Gun control you could support?

[xring]

I have two Ideas to help prevent the next mass shooting at schools or other places.
Prebackground checks. Your state issues you a Driver’s license or ID card bio-metrically encoded with your information. This card could have simple codes corresponding to your eligibility for certain rights. For instance maybe a V spot voting a F spot for firearms E for employment W for welfare all prescreened and vetted to reflect that you have the full rights as a citizen or the limited rights of a legal resident. If you had a change in status the Judge could simply punch a hole in your card to remove this right, for instance a felon can no longer vote or own a firearm so the V & F would be punched out. This card could have a coded number that could be entered in a public database to determine if the cardholder’s status has changed and the card holder is holding a “lost card”. If you find someone trying to apply for a job without an E, Vote without a V, or buy a firearm without an F you simply report this to the authorities and collect half of the substantial fine that the offender has to pay for the offense. I don’t think this is over reaching since we already show ID when purchasing firearms and I for one want to see ID when selling unless I know you very well. This would be just a criminal background check, not the higher level of background used for CCL. This may need some fine tuning and fleshing out but as long as there are no recordings that you purchased and what it was unless you were in immediate violation I don’t think most of us would have an issue, I would even feel better if I had a better way to make sure I was selling to a qualified person.
Number 2 is much better. Most criminal and accidental gun injuries and deaths are the result of unauthorized use. The answer is a limited number of times in your life you may take a tax credit for a quality gun safe and handgun lock box or upgrade. If the woman whose Son was the shooter in the Sandy Hook elem. Shooting had her AR in a safe her mentally disturbed son would not have had access to it.
That’s all we need as responsible adults and citizens 1 the ability to determine who we are selling to and 2 some encouragement to secure our fire arms. I’m sure it’s not perfect let’s hear what you think.

[JALLEN]

In California, in addition to the already cumbersome requirements to buy a firearm, there is a requirement to buy a trigger lock at the same time, or produce a receipt showing you already have purchased one or an approved safe, etc.

Each firearm sold, transferred, or manufactured in California must be accompanied with a firearm safety device approved by the Department of Justice and identified as appropriate for that firearm. The Department of Justice is required to compile and publish a listing of all of the safety devices that have been determined to meet the department’s standards. A list of these devices is available on the Department of Justice Bureau of Firearms website at http://www.ag.ca.gov/firearms/fsdcertlist.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. (Penal Code § 12088.1.)

The term “long-gun safe” is distinct from “gun safe” and “firearms safety device.” A “long-gun safe” means a locking container designed to fully contain and secure a rifle or a shotgun. A “long-gun safe” must have a locking system consisting of either a mechanical combination lock or an electronic combination lock that has at least 1,000 possible unique combinations consisting of a minimum of three numbers, letters, or symbols per combination, and that is not listed on the Department of Justice Roster of Firearm Safety Devices. (PC § 12087.6).

No person shall keep for commercial sale, commercially sell, or distribute as part of an organized firearm safety program, any firearms safety device (other than a long-gun safe) that is not listed on the Department of Justice roster of approved firearms safety devices. Any sale of a long gun safe must be accompanied by a specified warning label. (Penal Code § 12088.1.)

The Department of Justice Roster of Firearm Safety Devices may be accessed on the Department California Firearms
of Justice website at http://www.ag.ca.gov/firearms/fsdcertlist.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

Firearm sales and transfers are exempt from the requirement to provide a firearm safety device if either of the following is true:

- The purchaser demonstrates proof that he or she owns a gun safe that meets the standards set forth in Department of Justice regulations adopted under Penal Code section 12088.2 by signing an affidavit to that effect.

- The purchaser presents an approved safety device for the firearm being purchased and provides to the firearms dealer an original receipt showing the purchase took place no more than 30 days prior to picking up the firearm.

- The purchaser presents a receipt for a Department of Justice-approved lock box and signs an affidavit (provided by the firearms dealer) that describes the make and model of the lock box and that the lock box will accommodate the firearm being purchased.

[xring]

I'm not too big on requiring but sure like encouraging. Trigger locks are slow to open not like a simplex pistol locker. They are also poor security not like a gunsafe. Plus anything California mandates I am suspicious of.

