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I believe after all is said and done today...Calls to the governors office and your state reps and senators would be in order to get Texas on the track to refuting this economy killing, life taking, life dissmissal Federal healthcare takeover bill to task...

Light them up...Bright and early tomorrow morning...

I think anytime the legislature oversteps their authority it hurts all aspects of our life, Second Amendment included. the giving up of Liberty.

I'm going to do the opposite, I'm going to write and thank them as a gun owner for finally stepping in and making sure that EVERYONE has access to Healthcare.
And that being Healthy isnt for the Rich or for people who havent been screwed over by their Health Insurance yet.

Everybody in the US, Citizen and non-citizen alike, do now, and have always had access to health care, for free, if necessary. The ER cannot turn you away for lack of the ability to pay.

sjfcontrol wrote:Everybody in the US, Citizen and non-citizen alike, do now, and have always had access to health care, for free, if necessary. The ER cannot turn you away for lack of the ability to pay.

Ah yes, I would love to get a bill for 30k because I broke my arm. Thats not half my Salary for a year

Mark,

You're good guy who believes in freedom and constitutional government (I've been following your posts), but have you ever lived in some of these countries with nationalized health care? My family escaped from such a system. Some social medicine programs are better than others. However, even the best of them will want to take your freedom away in the name of decreasing the cost of nationalized medicine.

France banned smoking in all public places. Hong Kong banned smoking in all public places. I hate smoking and it's a nasty habit but the fact is that the FREEDOM to do something was taken away WITHOUT a DEMOCRATIC vote in the name of public health. In the name of public health, and without a democratic vote, your right to bear arms could be taken away. You know those liberal "studies" that say you're more likely to be shot with a gun in a home that has a gun than in a home that doesn't have a gun? Well, they're going to be used to take away your guns in the name of public health. The NRA's statement that it won't do that is a boldface lie. I'm a big annual donator to the NRA and I deliver them new members every year, BUT I think that they all too often compromise too much with our 2nd amendment rights. If we compromise a little here and a little there, then before you know it, BAM, your rights as a free man are GONE.

I hate the present healthcare "system" (if you can call it that) just as much as you, but I invite you to consider that perhaps there's another way. Perhaps, expanding the Medicare/Medicaid system just a tad to encompass more members that want it WITHOUT forcing the entire country to get health insurance from the government whether people want it or not.

My family ran away from socialism and communism only to find it growing in the USA.

I'm staying out of this thread. I've already made my opinions known about non-gun related topics, perhaps too often.

Yes, but we arent France. We arent Hong Kong. This is America. We should be leading the world in how a Healthcare System should be run without taking away freedoms.
Instead we get Sarah Palin and her "Death Panels" and all this nonsense.
If either side has said "Lets make a REAL attempt to kick the crud out of the Health Insurance and its policy of greed" than yeah, I would be supporting that. But they arent.

Also smoking kills others. 1st Hand kills you, 2nd hand kills those around you and 3rd hand Kills people who are where you were. 4th hand doesnt exist because that would be "A Friend of mine got killed because someone had cancer" Dont have a problem with banning Public Pollution. I mean I cant shoot my gun randomly into the air right, no matter how much fun it could be.

Mark -- I don't know how old you are, but I'm betting I spend more per month on health care insurance than you do.
I spend a FORTUNE to insure myself and may wife.
If (when) this passes, my rates will SKYROCKET.
I will be paying for myself, and a few other people who can't afford it.
Yeah, thanks, Mark. Hope you enjoy the insurance I'm paying for.
Hope you enjoy waiting in line to get your broken arm fixed -- maybe they'll have an opening for you 18 months from now. Or maybe, if you're my age. They'll figure your too old to treat...

Welcome to socialized medicine.

sjfcontrol wrote:Mark -- I don't know how old you are, but I'm betting I spend more per month on health care insurance than you do.
I spend a FORTUNE to insure myself and may wife.
If (when) this passes, my rates will SKYROCKET.
I will be paying for myself, and a few other people who can't afford it.
Yeah, thanks, Mark. Hope you enjoy the insurance I'm paying for.
Hope you enjoy waiting in line to get your broken arm fixed -- maybe they'll have an opening for you 18 months from now. Or maybe, if you're my age. They'll figure your too old to treat...

Welcome to socialized medicine.

Why cant we do it better? Why are you already quitting before we've begun?
Also isnt it great to have Insurance? Remember when you didnt? Remember what that felt like?
You are allready paying for Medical treatment for people, why do you think it costs more to fix an arm HERE than it does in Canada, or Europe, its not because there is anything magical going on in setting a cast here in America, its because of the bloated mess Hostipals have become due to insurance companies and people not being able to pay.
I got charged 30 dollars for a bottle of asprin, anyone care to explain how thats possible?

PSLOwner wrote:No offense to your position, about which you feel very strongly. But does this really belong in a gun-related forum?

If the gun-related forum (this one) has a "Political Issues" topic available (such as this one) then yes, the OP is not only acceptable but necessary.

AEA wrote:

PSLOwner wrote:No offense to your position, about which you feel very strongly. But does this really belong in a gun-related forum?

If the gun-related forum (this one) has a "Political Issues" topic available (such as this one) then yes, the OP is not only acceptable but necessary.

Charles Disagrees with you

Charles L. Cotton wrote:*SNIP* Please note, this is not an open forum for any and all political discussions. The topics must at least be tangentially related to guns, shooting, self-defense, Second Amendment, etc.

Thanks,
Chas.

I would say to keep this on topic someone needs to post an example of a country using Health care to take guns from people

marksiwel wrote:

sjfcontrol wrote:Mark -- I don't know how old you are, but I'm betting I spend more per month on health care insurance than you do.
I spend a FORTUNE to insure myself and may wife.
If (when) this passes, my rates will SKYROCKET.
I will be paying for myself, and a few other people who can't afford it.
Yeah, thanks, Mark. Hope you enjoy the insurance I'm paying for.
Hope you enjoy waiting in line to get your broken arm fixed -- maybe they'll have an opening for you 18 months from now. Or maybe, if you're my age. They'll figure your too old to treat...

Welcome to socialized medicine.

Why cant we do it better? Why are you already quitting before we've begun?

Because the government isn't really well known for doing things more efficiently.

KC5AV wrote: Because the government isn't really well known for doing things more efficiently.

I guess it boils down to
Great for some, or none for the rest

Or "Just Okay" for everyone

Example

Canadian Co-Worker moved here because Husband is a hotshot at a big Software company in Austin.
She had to go to the hostipal for Gallbladder. They have GREAT Insurance, top of the line, she got her own private room, Cable TV, could page a doctor whenever she wanted. She said it was so strange, because in Canada you would *Gasp* share a room with a few people so they could HELP AS MANY PEOPLE AS THEY COULD. She didnt have to wait in the ER she walked in and was treated like Royalty. Must be nice. She even admits that it was nice and all but unnecessary, and that she could see why the top % of people who can afford such care would be reluctant to give it up.

Pssst Canadians on Average live 2 years longer than Americans.

marksiwel wrote:Yes, but we arent France. We arent Hong Kong. This is America. We should be leading the world in how a Healthcare System should be run without taking away freedoms.

Exactly. That's why the government has no place in "managing" health care, i.e. restricting health care freedom.