seems we're all accepting unconstitutional laws, like CC permits for example.

The problem I have with your post is using "every". That just isn't accurate. Yes, we will initially see more signs as businesses just don't know what to expect and the subject is getting a lot of attention. However, that will fade over time and we may just end up as gun friendly as whichever state from which you came.

Out of curiosity, what is the origination of your user name? Is it a play on certain words?

I doubt it will be every. I think it will be a lot though. That just comes from what I've seen so far. You all would know more since you've lived here longer. From my views though, this isn't such a firearm friendly state unless you're in the country. I hope I'm wrong. Once these signs are up though, I don't see how they'll ever come down.

[The Annoyed Man]

It will be interesting to see if this has kicked the ant pile. We may see more 30.06 signs since this has been brought to the forefront. Hope people will settle down.

This has been my prediction. I do believe that eventually it will settle down as people become accustomed to the law. BUT.... I think we WILL see a spate of preemptive 30.07 postings, accompanied by previously non-existent 30.06s as business owners educate themselves and decide to "err on the side of caution".

[ScottDLS]

It will be interesting to see if this has kicked the ant pile. We may see more 30.06 signs since this has been brought to the forefront. Hope people will settle down.

This has been my prediction. I do believe that eventually it will settle down as people become accustomed to the law. BUT.... I think we WILL see a spate of preemptive 30.07 postings, accompanied by previously non-existent 30.06s as business owners educate themselves and decide to "err on the side of caution".

I think we may be underestimating the trouble that it takes to properly post both signs. They are big, and in the case of 30.07 must be placed at all entrances, and need to follow the correct wording. Since 1997 I've probably seen 75% business get it wrong w/ just 30.06, and that was the minority that tried. I think we'll see a flurry of half-"baked" attempts come January 1, then a lot of nothing. Unless, of course, tons of self appointed 30.0x enforcers come along with measuring tapes and code books and NO GUNS, NO BUSINESS cards.

[K.Mooneyham]

It will be interesting to see if this has kicked the ant pile. We may see more 30.06 signs since this has been brought to the forefront. Hope people will settle down.

This has been my prediction. I do believe that eventually it will settle down as people become accustomed to the law. BUT.... I think we WILL see a spate of preemptive 30.07 postings, accompanied by previously non-existent 30.06s as business owners educate themselves and decide to "err on the side of caution".

I think we may be underestimating the trouble that it takes to properly post both signs. They are big, and in the case of 30.07 must be placed at all entrances, and need to follow the correct wording. Since 1997 I've probably seen 75% business get it wrong w/ just 30.06, and that was the minority that tried. I think we'll see a flurry of half-"baked" attempts come January 1, then a lot of nothing. Unless, of course, tons of self appointed 30.0x enforcers come along with measuring tapes and code books and NO GUNS, NO BUSINESS cards.

I would think that it would be much easier for a business to simply ask an open carrier to leave than to go through all that trouble of printing and posting those big ol' signs on the front of their businesses. I'm hoping that a lot of this will come to nothing after a first nervous spell, not counting those who are flat-out anti, or who are forced by "corporate" to be anti.

[RiderDean]

I work at a place where the open carry issue has had them doing research on prohibiting firearms in the building. We have 26 locations, and they will be putting up 30.07 and 30.06 at all of them...

This was the Blow-Back I was worried about with OC.

[Mike S]

I work at a place where the open carry issue has had them doing research on prohibiting firearms in the building. We have 26 locations, and they will be putting up 30.07 and 30.06 at all of them...

This was the Blow-Back I was worried about with OC.

Yup.

[Taypo]

It will be interesting to see if this has kicked the ant pile. We may see more 30.06 signs since this has been brought to the forefront. Hope people will settle down.

This has been my prediction. I do believe that eventually it will settle down as people become accustomed to the law. BUT.... I think we WILL see a spate of preemptive 30.07 postings, accompanied by previously non-existent 30.06s as business owners educate themselves and decide to "err on the side of caution".

I think we may be underestimating the trouble that it takes to properly post both signs. They are big, and in the case of 30.07 must be placed at all entrances, and need to follow the correct wording. Since 1997 I've probably seen 75% business get it wrong w/ just 30.06, and that was the minority that tried. I think we'll see a flurry of half-"baked" attempts come January 1, then a lot of nothing. Unless, of course, tons of self appointed 30.0x enforcers come along with measuring tapes and code books and NO GUNS, NO BUSINESS cards.