[K.Mooneyham]

I'm already ticked off enough to have to constantly show "papers please". I'm not in favor of any more giant bureaucratic government schemes that will require untold billions more dollars of non-existent taxpayer money to build, implement and enforce. Once upon a time, before I was born I concede, you could buy a firearm by mail order and have it shipped to your house...somehow we still ended up with a prosperous nation. In fact, its only since they started really shoving all this bureaucracy on Americans that it seems things have really gone downhill...imagine that.

[xring]

I'm already ticked off enough to have to constantly show "papers please". I'm not in favor of any more giant bureaucratic government schemes that will require untold billions more dollars of non-existent taxpayer money to build, implement and enforce. Once upon a time, before I was born I concede, you could buy a firearm by mail order and have it shipped to your house...somehow we still ended up with a prosperous nation. In fact, its only since they started really shoving all this bureaucracy on Americans that it seems things have really gone downhill...imagine that.

Sadly it was not before I was born that you could buy a firearm through mail order. Maybe that is something that could be reintroduced if this ID Card was enabled and how about a trusted traveler spot so we can go through airports without the hassle of body searches and the parade of the stocking footed travelers. I too miss the days when you enjoyed a 6 1/2 oz. coke in a glass bottle, real sudephed without signing a special card & real codeine in over the counter cough syrup. However sometimes We need to realize that Carbon tetrachloride is bad for you and that there are evil or irresponsible people that no longer have the rights that we enjoy. We as the " adults in the room" need to have the ability to determine who is who so that we can continue to act responsibly. The "liberal minded" in our government seem to think they have the ability and right control firearms purchases but not the illegal aliens in our country. I suspect they the Google company or other IT based information companys could provide with local, state & federal co-operation and updated E-Verify system that would easily verify our status as citizen as full and unencumbered, Limited by behavior ( convicted or currently under arrest) or alien status. I know it is easy to want it the way Grandpa said it was but there are genuine solutions to real problems . I in no way want to restrict the freedoms of honorable law-abiding citizens. Oh and the # 2 answer on my first post is partially because I need a bigger safe. Thanks for the input still looking for solutions.

[AEA]

I don't like the idea of linking Driver's License to anything that has to do with CHL, 2nd Amendment or any other RIGHTS of the Constitution.

One is a Constitutional RIGHT, the other is a State Issued Document.

You have no Constitutional RIGHT to a Driver's License.

See my point? Let's not start to lump two very different things together.....we have enough troubles already!

[K.Mooneyham]

The solution is to quit mollycoddling the REAL bad-guys. I mean the ones who purposely use violence, whether with a firearm or not, for fun or profit. I don't do those things to others and I don't expect them to be done to me. Infringing on MY freedoms (or the freedoms of that vast majority of firearms owners who don't commit violent crimes) is NOT going to do one tiny little thing to make this a safer nation, not in the least. I just wish we had more than a few politicians in this country who had the guts to say that; most of them don't. They want to make, or buy into, these so-called "common sense" laws that ain't got a lick of common sense in them.

[AEA]

[xring]

I don't like the idea of linking Driver's License to anything that has to do with CHL, 2nd Amendment or any other RIGHTS of the Constitution.

One is a Constitutional RIGHT, the other is a State Issued Document.

You have no Constitutional RIGHT to a Driver's License.

See my point? Let's not start to lump two very different things together.....we have enough troubles already!

Thanks for the reply so I assume ( & you know what that does) you never buy new firearms through FFLs they require State approved Photo id I Guess We could make it more like a passport a federal document but I trust my State a bunch more than Washington. I don't like the Idea of using the Social security card as ID they even stated it was not ID on my original card no more, try opening a bank account without one! Big brother is here & is not going away The HAL 9000 is running I want us to be the one that wrights the code. ( did you like that a book and a film reference in the same sentence).

[AEA]

You do not need a DL to prove identity. A State issued ID is available and acceptable by FFL's.

But, yes, I have a DL. But I want nothing to do with a DL having anything to do with my 2nd Amendment Constitutional RIGHT.

You start something like this and you hand the Dems more options to attack us. Several times already I have heard Drivers License and CHL or CWP or whatever mentioned on the Media and no one calls them out on the BIG DIFFERENCE of the two.

