GAO Report on ATF Firearms Data Compliance

[gthaustex]

The GAO recently did a report for Congress on ATF compliance with laws concerning deletion / aggregation of firearm owner data. Some ATF systems were not in compliance with the law according to the GAO. I found interesting the number of different systems the ATF has for tracking firearms data.

http://www.gao.gov/assets/680/678091.pdf

[LSUTiger]

Every time you fill out a 4473, both the ATF and FBI (NICS) are involved in the process and I always suspected they were collecting data permanently. Sure they aren't supposed to be keeping track of it but they do. They aren't just going to throw it away. They know who has guns and a who doesn't.

When the government says "trust us, we aren't collecting data on you", do you believe them?

My friends who worry about getting on a government list always crack me up. I always tell them, "you already are", we all are. It's just that some of us are higher up on the list than others.

[rexmitchell]

Every time you fill out a 4473, both the ATF and FBI (NICS) are involved in the process and I always suspected they were collecting data permanently. Sure they aren't supposed to be keeping track of it but they do. They aren't just going to throw it away. They know who has guns and a who doesn't.

When the government says "trust us, we aren't collecting data on you", do you believe them?

My friends who worry about getting on a government list always crack me up. I always tell them, "you already are", we all are. It's just that some of us are higher up on the list than others.

I know someone who also is worried about being on government lists.....Said person holds a LTC and is a FFL.....Yea, they have no idea who he is lol.

[LSUTiger]

Every time you fill out a 4473, both the ATF and FBI (NICS) are involved in the process and I always suspected they were collecting data permanently. Sure they aren't supposed to be keeping track of it but they do. They aren't just going to throw it away. They know who has guns and a who doesn't.

When the government says "trust us, we aren't collecting data on you", do you believe them?

My friends who worry about getting on a government list always crack me up. I always tell them, "you already are", we all are. It's just that some of us are higher up on the list than others.

I know someone who also is worried about being on government lists.....Said person holds a LTC and is a FFL.....Yea, they have no idea who he is lol.

Now I do have an eform 1 in process for an SBR, how high will that bump me up on the list? You know us FFL, NFA and LTC types must be serious criminals seeing how we are bending over backwards to obey the law. But don't worry, they aren't coming for our guns!

Monday, 01 August 2016
New ATF Head Wants Computerized Database of All Gun Purchases
http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/co ... -purchases

[KLB]

You know us FFL, NFA and LTC types must be serious criminals seeing how we are bending over backwards to obey the law. But don't worry, they aren't coming for our guns!

All plans to disarm the subjects necessarily begin with the law abiding. That's the low-hanging fruit. I suspect the plans end there as well as begin, but some say I'm a cynic.

[Lynyrd]

You know us FFL, NFA and LTC types must be serious criminals seeing how we are bending over backwards to obey the law. But don't worry, they aren't coming for our guns!

All plans to disarm the subjects necessarily begin with the law abiding. That's the low-hanging fruit. I suspect the plans end there as well as begin, but some say I'm a cynic.

I have a friend who belonged to a military unit without a name. He told me once that he had seen plans to "quell the masses" if the need should arise.

[LSUTiger]

You know us FFL, NFA and LTC types must be serious criminals seeing how we are bending over backwards to obey the law. But don't worry, they aren't coming for our guns!

All plans to disarm the subjects necessarily begin with the law abiding. That's the low-hanging fruit. I suspect the plans end there as well as begin, but some say I'm a cynic.

I have a friend who belonged to a military unit without a name. He told me once that he had seen plans to "quell the masses" if the need should arise.

Ironically, I think the need will arise if they try gun confiscation.

[mrvmax]

Every time you fill out a 4473, both the ATF and FBI (NICS) are involved in the process and I always suspected they were collecting data permanently. Sure they aren't supposed to be keeping track of it but they do. They aren't just going to throw it away. They know who has guns and a who doesn't.

Your statement has some false information. Most FFL's only use NICS when required (in Texas when the customer does not have a CHL/LTC). I realize some places like Academy will go through NICS anyway but you have the choice to buy there or not. NICS does not get any firearm info, they get your personal info and what type of firearm it is (handgun, long gun, other etc.). The only time the ATF gets the 4473 info is when a multiple handgun/long gun report needs to be filed, when the FFL goes out of business (all the forms are sent in) or during audits. Normally during the audits the ATF only takes info for people they suspect are buying illegally.
To summarize, normally the ATF does not get your info. Do not buy from places that run NICS if you do not have to and do not give the FFL a reason to fill out a multiple report and you will minimize what info the government gets. Do a web search for the ATF multiple hand gun and long gun reports and see what all is sent in.

[LSUTiger]

Every time you fill out a 4473, both the ATF and FBI (NICS) are involved in the process and I always suspected they were collecting data permanently. Sure they aren't supposed to be keeping track of it but they do. They aren't just going to throw it away. They know who has guns and a who doesn't.

Your statement has some false information. Most FFL's only use NICS when required (in Texas when the customer does not have a CHL/LTC). I realize some places like Academy will go through NICS anyway but you have the choice to buy there or not. NICS does not get any firearm info, they get your personal info and what type of firearm it is (handgun, long gun, other etc.). The only time the ATF gets the 4473 info is when a multiple handgun/long gun report needs to be filed, when the FFL goes out of business (all the forms are sent in) or during audits. Normally during the audits the ATF only takes info for people they suspect are buying illegally.
To summarize, normally the ATF does not get your info. Do not buy from places that run NICS if you do not have to and do not give the FFL a reason to fill out a multiple report and you will minimize what info the government gets. Do a web search for the ATF multiple hand gun and long gun reports and see what all is sent in.

The ATF may not have your info in all cases, but when I fill out a 4473, I assume that they do whether they should or not.

[bblhd672]

Somewhere there's a very deep lake whose bottom is covered in firearms lost while boating.....

[goose]

Somewhere there's a very deep lake whose bottom is covered in firearms lost while boating.....

This is precisely why fishermen are usually wary of giving out their best honey holes!!

[The Annoyed Man]

Somewhere there's a very deep lake whose bottom is covered in firearms lost while boating.....

I sold all mine to a guy named Joe when it became apparent that I would not be permitted into the new world order if I was so neanderthal as to own a g....... g......g...... I can't even say the word anymore.

[joe817]

Somewhere there's a very deep lake whose bottom is covered in firearms lost while boating.....

I sold all mine to a guy named Joe when it became apparent that I would not be permitted into the new world order if I was so neanderthal as to own a g....... g......g...... I can't even say the word anymore.

It wasn't me! I DIDN'T DO IT!! And I do not remember when I did not do it!