Pictures of your "Brown Guns"

[WTR]

I have the 18" Stainless GSR, with a x 2.5 Leopold that is forward mounted on see-thru mounts. I had to add a cheekpad to allow a good cheekweld while using the scope. I also replaced the flash hider with the thread protector.

The stainless 18” version wasn’t available when I bought mine, or I might well have bought that instead. I don’t feel like an extra 2” of barrel would be that much more noticeably cumbersome. One note..... I found out the hard way that there is truth to a certain rumor I had heard about the barrel threading on the Gunsite Scouts not being concentric to the bore.

I like Ruger stainless, I probably would have got it in 16" if it was available at the time. Taking off the hider was my way of compensating for the extra 2 inches. I think it looks better and is just less likely to catch on stuff. Jeff Cooper's concept of a scout was someone on foot or horseback. My 21st century concept is being on foot or inside my Honda where every inch counts for maneuvering.

Someday if the government decides that our hearing is worth saving I would love to have a suppressed gun. I wouldn't suppress the GSR though. I would want a 300 BO AR style or a 22lR bolt or lever suppressed. I value the GSR compactness and power of the .308 more than my hearing.

My scope is lower to the barrel than yours, so an elevated cheek rest isn’t necessary. It looks like you’re using “look through” rings? I solved it by using quick-release Burris XTR tactical rings. The scope sits lower to the bore, and if it needs to be removed for any reason, popping two levers open gets it off the rail quickly, and bingo - iron sights. If remounted, it’s not going to return to perfect zero, but it will be close enough for quick and dirty, and can be adjusted on the fly fairly quickly with that milling reticle and matching .1 mil clicks on the turrets.

In Hindsight I should have used a good set of quick releases. One thing I have learned is if you sight it in at 25 Yards you're pretty much good to go out to 300 yards. Sighting / resighting in a .308 is pretty easy and can be done with a half box of ammo. The thing is, I only have access to a 100 yard range so I don't have a lot of motivation to lower the scope at this time but it is something I probably will change sooner or later. I do think that sling might be a better investment to my shooting skills though.

If you sight in at 25 yards as a zero, you are going to be + or - 15 " low at 300 yards.depending on bull it weight. You also can sight in with just two shots at 25 yards. Save some ammo or fun shoot .

[ThistleWerke]

Is this brown enough?

[Scott B.]

Is this brown enough?

It's a little red.

Nice.

[The Annoyed Man]

Is this brown enough?

It's a little red.

Nice.

Well, it’s a commie gun. What did you expect?

[The Annoyed Man]

In Hindsight I should have used a good set of quick releases. One thing I have learned is if you sight it in at 25 Yards you're pretty much good to go out to 300 yards. Sighting / resighting in a .308 is pretty easy and can be done with a half box of ammo. The thing is, I only have access to a 100 yard range so I don't have a lot of motivation to lower the scope at this time but it is something I probably will change sooner or later. I do think that sling might be a better investment to my shooting skills though.

If you sight in at 25 yards as a zero, you are going to be + or - 15 " low at 300 yards.depending on bull it weight. You also can sight in with just two shots at 25 yards. Save some ammo or fun shoot .

There is a VERY good online ballistic calculator at http://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmtraj-5.1.cgi. In my own 16” Gunsite Scout, I have chronographed a real world average velocity of 2537 fps with a SD of 24.8, using a 175 grain SMK over 44 grains of Varget. My guess is that with Liberty’s 18” barrel, he’d be good for another 50 fps or so, but you should beg, borrow, or buy a chrono and make sure of what your load clocks in your rifle. EVERYthing depends on knowing that muzzle velocity number.

In any case, if you plug MY data into the JBM Ballistics calculator, and at the bottom check “Zero at Max Point Blank Range”, it returns a very useful data set. For rifles that either have iron sights, or lack a subtended reticle in their scopes, you can know the ideal zero distance, and what your +/- values are along the trajectory. With my scope height of 1.75” above the bore, and the target’s “vital radius” set to 5.0” (a 10” circle), here’s some of the critical numbers:

Initial zero is somewhere just past 20 yards.....

25 yards - 0.3” high
50 yards - 2.0” high
75 yards - 3.3” high
100 yards - 4.3” high
125 yards - 4.8” high
150 yards - 5.0” high
175 yards - 4.7” high
200 yards - 4.0” high
225 yards - 2.8” high
250 yards - 1.2” high
265 yards - 0.0”
275 yards - 0.9” low
300 yards - 3.5” low
310 yards - 4.7” low

So to maintain a “point and click” zero that will fall inside of a 10” circle during its entire trajectory, your MPBR is 310 yards ...... which is about as far as you have any business shooting an animal with a Gunsite Scout.....and you have a 20/265 yard zero. Your bullet will never be more than 5” high or low along its trajectory, relative to the point of aim. If you’re trying to hit a man, then hunting ethics don’t matter, and you can extend that range quite a bit further. With a 9” radius (18” target circle), you extend your MPBR to 395 yards with a 15/335 yard zero.

The bigger the radius, the further your MPBR will be, but you’ll also run into the practical. Choosing a 15” radius gives you a 30” circle, which decreases your number of hits on a target that is smaller than that. If the average man is 18” across at the shoulders, that’s a lot of misses. If you credit the average buck with 15” from spine to brisket and set your target radius accordingly, that’s a lot of wounded deer getting away and suffering unnecessarily. So you have to exercise some wisdom in figuring out what is going to work best for you. I decided for myself to keep it based on a 5” radius target, and then I can be sure of delivering a fatal hit out to 310 yards, without having to make adjustments in the scope, or changing my hold-overs. That’s my personal limit for me. Everyone has to decide for themselves what they are comfortable with.