I would think that it would be much easier for a business to simply ask an open carrier to leave than to go through all that trouble of printing and posting those big ol' signs on the front of their businesses. I'm hoping that a lot of this will come to nothing after a first nervous spell, not counting those who are flat-out anti, or who are forced by "corporate" to be anti.

I'd guess that you'll see a lot of unposted locations giving verbal notice, at least at first. There are some businesses taking a wait and see approach, which I tend to respect a lot more than a knee jerk reaction months prior. The behavior of OC folks is going to have a big impact on those decisions as well.

[oljames3]

From Brenham Banner-Post online Posted: Friday, September 18, 2015 1:00 pm (subscription required)
http://www.brenhambanner.com/news/counc ... 3773.10872

"One of the key issues that must be answered, said City Attorney Cary Bovey, is the legal definition of “premises.”
Brenham’s City Hall also houses its municipal court, and Bovey said it’s unclear whether that would mean handguns would be barred from the entire building or just in the court area."

"Several city council members said the new law was unfairly putting the onus on cities to decide how much to restrict open carry.
Cities could be viewed “as the ones that’s restricting your right to carry,” said Councilwoman Mary Barnes Tilley.
“I think there was so much not considered here,” she said. “It puts such a burden on us.” "

This is an example of the opinions being formed by Texas city governments and their lawyers. I'm looking for constructive, proactive suggestions on how we, as individuals, can positively affect decisions made by our local authorities.

For my part, I have enrolled in my city's Citizen Police Academy to gain insight and form beneficial relationships.

[TexasCajun]

From Brenham Banner-Post online Posted: Friday, September 18, 2015 1:00 pm (subscription required)
http://www.brenhambanner.com/news/counc ... 3773.10872

"One of the key issues that must be answered, said City Attorney Cary Bovey, is the legal definition of “premises.”
Brenham’s City Hall also houses its municipal court, and Bovey said it’s unclear whether that would mean handguns would be barred from the entire building or just in the court area."

"Several city council members said the new law was unfairly putting the onus on cities to decide how much to restrict open carry.
Cities could be viewed “as the ones that’s restricting your right to carry,” said Councilwoman Mary Barnes Tilley.
“I think there was so much not considered here,” she said. “It puts such a burden on us.” "

This is an example of the opinions being formed by Texas city governments and their lawyers. I'm looking for constructive, proactive suggestions on how we, as individuals, can positively affect decisions made by our local authorities.

For my part, I have enrolled in my city's Citizen Police Academy to gain insight and form beneficial relationships.

I'd suggest that city/county officials follow the course of the least restrictive policy possible. If they are not sure whether a court room in city hall makes all of city hall off limits, then place notice of applicable statutes at the entrance to the court room and court offices.

[bigity]

Article from the Texas Tech newspaper, mostly about active shooter training. However, I really like that the Tech PD lieutenant they are talking to knows something about CHL holders.

Many people have little or no exposure to weapons, Williams said, but should not be worried about people with a concealed handgun license.

“These are the squeaky clean people in society,” he said. “They have to undergo a very rigorous background check to even get that license, it’s not something that DPS and the state are just giving out to people.”

Williams said the percentage of people with a CHL who get in trouble is small.


http://www.dailytoreador.com/news/tech- ... 3fa37.html

[Abraham]

Were I in business and didn't welcome OC, I would put up the sign.

As an employer, I wouldn't want to put my employees (or myself) in the position of asking a customer to leave his gun outside. Even if the customer complies, you've embarrassed him or worse...

I can see many an employee as timid type personalities quavering and gulping with fear when told to tell the gunslinger to leave his gun outside or just plain leave. Most folks fear confrontation or are extremely embarrassed by confrontation especially with strangers and generally in front of an audience of other customers.

The sign would eliminate that situation.

Of course, if some nitwit decides he's coming in OCing anyway, with the sign well in place, I wouldn't confront him.

With a phone call, I'd let an LEO do that...I don't know this OCing guy. For all I know he's a powder keg ready to explode when told to leave his gun outside.

Heck, we've already had a few people here state they're going to push the limits by OCing in Whataburger, even though they know WB's anti-OC policy.

[oljames3]

More Texans reacting:

UT Austin "gun rules" discussion:
https://www.dailytexanonline.com/2015/0 ... n-by-dec-4

Euless, Texas, Dave & Busters "No OPEN CARRY of firearms permitted except by sworn law enforcement personnel."
http://www.daveandbusters.com/locations ... StoreId=81