HI: 9th Circuit panel rules 2A protects right to carry gun in public

[Beiruty]

I open carry while going to and coming back from the Dallas Pistol Club even when I have to be somewhere that day. No issues so far.

[crazy2medic]

I open carry all the times and have since 2 months after the law went into effect! No issues, the whole bad guy will shoot you first is a bogus argument.

[BBYC]

In Hawaii? U da man!

[RoyGBiv]

I want y'all to think about this. Texas passed licensed open carry, and it's been a little while now. However, as many have pointed out on this forum, how many folks actually open carry? Now, I know some will say something like "Well, we can conceal under the same license, so why open carry?" However, there is also a LARGE stigma attached to open carry, even among pro-2A, pro-self-defense people...and there is the common refrain of "if you open carry, you will be immediately shot or have your gun taken away". I say all this to set up a question: if the court allows open carry only, how many will take advantage of that versus allowing concealed carry only? IMHO, if they allow open carry but not concealed, they've limited the right to bear DE FACTO because of the stigma attached to open carry...and THEY KNOW IT!

Please refer to my post (#12) above...
This case is not about open carry only.... It's about the right to "bear" arms in public.
If Hawaii loses in the courts, they can still chose to allow concealed carry only.
Any state that allows only OC will get a lot more OC, regardless of the OC stigma.

[oljames3]

I open carry all the times and have since 2 months after the law went into effect! No issues, the whole bad guy will shoot you first is a bogus argument.

No credible evidence that the " bad guy will shoot you first."

I've carried openly everywhere I legally could since getting my CHL and pistol in May, 2013. 1/1/16 just made it a lot easier.

[PriestTheRunner]

I open carry all the times and have since 2 months after the law went into effect! No issues, the whole bad guy will shoot you first is a bogus argument.

No credible evidence that the " bad guy will shoot you first."

I've carried openly everywhere I legally could since getting my CHL and pistol in May, 2013. 1/1/16 just made it a lot easier.

It certainly makes it much easier to carry. I went to Lowes once to get materials while CC'ing. Once. After that I realized if the firearms is going to be constantly visibly after picking up things, moving studs and getting stuff off the higher shelves, I might as well OC. Since then it has been OC on non-work days and when not in Church. Hardly anyone even seems to notice or if they do notice they don't seem to care. No bad experiences on my end.

[K.Mooneyham]

Now, now, I never said I buy the argument that "open carry will get you shot" (or disarmed); I do NOT believe that. I meant that a lot of folks believe that to be true. In fact, I think I may even have read that argument from a member of this forum in the past, though I cannot say for certain who it was or how long ago.

[The Annoyed Man]

That was the lamest defense of bad law I’ve ever seen. Does the guy still have his job today?

[bblhd672]

That was the lamest defense of bad law I’ve ever seen. Does the guy still have his job today?

I’m not a lawyer but it seems to me a good legal argument isn’t “I don’t know your honor.”

[chasfm11]

"Concealed carry is completely outside the boundaries of the Second Amendment" - Judge in her statement to the lawyer.

Wow, just wow.

[The Annoyed Man]

"Concealed carry is completely outside the boundaries of the Second Amendment" - Judge in her statement to the lawyer.

Wow, just wow.

That’s why I’m convinced that Hawaii is going to ask for a hearing in front of the en banc court, and the full 9th Circuit, being what it is (the most over-ruled circuit court in the nation) will overturn the 3 judge panel’s ruling, and find for Hawaii’s trampling of the Constitution.

[Liberty]

"Concealed carry is completely outside the boundaries of the Second Amendment" - Judge in her statement to the lawyer.

Wow, just wow.

I don't believe she was meaning what you think she meant. I think we need to understand the context in which she said that. I believe that she was reffering to the Hawaiian Conceal carry law, in which there has been no one that has to been given a license to carry.

If I understand this correctly. The logic goes something like this.
1: Until this decision Open Carry was illegal.
2: Hawaii has a licensed concealed carry program.

• a: They have never licenced anyone, never.
  b: Therefore Licensed concealed carry in Hawaii isn't a method that the state allows the 2nd amendment right to carry.

3: The court determined that All Americans have a right to carry
4: If the state has made it impossible for its people to legally conceal carry, The people have the right to open carry,

[Excaliber]

I CC the vast majority of the time because I haven' t wanted to be the subject of a MAWG call and if I am caught in the middle of a robbery I don't want some fool to force me to act while in a bad position by yelling, "You've got a gun - do something!".

I think history has shown the first concern to be negligible and not worth worrying about.

The second concern is possible, but not too likely because most people don't notice OC.

The law has been in effect long enough that I think almost everyone is aware of it.

I'm not too worried about a disarm attempt because I use tight, close body fitting holsters that are hard to get the gun out of from any position but mine, and I have both good situational awareness and weapon retention training. I don't disregard the risk, but I think I mitigate it effectively.

I think serving as an ambassador for 2A is a very valid reason for open carrying, and I am considering doing so more often because of that. It would definitely be more comfortable, especially with the weather we're having now.

[KLB]

The Ninth Circuit will rehear this case en banc.

For more on the panel decision from last Summer, see here. The panel will include the Chief Judge Sidney R. Thomas, plus 10 randomly selected judges; those judges must come from either the roster of active judges, or of the senior judges who served on the panel, if they want to be eligible for the en banc (in this instance, Judge O'Scannlain and Judge Clifton). En bancs in most circuits include the entire court, but because the Ninth Circuit is so large, its en banc panels include only 11 judges.)

To the extent such things are relevant, the Ninth Circuit has 23 active judges, of whom 7 are Republican appointees and 16 (including Chief Judge Thomas) are Democratic appointees. At the same time, note that Judge Clifton, while a Republican appointee, voted against right-to-carry on the panel; and some Democratic-appointed judges on the Ninth Circuit endorsed an individual rights view of the Second Amendment even before D.C. v. Heller, though that doesn't say what they think of carrying outside the home.

http://reason.com/volokh/2019/02/08/rig ... headed-for

[cyphertext]

IMHO, if they allow open carry but not concealed, they've limited the right to bear DE FACTO because of the stigma attached to open carry...and THEY KNOW IT!

I carry concealed because I can. If open carry was my only option, then I would open carry!