Maximum Point Blank Range numbers give you the same kind of data set that calculation systems such as the Santoz Improved 50 meter Battle Zero give you for an AR platform rifle..... you can turn your cross hairs or iron sights into a point and click interface. Place the sight, dot, or crosshairs in the middle of that 10” or 18” circle, and you can be reasonably certain that your bullet will land somewher in that circle. For a white tail deer or a hog, that 10” circle represents the vital zone for an ethical kill. For a man, that 18” circle represents a torso hit - which, with a .308 inside of 500 yards is going to be a devastating wound. It’s not that I want to cause suffering if I have to shoot a man, but if I have cause to be shooting at a man, I don’t much care if the bullet wounds or kills him. I just want him to stop shooting at me.

In any case, MPBR is more important to me if I don’t have a subtended reticle. My GSR has a MRAD reticle with plenty of subtendsions, so I have an easier time figuring out hold-over changes if necessary. The plain Jane duplex reticle in the scout scope on my Marlin is makes figuring out the MPBR much more important. Fortunately, I have the muzzle velocities with my ammo of choice in that rifle too - Hornady Leverevolution 160 grain FTX at 2360 fps, and Remington Core-Lokt 170 grain SP at 2159 fps.

[puma guy]

I may take a day or two to photograph and download my brown gun collection. Does a list count? I don't even know what I have. I finally counted how many Marlin Bolt action .22 and .22 mag rifles I had. It was far more that I thought. Love all the posts of those wood and steel guns.

[puma guy]

Here are some "brown" Rugers.
Top to Bottom:
1960's Super Blackhawk .44 Mag 7½" Bbl
1960's Blackhawk .357 4-5/8" Bbl
1960's Super Single Sic Convertible .22/.22WMR 6½" Bbl
Bear Cat .22 LR I can't remember what year.
The .357 is a little worse for the wear. It was stolen from my home in 1995 and I recovered it a couple of years later when it was used in a robbery and the actor was caught red handed.
None have been converted.

[treadlightly]

Brown guns, eh?

A family member has been looking for a good BUG (Backed Up Gun), and I found this ideal example at our local Cabela's.

The most amazing aspect of this particular design is the way it gives the shooter a way to be responsible for negligent discharges.

I'm hoping I can convince my Representative to push for Congress arming up with these for the next session. I've always thought flushing a grouse could be a metaphor conservative legislators could learn from.

Particularly when they pass real stinker legislation.

Vote conservative, it's the polite thing to do, sort of like striking a match.

[spectre]

Brown guns, eh?

A family member has been looking for a good BUG (Backed Up Gun), and I found this ideal example at our local Cabela's.

The most amazing aspect of this particular design is the way it gives the shooter a way to be responsible for negligent discharges.

I'm hoping I can convince my Representative to push for Congress arming up with these for the next session. I've always thought flushing a grouse could be a metaphor conservative legislators could learn from.

Thanks for reminding me of the shotgun scene in Crank 2.

[Scott B.]

Okay, I added another 'brown' gun.

Browning Citori 725 Skeet, 30", 12ga. This means I'm going to go 50 straight for the first time, right? (it's never the shooter's fault)

[NJ_Expat]

Hate to bring up an older thread, but I was lurking and saw the OP's M1, so here's mine.

Built it myself on a CMP barreled receiver (Springfield, November 1942, in 30-06) using correct, new old stock WW2 parts. The stock was a brand new raw Boyd's stock that I hit with red Fiebing's leather dye, and then wet sanded with pure tung oil. Sling is a Ron Brown. Bayonet is a Utica Cutlery (circa 1918) that was cut down for issue in WW2.



And here is the M1's little brother, the LRB M14 that I built last year. It is now currently sitting in a Sage EBR stock.
-LRB receiver and bolt
-Fulton Armory (Criterion) 16" barrel, 7.62 NATO, 1 in 10" twist
-Smith Enterprise gas system and muzzle brake
-Sadlak NM op rod spring
-Chrome silicon recoil spring
-USGI operating rod (TRW)
-USGI rear sight assembly
-USGI trigger group (H&R)
-USGI bolt guts (new old stock)
-USGI bolt stop

[Scott B.]

Both are great, but I really love the red tint to that finish. Looks terrific.

[NJ_Expat]

Both are great, but I really love the red tint to that finish. Looks terrific.

Thanks Scott. That Fiebing's leather dye is great on walnut, and the pure tung oil brings out the grain like nothing else. In the sun, it looks like it's on fire.

[LTUME1978]

Scott B.

How do you like having the Garand set up in .308? I will be traveling to the CMP in a couple of weeks to shoot in the IDPA National Championship. Will be my first time there and probably my last. I need an M1 like I need a hole in my head but have been thinking about getting one for some time. Have been trying to decide between the 30-06 and the 308.

[Scott B.]

Scott B.

How do you like having the Garand set up in .308? I will be traveling to the CMP in a couple of weeks to shoot in the IDPA National Championship. Will be my first time there and probably my last. I need an M1 like I need a hole in my head but have been thinking about getting one for some time. Have been trying to decide between the 30-06 and the 308.

I really like it, but it's almost too pretty to shoot. Thinking seriously about buying Field or Service grade 30.06 that I won't feel the need to baby. Plus I'd love a WW2 era Garand. My 308 Special receiver is from the last year of production in the mid-50s.

It's definitely one of the top 3 or 4 I'd have to try and save over all the rest.