Friend with Alzheimer's

[Dreamer42]

I have a friend who has Alzheimer's. He's had his carry licence for over 15 years. His doctor has already recommended that he no longer drive. His wife's concern is that if he carries and uses his weapon in self defense, will there be risks of liability if he's sued? His renewal comes up this January and she hasn't told him. She's reluctant to tell him he doesn't need to renew because not being able to drive hit him really hard, and telling him he can't renew may really hurt him. But the reality is there may be legal issues if he were to shoot someone, even if it is legitimate. What advise would you give?

[Bruin98]

Can they let him renew and it "get lost in the mail?"

If they check the mail before he does, they can hide it in a safe location.

Depending on advancement, it may never be an issue.

[Richbirdhunter]

My dad had dementia and we went with honesty was the best policy. He would be mad and blame us for taking away everything from him but we gave him love and support along with the limitations of his dementia. Sometimes we would cry, sometimes we were angry but he always knew that he was loved.

[warnmar10]

I have a friend who has Alzheimer's. He's had his carry licence for over 15 years. His doctor has already recommended that he no longer drive. His wife's concern is that if he carries and uses his weapon in self defense, will there be risks of liability if he's sued? His renewal comes up this January and she hasn't told him. She's reluctant to tell him he doesn't need to renew because not being able to drive hit him really hard, and telling him he can't renew may really hurt him. But the reality is there may be legal issues if he were to shoot someone, even if it is legitimate. What advise would you give?

He doesn't need a license to carry at home or in the car. Your friend's wife has a more fundamental problem than mere license renewal. If he is mentally impaired she needs to take the guns away.

[RPBrown]

My dad has late stage Alzheimer's and it was tough on him and us when we had to take his keys, gun, and both license's away. He was very angry but after a while, he didn't remember either. He has asked about his keys several times but we just tell him he must have laid them down somewhere and he forgets all about them.
One thing that may be of benefit is that he is now under the "mental health" section of the penal code and is thereby not eligible for an LTC.
The things you go through with someone that has this terrible illness can be overwhelming and is hard on anyone involved. There will be fits of anger and tears on both sides but you have to do what is ultimately best for them in the long run. In our case, we felt like it was to take them away. We have since moved dad to a retirement home since we could no longer give him the care he needed. That was tough as well.

[twomillenium]

If he were to be involved in justified use of deadly force, he would have the same responsibility of proof as someone without Alzheimer's. If he were involved in use of deadly force because of his perception due to Alzheimer's, then he would have a bad legal and civil situation and probably those family members who allowed him to carry a firearm and knew of his illness. Is it really worth it?? Would you want any of your loved ones to be around anyone carrying a firearm with diminished ability to comprehend what is going on around them? Being diagnosed with Alzheimer's is tragic but it also means that he will rarely be on his own and now he must rely on his loved ones not only to assist him in every day matters but for his protection as well.

I have much sympathy for their situation and my prayers are with your friend an his loved ones.

[crazy2medic]

My mother died from Alzheimer's, I worked for a Neurologist for 4yrs, his speciality was Alzheimer's! Understand that Alzheimer's patients get to the point of sudden outbursts of anger, they themselves may not even know why they are angry! We had a patient the per his wife he was the kindest most gentle man she had ever met! But the disease caused him to develop angry outburst and he would beat her up, that's when he was put in a nursing home that specialized in Alzheimer's patients.
My suggestion is he needs to not have his ltc and the guns need to be locked away!

[PriestTheRunner]

Time to lock up the firearms in the safe or take them to a safe location (like your place). Change the gun-safe combination.

Leave a big-ol can of mace sitting around if self-protection is a problem. Worst case scenario is he peppers the wrong person and you have a laugh (and maybe a 'minor' lawsuit). Discuss it with him if you must, but you cannot responsibly leave the firearms in his care.

Some relevant scenarios:
- Air Conditioner Mechanic goes into the back yard to work on the unit (and even announces his presence at the front door), needs to go in and turn off (or on) the indoor unit. Your father thinks he is being home invaded (and rightfully so in his mind)- bad things can happen.
- Wife gets up for water, tells husband, he forgets and hears strange noises, goes to investigate....

And on, and on. Please don't allow those situations to happen.

Not a lawyer, but please consider the possibilities as this thing progresses.

[SewTexas]

I like the idea of, if he has a gun safe, locking the guns up, changing the combo, and then, if he goes to the safe simply saying, "huh, maybe try again in a little while?" then distract him with another activity....he'll probably forget the issue for a few days.

I've come to the realization while working with my Mother-in-law that there are "kind lies". Like when she asks for my Father-in-law, I will first say "he's not here right now". Only if she persists will we remind her that he passed away 5 years ago.

I do realize that my mother-in-ago is not a "typical" Alz patient in that she is fairly calm, not aggressive, etc. She is a mild mannered 93 year old Japanese lady. When she started sun-downing we got her on an anti-anxiety med.

[Jusme]

I agree with most of the other posters. While taking away any privilege, is very difficult, Alzheimer's patients, are very unpredictable. As others have stated, those closest to him, may suddenly appear as a gang of hooligans, along with other scenarios, that could be just as tragic, if he is allowed to have access to his guns.
Please discuss this with him when he is lucid, and explain your reasons for doing so. It won't be easy, but nothing about that insidious disease is.
My prayers are with you and the rest of the family, I lost my father to Alzheimer's, so I know what you are, and will be, going through.

[Lynyrd]

Lock the guns up. How to approach that with your friend all depends on the stage of this horrible disease that he is in. From personal experience, I can say that it will only get worse. Having access to a firearm of any kind is a terrible danger to all the people he is around while going through this. If he still knows you, there will come a day when he doesn't. IMHO you will be helping him best by acting now why you still can.

[Dreamer42]

Thanks so much for the replies. I greatly appreciate all of the wise and honest answers. It's one of those decisions we know we need her to take for his benefit as well as the safety of everyone else. All of his guns are in a safe, and he already has difficulty opening it. We just need to break it to him gently. He's a sweet man, retired educator, and even now understands when things are explained logically and simply. Thanks again.

[pushpullpete]

It is a painful & hard place for ALL involved. Years ago when we went thru this w my m-i-l, everything got locked up. She and I got
along very well, but, there were a few times where she threatened to shoot me, and she "immensely disiked" guns. The safe was
mine & my wifes, m-i-l did not have the combo, that made things easier for us. She didn't have access to anything sharper than a
butter knife in the mid/late afternoon when she would typically sundown. Through no fault of hers, it was the disease, she at times
didn't know me or my wife. I'd been around for 30+ yrs, my wife a couple decades longer. We put simple flip locks on the inside of
the doors that we didn't want her to go thru (she couldn't lift her arms above her shoulders) & blocked her way to our room so we
wouldn't wake up w her standing over us in the middle of the night. It's painful and necessary for everyones safety, I would lock things
up & change the safe combo. I have told my wife & kids to do the same if I start to slip. I love my family & would never want to hurt
any of them. EVER
Very tough place to be, good thoughts to all involved.

[couzin]

MIL lived with us in East Texas during her twilight years and Alzheimer's and pancreatic cancer was just ravaging her. One evening she went tear-..$$ing around the house looking for her rifle because "a moose was headbutting (my) truck"! We still laugh about the things she did and said, and I am tearing up thinking about her right now because I still miss her, but I was real glad all the firearms were locked away. If I start slipping, I will start selling my guns. If I don't do that, my wife has a list of everything with a reasonable value on each and she can have at it.