Shooting at Twin Peaks in Waco

[ScooterSissy]

This is an interesting side of the story that most haven't seen in the MSM. I can say for sure, that portions of it are true. It may all be true, but I know that some things are told in this article that weren't told in many others.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/ ... story.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[ShootDontTalk]

But, unless you're going to do a three part patch (top rocker naming the club, bottom rocker naming the location, which can be a city, county, or state, and a club patch) none of that applies. No one is going to ask your GHG-ODM-RC (Grey Haired Grampas One Day a Month Riding Club) to pay any kind of dues, unless you decide to throw on a top and bottom rocker. However, they may tell you that the colors you are using are too close to theirs, and you need to change them. No money involved, they will either tell you to change the patch or the colors, or tell you not to wear it.

Here is where I will have to depart from your statement. I am the only one who will tell myself what to wear or not wear or to whom I will or won't pay "dues" (which, in my view is extortion money). What exactly do you have to gain by obeying their orders?

I'm going to abandon my pointy hat analogy, and do one more realistic. I have no particular desire to wear a pointy white hat, but blue is my favorite color. I would be making a mistake to walk around southside Dallas with a blue warm-up jacket on, if I know that there are gangs in the area that "claim" that color.

This is much the same thing.

Except that you're not talking a neighborhood that can be avoided, you're talking a STATE. Last I looked no motorcycle club owns the state.

I've faced some enemies in my time who all thought it best that I submit to their ideas for how I should continue living my life. I've never been intimidated. I'm probably not alone.

[ScooterSissy]

But, unless you're going to do a three part patch (top rocker naming the club, bottom rocker naming the location, which can be a city, county, or state, and a club patch) none of that applies. No one is going to ask your GHG-ODM-RC (Grey Haired Grampas One Day a Month Riding Club) to pay any kind of dues, unless you decide to throw on a top and bottom rocker. However, they may tell you that the colors you are using are too close to theirs, and you need to change them. No money involved, they will either tell you to change the patch or the colors, or tell you not to wear it.

Here is where I will have to depart from your statement. I am the only one who will tell myself what to wear or not wear or to whom I will or won't pay "dues" (which, in my view is extortion money). What exactly do you have to gain by obeying their orders?

I'm going to abandon my pointy hat analogy, and do one more realistic. I have no particular desire to wear a pointy white hat, but blue is my favorite color. I would be making a mistake to walk around southside Dallas with a blue warm-up jacket on, if I know that there are gangs in the area that "claim" that color.

This is much the same thing.

Except that you're not talking a neighborhood that can be avoided, you're talking a STATE. Last I looked no motorcycle club owns the state.

I've faced some enemies in my time who all thought it best that I submit to their ideas for how I should continue living my life. I've never been intimidated. I'm probably not alone.

Sorry you don't see it, but in my opinion the analogy holds. Yes, the neighborhood can be avoided, as can the wearing of a patch. Last I look, no gang owned a neighborhood, or a particular color; yet the wise avoid that combination (neighborhood and gang color), just as the wise would avoid double rockers with backpatches, especially those that match colors with established MCs. I hope you see what I'm saying.

I want to make sure I'm clear though, I do not avoid legitimate activities out of fear or intimidation. If I want to go to an event where there are MCs, I go. I wear the same outfits I normally wear while riding. There's a unwritten "warning" for bikers to avoid Waco right now, I have an activity near Temple that I've planned for weeks. I'll be on my bike, riding right past Twin Peaks without concern.

[carlson1]

This is an interesting side of the story that most haven't seen in the MSM. I can say for sure, that portions of it are true. It may all be true, but I know that some things are told in this article that weren't told in many others.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/ ... story.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This gives a person a lot to think about. This never crossed my mind. I guess there are two sides and then the truth. It will be interesting to see how this turns out if it ever does.

[The Annoyed Man]

I don't give a cup of warm spit for what someone else says I can wear, and frankly, I think it is shameful that anyone would be an apologist for this kind of crap. Someone is going to tell me that a club of dirtbags with a membership of only 2300 (worldwide) gets to tell a state with 27 MILLION people what they can and can't wear? That dog won't hunt, and shame on anybody who says that it should.

[treadlightly]

TAM, you hit the nail on the head. Makes me want to form my own gang. Maybe something dedicated to the lost cause of analog computing. Instead of top and bottom rockers we'll have top and bottom sine and cosine waves bracketing our patch, TEXAS on the cosine.

Our feared battle cry will be one of my Dad's Engineering Battalion marching songs from WW2, sung to the tune of My Bonnie Lies Over The Ocean:

Some day I will say o'er the ocean,
A dirty old foe I will see,
I'll pull out my slide rule and slay him,
With the cosine of A minus B!

