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http://data.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/gun-deaths" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

My anti gun friends are all excited about this. Of course all I see is a lot of gun deaths seem to be in places where guns are illegal or almost impossible to legally own.

wow
bid d has a while bunch of deaths

wyoming comes up as almost none

i was shocked about the three listed for tyler, as its near me and tyler is a very safe place to be about.
I need to research those three. I bet they were drug related in one part of a small small area

Deleted.

Beiruty wrote:Wow, NY city has 31 dead and Dallas has only 24. I thought, In big apple, gun control and and crime fighting powers are second to none! I guess Bloomberg is failing to see the light or explain why he has more crime than in Dallas.

There are 22 million people in the New York metro area. There are a little over 6 million in the Dallas-Ft Worth metro area. So NY is actually quite safer than Dallas.

Jumping Frog wrote:

Beiruty wrote:Wow, NY city has 31 dead and Dallas has only 24. I thought, In big apple, gun control and and crime fighting powers are second to none! I guess Bloomberg is failing to see the light or explain why he has more crime than in Dallas.

There are 22 million people in the New York metro area. There are a little over 6 million in the Dallas-Ft Worth metro area. So NY is actually quite safer than Dallas.

You got a point. I am wrong.

I once had a class assignment was to
1) define health
2) determine if the females or the males in the class were "healthier"

So, if health was defined as a height/weight ratio or Body Mass Index, the result was one way
but
if health was defined as age and activity level, the result was the opposite
We actually had to do it in groups as a project and ended up with about 20 "definitions of "health" frequency of doctor visits, problems founds, meds taken, etc etc ...
we had to "work the problem" with each and every definition.
Our Project ended up being hundreds of pages long.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So ONLY IF YOU ACCEPT A DEFINITION OF "safer" as a ratio of "gun deaths (including police shooting criminals?) to "population density" as a definition of "safety" is that true.

is "safer" necessarily the so-called "gun deaths" ratio to a population density
or
is it
the ratio of criminals using guns to injure or kill to the number of legally armed citizens who can legally protect themselves?
So
In fact, Dallas may be much "safer" than New York as far as the ability to legally protect yourself is concerned.

NEW YORKER FACES 3 YEARS IN PRISON FOR DEFENDING HIS HOME
http://www.theburningplatform.com/?p=51526" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

>>>>>I'm not in favor of allowing my opponant to define the terms in order to reach the conclusion he prefers .... <<<<<

"gun deaths" means those beaten to death with a gun instead of a baseball bat ... "bullet deaths" are something else... (So the govt is buying up all the ammo real fast...)

When you read similar statistics, it's worthwhile note that while figures don't lie, liars figure. It's easy to skew opinion by a selective presentation of fact. When it comes to gun death numbers, it's good to keep a few things in mind:

1. "Gun deaths" include bad guys justifiably shot. These are improvements to safety and not detrimental to society.

2. Gun death statistics deliberately do not include data on instances where a firearm was used to terminate a crime without any shots being fired. It is similar to trying to demonize automobiles by citing crash deaths without noting that millions of folks use them safely to get to and from work.

3. Criminals use whatever is at hand to commit violence. In places like New York where guns are harder to obtain legally (although easy to get illegally) spontaneous violence is often accomplished with other objects - steak knives, baseball bats, fists, etc. I've never encountered a victim's family who said, "Thank goodness he was only stabbed. After all, he could've been shot." Dead is dead.

I know both New York and Dallas quite well. Both have areas where you'd be taking your life in your hands to enter, but there's little reason for innocent folks to go there voluntarily. While many areas of New York are much safer today than in the early 90's (thanks to Mayor Giuliani, not Bloomberg) I'd take Dallas over New York any day for safety in the areas I'd care to visit.

Interesting how the guns caused all those deaths. Apparently no people were involved. The guns just went wild all on their own.

Here's the Dallas deaths:
Robbery victim was murdered
Drug deal ends in two shot
Drug related driveby kills one
Home invasion - homeowner killed
One shot - cause unknown
Same man counted again (so there's really 23, not 24)
Drug related - two killed
Angry neighbor kills two
Robbery victim killed
Domestic violence - husband kills wife
Drunk and high on marijuana, man accidentally shoots and kills his sister
Cause unknown - homeowner shot at his front door
Cause unknown - man shot in a parking lot
Robbery victim murdered
Drug related murder
Altercation at a convenience store ends in murder (counted twice so there's really 22 not 24)
Family violence - man shot and killed
Altercation at a bar - man shot and killed
Man shot multiple times in his car in a convenience store parking lot
Robber killed by his accomplices - drug related

Does it seem to you like guns are the problem?

ever watch penn and teller - the war on drugs?

baldeagle wrote:Here's the Dallas deaths:
Robbery victim was murdered
Drug deal ends in two shot
Drug related driveby kills one
Home invasion - homeowner killed
One shot - cause unknown
Same man counted again (so there's really 23, not 24)
Drug related - two killed
Angry neighbor kills two
Robbery victim killed
Domestic violence - husband kills wife
Drunk and high on marijuana, man accidentally shoots and kills his sister
Cause unknown - homeowner shot at his front door
Cause unknown - man shot in a parking lot
Robbery victim murdered
Drug related murder
Altercation at a convenience store ends in murder (counted twice so there's really 22 not 24)
Family violence - man shot and killed
Altercation at a bar - man shot and killed
Man shot multiple times in his car in a convenience store parking lot
Robber killed by his accomplices - drug related

Does it seem to you like guns are the problem?

Baldeagle, I'm just curious where you got the list, and how is it that two of them are counted twice? This is the kind of stuff that needs to be thrown back in the antis faces.

The Annoyed Man wrote:

baldeagle wrote:Here's the Dallas deaths:
Robbery victim was murdered
Drug deal ends in two shot
Drug related driveby kills one
Home invasion - homeowner killed
One shot - cause unknown
Same man counted again (so there's really 23, not 24)
Drug related - two killed
Angry neighbor kills two
Robbery victim killed
Domestic violence - husband kills wife
Drunk and high on marijuana, man accidentally shoots and kills his sister
Cause unknown - homeowner shot at his front door
Cause unknown - man shot in a parking lot
Robbery victim murdered
Drug related murder
Altercation at a convenience store ends in murder (counted twice so there's really 22 not 24)
Family violence - man shot and killed
Altercation at a bar - man shot and killed
Man shot multiple times in his car in a convenience store parking lot
Robber killed by his accomplices - drug related

Does it seem to you like guns are the problem?

Baldeagle, I'm just curious where you got the list, and how is it that two of them are counted twice? This is the kind of stuff that needs to be thrown back in the antis faces.

If you go to the interactive map on their page, you can click on any city and get a list of the dead. If you click on their names, it takes you to the news article from which they got the information. The double counting is due to the use of different names in different articles; e.g. Juan Vasquez and Juan Miguel Vasquez would be counted as two separate deaths.

The point of all this is (obviously) that criminal behavior is behind all these deaths, not guns. Take the guns away and they'd use knives, or axes, or baseball bats, etc., etc. Until you solve the criminal behavior problem, the death count isn't going to change significantly.