Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

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Pawpaw
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#76

Post by Pawpaw »

Why Did Senate Democrats Block Background Check, Terror Watch List Bills?

If you get your information only from left-leaning politimedia, you might get the impression that last night’s four votes on proposed firearms bills were sponsored by Democrats and blocked by Republicans.

The first vote was held around 6:00 PM. Republican Senator Charles Grassley’s bill to increase funding to the FBI’s NICS background check system so that the system had more accurate criminal and mental health data was blocked by Senate Democrats. It had 53 votes for it and 47 votes against it, falling short of the 60 vote majority needed because liberal Senators voted against it.

Shortly afterward, liberty-hating Connecticut Senator Chris Murphy’s attempt to force so-called “universal” background checks down the throats of American citizens was defeated on a 44-56 vote.
What really happened in the Senate on Monday night when the 4 bills failed?

http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/06/21 ... ampaign=nl
Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence. - John Adams

locke_n_load
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#77

Post by locke_n_load »

For the "compromise" bill being voted on today/tomorrow, from a letter from GOA:

https://www.gunowners.org/news06222016.htm
...Collins-Ayotte allows a highly politicized official to take away constitutional rights by fiat without any real due process -- and presumes it can compensate for this by a process to “get your rights back” which is virtually impossible to invoke.
And while Collins-Ayotte purports to allow due process, it does so only for those who can afford to put up a substantial amount of money ahead of time, with the hope that they will get attorneys’ fees refunded to them after the fact.
...this amendment will NOT contain some of the protections for gun owners’ rights that were present in the Cornyn amendment.
... I wanted to emphasize that this “review and appeals” process will NOT benefit the average gun owner.
...The [appeals] process will be made even more lengthy and expensive by the fact that it must be filed in the docket-jammed courts of appeals -- which have recently, in all but two cases, been “packed” with anti-gun Obama appointees, largely by use of the “nuclear option.” The non-specific “expedited consideration” provisions may help a little, but not much.
The “right to review” is triggered by an official notice of denial issued by the Attorney General. But section _____(a)(2) specifically gives the Attorney General the written statutory right to refuse to assign a unique identification number, apparently indefinitely. And most large retailers refuse to sell a firearm until this unique identification number is received, even if they are legally entitled to do so.
...The Justice Department has refused to comply with the statutory requirement that they tell prohibited persons why they have been denied the right to purchase a firearm.
They do so, ever callously, while issuing the bureaucratic equivalent of “So sue us!” And, if you can’t figure out the reason for your denial, you can’t comply with the 60-day appeal filling process.
...If persons subject to denials have suffered these consequences, persons subject to inaction have had an even worse time getting a response. Last fall, the Justice Department announced that it has decided, illegally, to simply defund the processing of appeals.
...under section ____(d)(3), the AG is specifically authorized to classify and withhold any information she chooses. A really expensive attorney with a high security clearance might be able to get around this, but still wouldn’t be able to circumvent assertions of “privilege.”
Under section ____(d)(4), discovery is prohibited, except under extraordinary circumstances. Part of the proceedings will be “ex parte” (section ____(d)(6)), which means that the most important parts of the adjudication will consist of meetings, in chambers, between the judge and the government -– with the petitioner and his attorneys excluded.

...Collins may not understand that “legal fees” provisions have been in place for people fighting the government since the Buckley amendment in 1976. But these provisions have had little impact for non-wealthy litigants forced to pay the costs of litigation up-front and faced with, at best, a slight chance of reimbursement at the end of the process.
In short, this sham procedure represents no remedy at all in the real world, and it certainly does not offset the fact that the individual’s constitutional rights were stripped preemptively by fiat by a politicized official with virtually unfettered discretion and a demonstrable animus toward guns.
emphasis mine.
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TexasJohnBoy
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#78

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psijac
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#79

Post by psijac »

They are literally having a pout over this.
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#80

Post by mojo84 »

I wish they would go on a permanent sit in. The less they do the better off the country will be.
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#81

Post by rentz »

oh geez, this is partisan politics at its worst. The republicans submitted very reasonable compromise solutions that essentially gave the democratic party what they wanted but limited the lists they could use and since it was from republicans it gets denied and spread that the republicans halted all measures to protect americans.
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#82

Post by Pawpaw »

rentz wrote:
oh geez, this is partisan politics at its worst. The republicans submitted very reasonable compromise solutions that essentially gave the democratic party what they claimed they wanted but limited the lists they could use and since it was from republicans it gets denied and spread that the republicans halted all measures to protect americans.
Fixed it for ya. :tiphat:
Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence. - John Adams

rentz
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#83

Post by rentz »

Pawpaw wrote:
rentz wrote:
oh geez, this is partisan politics at its worst. The republicans submitted very reasonable compromise solutions that essentially gave the democratic party what they claimed they wanted but limited the lists they could use and since it was from republicans it gets denied and spread that the republicans halted all measures to protect americans.
Fixed it for ya. :tiphat:
good catch
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TexasJohnBoy
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#84

Post by TexasJohnBoy »

Pawpaw wrote:
rentz wrote:
oh geez, this is partisan politics at its worst. The republicans submitted very reasonable compromise solutions that essentially gave the democratic party what they claimed they wanted but limited the lists they could use and since it was from republicans it gets denied and spread that the republicans halted all measures to protect americans.
Fixed it for ya. :tiphat:
:iagree: with both of you. I think the Cornyn bill was the essence of a compromise between the two positions. So who's causing the gridlock now?
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Pawpaw
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#85

Post by Pawpaw »

TexasJohnBoy wrote:
Pawpaw wrote:
rentz wrote:
oh geez, this is partisan politics at its worst. The republicans submitted very reasonable compromise solutions that essentially gave the democratic party what they claimed they wanted but limited the lists they could use and since it was from republicans it gets denied and spread that the republicans halted all measures to protect americans.
Fixed it for ya. :tiphat:
:iagree: with both of you. I think the Cornyn bill was the essence of a compromise between the two positions. So who's causing the gridlock now?
Why, Republicans of course!

You don't have to take my word for it. Just go read any of the media reports. :roll:
Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence. - John Adams
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TexasJohnBoy
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#86

Post by TexasJohnBoy »

Look at the votes on the bills from Monday. I don't think the Democrats can say a dang thing about Republicans not supporting any kind of measures:

https://votesmart.org/bill/21643/56960/ ... ct-of-2016
https://votesmart.org/bill/21642/56958/ ... terrorists
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Scott Farkus
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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#87

Post by Scott Farkus »

rentz wrote:
oh geez, this is partisan politics at its worst. The republicans submitted very reasonable compromise solutions that essentially gave the democratic party what they wanted but limited the lists they could use and since it was from republicans it gets denied and spread that the republicans halted all measures to protect americans.
You know, the GOP risks alienating parts of its own base to offer up something that the Democrats have been harping about for ages, and they vote it down almost unanimously. The White House immediately goes out and blasts the Republicans for failing to act, and now two days later they stage this ridiculous sit-in to protest our alleged lack of action.

I get that we don't want to be seen as obstructionists or whatever, but I can't help but wonder why we even bother? You can't win for losing with these people. I hope this is part of a larger plan to get something on record that we can use against the anti-gun Dem's at some point, but the mainstream media has largely ignored it as far as I can tell and will never get the story correct in any event.

There comes a point where there's just nothing else you can do. I think we're there and have been for a while. I'm terrified as to where this goes from here.

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Re: Looks like we will be getting universal background checks, no gun list etc.

#88

Post by jason812 »

I think all of these bills are nothing but election fodder...
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