Seriously, I'm native born. I'm not happy with a lot, but don't stand between me and my national pride. Leave this Republic free. Move to California if you want to subjugate your fellow man.

I jest about Texas nationalism, sort of. But don't mess with you know who.

[ScooterSissy]

I don't give a cup of warm spit for what someone else says I can wear, and frankly, I think it is shameful that anyone would be an apologist for this kind of crap. Someone is going to tell me that a club of dirtbags with a membership of only 2300 (worldwide) gets to tell a state with 27 MILLION people what they can and can't wear? That dog won't hunt, and shame on anybody who says that it should.

TAM, please look back and see where I said "should". If I did, it was a typo. I'm talking about the way things are, not the way they should be.

It's interesting, seems most folks on here have the attitude that the Cossacks, the MC that had the most die, were "scum" or "thugs"; yet this is the very attitude they had, and was largely the reason they've been at "war" with the Bandidos, and had 7 or 8 of their members die - the attitude that no one was going to tell them what rocker they could wear.

Now, are we suddenly going to see a change in attitude from forum members, and see them pronounced heroes for standing up for what they believe?

[The Annoyed Man]

I don't give a cup of warm spit for what someone else says I can wear, and frankly, I think it is shameful that anyone would be an apologist for this kind of crap. Someone is going to tell me that a club of dirtbags with a membership of only 2300 (worldwide) gets to tell a state with 27 MILLION people what they can and can't wear? That dog won't hunt, and shame on anybody who says that it should.

TAM, please look back and see where I said "should". If I did, it was a typo. I'm talking about the way things are, not the way they should be.

It's interesting, seems most folks on here have the attitude that the Cossacks, the MC that had the most die, were "scum" or "thugs"; yet this is the very attitude they had, and was largely the reason they've been at "war" with the Bandidos, and had 7 or 8 of their members die - the attitude that no one was going to tell them what rocker they could wear.

Now, are we suddenly going to see a change in attitude from forum members, and see them pronounced heroes for standing up for what they believe?

The "dirtbags" I referenced were the Banditos, which the article I quoted described as having a membership of 2300 "worldwide". I never referenced the Cossaks, who, by my reconning came to make peace. Re read my post.

The state of Texas has never granted the Banditos a charter to collect a fee for the privilege of putting a Texas rocker on their colors. Therefore, when they extort a fee backed up by an implied (and apparently quite real) threat of violence for "permission" to wear the rocker, that makes them a true criminal enterprise.......even if they never ran guns or sold drugs or murdered rivals, or any of the other crimes of which they are suspected. They have no LEGAL authority to demand or collect the fee, and they have no LEGAL authority to enforce their claim. That makes them a criminal gang. Period.

Near as I can tell, while the Cossaks may not be sweet little angels, they are willing to live and let live. As a philosophical libertarian, I say good for them. But, until the state grants them exclusive use of the word "Texas" on a rocker and authority to restrict its use, the Banditos club needs to be eradicated......just like any other criminal organization.

[ShootDontTalk]

The "dirtbags" I referenced were the Banditos, which the article I quoted described as having a membership of 2300 "worldwide". I never referenced the Cossaks, who, by my reconning came to make peace. Re read my post.

The state of Texas has never granted the Banditos a charter to collect a fee for the privilege of putting a Texas rocker on their colors. Therefore, when they extort a fee backed up by an implied (and apparently quite real) threat of violence for "permission" to wear the rocker, that makes them a true criminal enterprise.......even if they never ran guns or sold drugs or murdered rivals, or any of the other crimes of which they are suspected. They have no LEGAL authority to demand or collect the fee, and they have no LEGAL authority to enforce their claim. That makes them a criminal gang. Period.

Near as I can tell, while the Cossaks may not be sweet little angels, they are willing to live and let live. As a philosophical libertarian, I say good for them. But, until the state grants them exclusive use of the word "Texas" on a rocker and authority to restrict its use, the Banditos club needs to be eradicated......just like any other criminal organization.

TAM...well said. Too many people have given their lives for anyone to live in tyranny from a motorcycle gang, of all things. And here I thought the motorcycle "lifestyle" went out with "Easy Rider."

Scootersissy...I understand what you're saying. Sometimes though remaining silent and going along to get along lands you right in the middle of what Ben Franklin said.

I got to Texas as quick as I could, but I was born in the same state as David Crockett and I've always fancied some of his thoughts, I leave this rule for others when I'm dead - Be always sure you're right — THEN GO AHEAD!