[xring]

The solution is to quit mollycoddling the REAL bad-guys. I mean the ones who purposely use violence, whether with a firearm or not, for fun or profit. I don't do those things to others and I don't expect them to be done to me. Infringing on MY freedoms (or the freedoms of that vast majority of firearms owners who don't commit violent crimes) is NOT going to do one tiny little thing to make this a safer nation, not in the least. I just wish we had more than a few politicians in this country who had the guts to say that; most of them don't. They want to make, or buy into, these so-called "common sense" laws that ain't got a lick of common sense in them.

No argument there but do you think we can convince the "progressive" states to put teeth back into their enforcement and punishment. I'm trying to find tools for us to quickly easily and efficiently identify the good guys from the bad guys for various reasons. I bet you would admit that you would parole some felons but still prefer they not vote or purchase firearms. Maybe it could be separate from state ID or driver license but If I put one more card in my wallet my right leg will fall to sleep. Thanks for the comments and if Cavalry arms would send my midlength hand guards that I've been waiting over 2 weeks for my new upper I'd be wasting some of the .556 ammo I have been hoarding instead of trying to solve the world's problems.

Thanks again.

[xring]

You do not need a DL to prove identity. A State issued ID is available and acceptable by FFL's.

But, yes, I have a DL. But I want nothing to do with a DL having anything to do with my 2nd Amendment Constitutional RIGHT.

You start something like this and you hand the Dems more options to attack us. Several times already I have heard Drivers License and CHL or CWP or whatever mentioned on the Media and no one calls them out on the BIG DIFFERENCE of the two.

Is your ID # different From Your DL # ? By the way nice looking dog.

[AEA]

Believe me, they already know who the good guys and bad guys are.........

You have to realize it is not about identifying the two. It is ALL about removing all 2nd Amendment Rights from everyone and confiscate ALL guns in any way that they can squirm around current laws (and introduce sneaky new laws) to accomplish that goal.

[RoyGBiv]

I'm already ticked off enough to have to constantly show "papers please". I'm not in favor of any more giant bureaucratic government schemes that will require untold billions more dollars of non-existent taxpayer money to build, implement and enforce. Once upon a time, before I was born I concede, you could buy a firearm by mail order and have it shipped to your house...somehow we still ended up with a prosperous nation. In fact, its only since they started really shoving all this bureaucracy on Americans that it seems things have really gone downhill...imagine that.

Win.

[The Annoyed Man]

I prefer the idea of abolishing the government (3rd sentence, paragraph 2 of the Declaration of Independence) and starting over again, using the Constitution without any compromises to govern ourselves. Every single step on the national level gun-control continuum has been one in which gun owners agree to be subject to more and more restrictions on their constitutional right, while those on the other side never give up anything and net only gains in oppressing law-abiding citizens further and further.

Read the first two paragraphs of the document:

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.--Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

The government no longer promotes Liberty. Much of what happens in government is ordered without the consent of the governed. Government has become destructive to the end of preserving Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. It is our right to abolish it and replace it with one that lays "its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to [us] shall seem most likely to effect [our] Safety and Happiness."

Let me very clear: I do not call for such an abolishment. I merely point out that it is our right to do so, as stated by the Founding Fathers. It is THAT right which underpins me when I say that there are no legitimately acceptable further restrictions that I would willingly agree to be bound by with regard to the 2nd Amendment. I am, to date, not a criminal, and I adamantly refuse to accept new regulations which will back me into becoming one. I swear that should any further restrictions be enacted against my 2nd Amendment right, I will regard it as having no more authority over me than the Founders regarded King George's illegitimate laws as having any authority over them, and I will for darn sure not accede to any more bullying from antigun fascists. If that makes me a criminal, then so be it; but I am categorically unwilling to accept further identification requirements and/or tracking of my health records by an overbearing government........particularly one headed by a man with definite monarchic tendencies. I have passed three CHL background checks (from two different states) and multiple NICS checks. As Suzanna Gratia Hupp said so eloquently:

How a politician stands on the Second Amendment tells you how he or she views you as an individual… as a trustworthy and productive citizen, or as part of an unruly crowd that needs to be lorded over, controlled, supervised, and taken care of.

I find it discouraging that any fellow gun owner would agree that I need to be any more so lorded over, controlled, and supervised than I already am.