Thinking of buying a new gun...can I shoot yours first?

[Blinking Dog]

I'm thinking about buying a new gun in one of the following calibers:

.300 Winchester Magnum (or Weatherby Magnum)
.300 WSM
.325 WSM

I've come to these calibers due to their flat shooting and hard hitting characteristics. Problem is, I've never actually shot a rifle chambered in one of these rounds, and I don't have any friends that have such a gun.

That's where you come in. If anyone has a rifle in the above calibers, can I talk you into meeting me at a range in the D/FW area to let me shoot yours? I'll supply the ammo, and buy you lunch for your time (I know how hard it is to talk a person into going to the range... ).

I'd prefer to shoot a fairly modern rifle with a decent recoil pad. But an old gun isn't a deal breaker either.

Anyone willing...?

[Beiruty]

too much magnum, your shoulder would not like it. When I got my Tikka T3 in 30/06 with factory hard pad, just after 40 rds my shoulder turned blue and it was sore for few days. I installed a limbsaver and saved a limb.

Why do you need so much muzzle energy?

Code: Select all

Cartridge (Wb + type)	MV (fps)	V @ 200 yds	ME (ft lb)	E @ 200 yds
308 Win. (150 Sp)	2820		2288		2648		1744
.308 Win. (165 BTSP)	2685		2264		2641		1878
.308 Win. (165 BTSP)	2870		2456		3019		2211
.308 Win. (180 Sp)	2620		2198		2743		1930
.30-06 Spfd. (150 Sp)	2910		2342		2820		1827
.30-06 Spfd. (165 PSP)	2800		2283		2872		1909
.30-06 Spfd. (165 BTSP)	3015		2575		3330		C2428
.30-06 Spfd. (180 Sp)	2700		2023		2913		1635
.30R Blaser (180 SP)	2800		2383		3133		2270
.300 Rem. SAUM (150 Sp)	3200		2672		3410		2290
.300 Rem. SAUM (180 Sp)	2960		2571		3501		2642
.300 WSM (150 Sp)	3300		2834		3628		2676
.300 WSM (180 Sp)	2970		2549		3526		2598
.308 Norma Mag. (180 Sp)2953		2469		3486		2437
.300 Win. Mag. (150 Sp)	3290		2636		3605		2314
.300 Win. Mag. (180 Sp)	2960		2540		3501		2578
.300 H&H. Mag. (180 Sp)	2880		2380		3315		2260
.300 Wby. Mag. (180 Sp)	3240		2826		4195		3193
.300 Ultra Mag (180 Sp)	3250		2834		4221		3201
.30-378 Wby. (200 Sp)	3160		2759		4434		3381

[Jumping Frog]

Why do you need so much muzzle energy?

Zombies.

[Beiruty]

Why do you need so much muzzle energy?

Zombies.

For that, you should use an RPG!

[jmra]

Why do you need so much muzzle energy?

Zombies.

Everybody knows that the only way to kill a zombie is with a head shot. Ruger 10/22 has worked great on every zombie I've ever had an occasion to shoot.
Remember when the zombie invasion begins you're going to need to carry a lot of ammo. Those .22s are a lot lighter than those big bad boy bullets. My 9 shot bearcat is going to be a zombie killing machine.

[Dave2]

Why do you need so much muzzle energy?

Zombies.

Everybody knows that the only way to kill a zombie is with a head shot. Ruger 10/22 has worked great on every zombie I've ever had an occasion to shoot.
Remember when the zombie invasion begins you're going to need to carry a lot of ammo. Those .22s are a lot lighter than those big bad boy bullets. My 9 shot bearcat is going to be a zombie killing machine.

Yeah, but how many heads can each .22 bullet go through before it becomes ineffective? With a .300 Win Mag, I'd bet you could get at least five per shot, if you lined them up right.

[Blinking Dog]

Beiruty, valid question. I intend to shoot what I consider rather large animals in the near future...elk sized animals which I may need to take at a distance greater than 100 yards, and for which I'd prefer they drop with one shot. I realize that shot placement is more important than bullet size in general. And of course a big thumping gun that has lots of recoil isn't typically helpful in getting great shot placement (if you anticipate the monster recoil). That's the main reason I'd like to shoot someone's gun in these calibers, to see how "bad" the recoil is. But, I'm aware of plenty of people using these calibers who don't seem to have any problems.

Regarding ballistics, I've been doing a lot of research and if you believe Hornady's ballistics chart then:

A .30/06 150 gr SST has velocity of 2,627 fps and energy of 2,298 ft/lbs at 200 yards. But I'm also looking at the bullet trajectory, and if zeroed at 200 yards you have to hold 1.4 inches low at 100 yards, right on at 200, and then hold 7.6 inches high at 300 yards.

A .300 Win Mag shooting same bullet has 2,802 velocity and 2,615 energy at 200 yards. And again if zeroed at 200 yards, hold is 1.1 inches low at 100 yards, right on at 200, and 5.6 inches high at 300 yards.

I had to use a different source to look at .300 WSM and .325 WSM characteristics, but generally speaking they're very similar to the .300 Win Mag's...lots of downrange energy and very "flat" shooting".