[Abraham]

Yes, the majority of those who ride motorcycles are the law abiding 99% and the 1% are criminals.

The 1% are into pathological role playing though they're mostly middle age to geezer age, they apparently can't stand being themselves. They have to posture like an adolescent. Rather than being cool, they're pathetic.

Wearing colors (can we be anymore juvenile?) and acting out wherever they go is cause for disgust not admiration, though I think a few ordinary misguided citizens seem to idolize these cretins.

[ShootDontTalk]

Yes, the majority of those who ride motorcycles are the law abiding 99% and the 1% are criminals.

The 1% are into pathological role playing though they're mostly middle age to geezer age, they apparently can't stand being themselves. They have to posture like an adolescent. Rather than being cool, they're pathetic.

Wearing colors (can we be anymore juvenile?) and acting out wherever they go is cause for disgust not admiration, though I think a few ordinary misguided citizens seem to idolize these cretins.

I am just having trouble understanding how the 99%, who, prior to buying a motorcycle, would never agree to a criminal extortion plot, somehow feel so threatened as to give in to that demand for compliance - either by agreement or cash - after plunking down their hard-earned money for a motorcycle. With all due respect to the 99%, I just don't get it.

[The Annoyed Man]

Let's put this into perspective, and substitute the names of well known benevolent organizations.....

Let's say that the members of Freemasonry, Rotary, Odd Fellows, and Elk lodges rode miniature red motorcycles in small town parades, and they all like to wear their lodge colors when doing so. So one day, the Freemasons add a "Texas" rocker under their colors. The other societies all say, "hey, that's cool....we'll do the same". But then the Freemasons, believing that they are the only REAL benevolent society and the others are all imposters, start trying to enforce a $100 fee on any member of Rotary, Odd Fellows, and Elks who they catch out in public wearing a "Texas" rocker under their colors while riding their miniature red motorcycles in small town parades. Some of the others are not intimidated, and they tell the Freemasons to go pee up a rope, and they keep wearing their colors. So the Freemasons, totally incensed, start putting out a "kill on sight" fatwah on anybody wearing a "Texas rocker" who is neither a Freemason, nor a paid subscriber to the use of the rocker. At that point, the Freemasons have crossed over from being a benevolent society, to being a criminal gang.

THAT is what the Banditos are guilty of. I don't care if they spent every Sunday teaching little children about the Bible and helping old ladies across the street. Once they start the criminal enterprise of extorting money from people for the use of the state's name - without a specific and duly authorized charter from the state to do so - they are now a criminal gang, and it erases ANY good they might have done......PARTICULARLY when they KILL people for it.

So screw 'em. I've got no use for trash like that, and it is time to take the trash out.

[jmra]

Yes, the majority of those who ride motorcycles are the law abiding 99% and the 1% are criminals.

The 1% are into pathological role playing though they're mostly middle age to geezer age, they apparently can't stand being themselves. They have to posture like an adolescent. Rather than being cool, they're pathetic.

Wearing colors (can we be anymore juvenile?) and acting out wherever they go is cause for disgust not admiration, though I think a few ordinary misguided citizens seem to idolize these cretins.

I am just having trouble understanding how the 99%, who, prior to buying a motorcycle, would never agree to a criminal extortion plot, somehow feel so threatened as to give in to that demand for compliance - either by agreement or cash - after plunking down their hard-earned money for a motorcycle. With all due respect to the 99%, I just don't get it.

Maybe I'm out of touch here, but is it the 99% that are getting extorted or is it part of the 1% extorting other parts of the 1%. I belonged to several groups when I rode (think CMA type groups) and the only thing we paid was minimal dues to the organization for records upkeep and the like.
I guess I was thinking the Texas Rocker and extortion thing was more of a drug turf issue than anything else.

[Dave2]

Maybe something dedicated to the lost cause of analog computing. Instead of top and bottom rockers we'll have top and bottom sine and cosine waves bracketing our patch, TEXAS on the cosine.

Our feared battle cry will be one of my Dad's Engineering Battalion marching songs from WW2, sung to the tune of My Bonnie Lies Over The Ocean:

Some day I will say o'er the ocean,
A dirty old foe I will see,
I'll pull out my slide rule and slay him,
With the cosine of A minus B!

I'm in. When's the first meeting? I don't own a motorcycle, but I have a slide rule app on my phone.

[treadlightly]

I'm in. When's the first meeting? I don't own a motorcycle, but I have a slide rule app on my phone.

A slide rule app? I gotta find that - very cool. You have better nerd creds than I. Maybe I can "prospect" in your club.