But of course, the question is, is this downrange energy, and this "flat shooting" significantly better than the .30/06? Better enough to justify buying a new rifle? Better enough to justify the recoil? I don't know. That's why I want to try shooting one of these calibers, to help shed light on these questions I've been grappling with.

And for the record, I'm comparing all these calibers to my Remington 700 .30/06 BDL. It is a beautiful old gun, with real wood stock, and real character. I'd prefer to stick with it, after some accurizing work and a new recoil pad. (Basic plastic pad now, so it thumps pretty good)

Thank you for the thoughts. I welcome more. I'd like to do this right the first time. I'm all ears...

[PUCKER]

Dog - I've got a Weatherby Accumark chambered in .300 WinMag, it also has an Accubrake (added on by Ray's in Dallas), scoped with a Swarovski 10x. It packs a punch, let me tell you! That's why I added the Accubrake. It's quite L O U D with the brake but it definitely tames the recoil. I haven't shot it in years, not into rifles/hunting like I used to be. I bought it for the exact reasons you posted. My schedule for a range trip would probably be at least a week out.

[SecedeTX]

I have a 30/06 and a 7mag. I have hunted in Alaska, and there has been nothing the 7mag didn't handle. (both rifles are overkill in East Texas, where I prefer a 30/30)

I don't enjoy sighting in the 7mag so I don't get much range time with it. I shoot the 30/06 much more because it is less abusive.

I am getting old and soft though.

[Blinking Dog]

Dog - I've got a Weatherby Accumark chambered in .300 WinMag, it also has an Accubrake (added on by Ray's in Dallas), scoped with a Swarovski 10x. It packs a punch, let me tell you! That's why I added the Accubrake. It's quite L O U D with the brake but it definitely tames the recoil. I haven't shot it in years, not into rifles/hunting like I used to be. I bought it for the exact reasons you posted. My schedule for a range trip would probably be at least a week out.

Thanks. I may want to shoot it if you don't mind.

By the way, how did you like the work Ray's did? I'm thinking about using them for some work on my .30/06.

[Blinking Dog]

I have a 30/06 and a 7mag. I have hunted in Alaska, and there has been nothing the 7mag didn't handle. (both rifles are overkill in East Texas, where I prefer a 30/30)

I don't enjoy sighting in the 7mag so I don't get much range time with it. I shoot the 30/06 much more because it is less abusive.

I am getting old and soft though.

I feel like I'm getting old and soft too, so maybe in the end I'll stick with my .30/06.
In reality, I guess that old gun ought to be able to handle anything I'm likely to be shooting in the next few years.

[couzin]

Had a 300 WSM Win Model 70. Recoil was hard but not brutal - not as bad as my old Marlin 336 in .35 Rem. I really liked the short action and the 300 WSM is a great round - good for anything on the North american continent. My eyes have gotten so bad that I couldn't hit anything with any real confidence so I sold it - sticking with shorter range stalking rifles these days.

[Beiruty]

A better bullet can make a great difference. A 30-06 165gr Boat tailed bullet will have a flatter trajectory and faster and keeps velocity at distance. + or - 1-2" inches in drop at 300 yrd does not make a difference. It your rife is 1 MOA, then at 300 yrds your bullet will land + - 3" from bullseye.

[firefighter3217]

Here's what I have learned while working in a friend's gunsmith shop* (see note below)

.300 WSM will give you a lot of punch, yes, but a short magnum wears out barrels rather quickly as compared to a .300 win mag.

I asked him about those 2 calibers once, and his advice was to go with .300 win mag. Aside from its great trajectory, if you were to get it in a remington 700, there are a lot of parts out there and fantastic mods you can do. There is a reason why for several years the US Army used that particular caliber in a modified rem. 700 as their sniper. (ie: M24 SWS). Now, they use .308 NATO (last I heard), but from what I understand that had to do with the barret .50 coming into action and the better availability of .30 NATO ammo in a pinch, if necessary.

My advice (and his) was for the .300 win mag. Granted, we never discussed the .325...

***NOTE: When I say worked, here's what I mean: I worked in his shop for about 4 months 1 or 2 days a week for about 8 hours. It was for ME to learn, and for him to get caught up on some advanced work. So while he did trigger jobs, I did detail cleanings, all the while asking questions and trying to soak up his years of gunsmithing experience and knowledge as best I could. So NO, I am not a licensed gunsmith, nor will I claim to be able to do advanced work. If you need something blued, refinished, assembled, cleaned, etc, I can do that, but NO, I am not a gunsmith. I do NOT want to be labeled as one only because I don't want to claim any knowledge/abilities that I don't have. I am always trying to learn their trade for my own benefit, but again, my disclaimer is that I am NOT a gunsmith. (is that disclaimer good enough? lol)

[PUCKER]

Sure thing.

The work was first-rate.

Dog - I've got a Weatherby Accumark chambered in .300 WinMag, it also has an Accubrake (added on by Ray's in Dallas), scoped with a Swarovski 10x. It packs a punch, let me tell you! That's why I added the Accubrake. It's quite L O U D with the brake but it definitely tames the recoil. I haven't shot it in years, not into rifles/hunting like I used to be. I bought it for the exact reasons you posted. My schedule for a range trip would probably be at least a week out.

Thanks. I may want to shoot it if you don't mind.

By the way, how did you like the work Ray's did? I'm thinking about using them for some work on my .30/06.