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*Note* Before the flames come, I know my uncle is an idiot for not learning his lesson the first time. Lets continue on with the story

My uncle's truck, that parks right in front of our house, got broken into early in the morning around 3:00am-4:00am. They smashed the back window and jumped right in. The truck has an alarm, but only goes off when the door opens. I went to Whataburger around 2:30am to go get some late night breakfast, so I didn't see anything happen during this time. I didn't sleep till 4:30am, so I didn't hear anything. My uncle woke me up at 8:00am, saying someone broken into his truck again. I told myself, this cannot happen again. They stole his MP3 Head Unit, IPod, and $100 Nike Sunglasses. Now we're just waiting on the LEO to come by and make a report.

Lets take a step back here...

Back in December, same situation happen here with the same uncle I lived with. BG pulled a smashed and grabbed job. We didn't hear anything at night because everyone was sleeping. BTW, alarm didn't go off either. They stole the exact same thing, except the Nike Sunglasses.

2 months ago around 2:30am, my little brother's car got broken into. He drives a Honda Accord Coupe BTW. The BG smashed the drivers side window and jumped in. Dumb enough, he opened up the door and the alarm went off. Me and my brother was still awake at this time, so I heard the alarm. I ran and grabbed my G19 off of my computer desk and went outside. By the time, we got outside, the BG already fled. We live on a corner of a 4 way street, so the BG could have taken any direction.

I believe it's the same BG that pulled this job 3 times within less than a year.


Question:

If they come back, do the same job, and I catch them in the act, what is the justification in shooting in this situation? Yes or No?

PC §9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property:
(1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.41; and
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime;

That said, I would hesitate to go outdoors to confront a criminal when I didn't know whether he was armed or had accomplices. Your decision.

[Later] When I lived in a neighborhood in Chicago where car break-ins were rampant, many people put external locks on the hood and left the doors open, with nothing worth stealing in the car. The downside of this approach is that a bum may go to sleep in your car.

- Jim

Why is it that rather than trying to prevent this from happening again your first thought is "can I shoot them?"

I have seen many threads on here about improving security around the home. I would personally look into that first.

Get a dog and put a pen up near where the vehicles are parked.

KRM45 wrote:Why is it that rather than trying to prevent this from happening again your first thought is "can I shoot them?"

I have seen many threads on here about improving security around the home. I would personally look into that first.

NVD can answer for himself, but it hardly seems like this was his first thought. He and his family have been victimized repeatedly. The police have been unable to prevent tham from being further victimized, nor have they (apparently) caught those responsible.

So to me NVD is just doing what almost anyone would do - exploring his legal options. And in TX, at nighttime, one of those options may be the application of deadly force.

I think the best outcome for all concerned is if the people breaking into cars in his neighborhood realized the error of their ways and decided to go straight.

No disrespect to your uncle intended, but come on...

A) Park in the driveway, put up a flood light, or get a better car alarm. Anything to make it less "desirable" to break into the truck.

B) Use common sense. If the thief only stole the iPod, stero unit, and sunglasses (ie: NOT THE TRUCK ITSELF), then why in the world would your uncle let his truck sit unattended for even one more second with his valuables clearly visible inside? Tell him to take his stuff into the house.

C) Try just a tiny bit harder not to seek out "justification [for] shooting". With all due respect to all of you, there is way to much desire to shoot someone from the members of this forum. As I've said before, I bet I'm the youngest person here, but I do know that my CHL is a license to protect myself with deadly force as a LAST RESULT, not a license to kill.

Just my two cents.

Oh, and whether he could have avoided the break in or not, my sympathies to your uncle. Having your property stolen from you just sucks. Period.

Legally you'd probably be OK (Criminal mischief in the nighttime) but that definition can be vague enough that you can still get into trouble if you rely upon it in my opinion, unless you feel your life was imminently in danger.

As far as the truck, get an interior motion detector for the car alarm. If the car alarm is an aftermarket one, most have modules to add an interior/exterior motion detector. If it's just the OEM alarm, i'd seriously consider getting an aftermarket alarm with an interior/exterior motion sensor. You should also get an alarm that'll page you by making the alarm fob beep.

When I was plagued by car breakins before moving to Texas, this kept further ones from happening for me.

I'd also explore getting a motion activated floodlight as previously suggested.

BTW, criminal mischief has a specific definition:

PC § 28.03. CRIMINAL MISCHIEF. (a) A person commits an offense if, without the effective consent of the owner:
(1) he intentionally or knowingly damages or destroys the tangible property of the owner;
(2) he intentionally or knowingly tampers with the tangible property of the owner and causes pecuniary loss or substantial inconvenience to the owner or a third person; or
(3) he intentionally or knowingly makes markings, including inscriptions, slogans, drawings, or paintings, on the tangible property of the owner.

It includes other offenses that involve public property, farm land, and livestock.

- Jim

You definitely need to remove valuables from view. It would probably be a wise idea to just take them inside. Get a small, hand-held rubbermaid container or pencil box (like the ones students use) and have him put his Ipod, sunglasses, etc. in there. He can just grab it and bring it in the house with him, then grab it on his way out the door.

My irritation would be getting my windows smashed. Driving around w/o windows when rain is expected would really tick me off. Definitely park under some lighting. Infact, light up your yard. These people aren't into spotlights.

Ask your PD if leaving windows rolled down or doors unlocked is a wise option in your area. I can see where it would work, but I can also see where it would make your insurance co not want to cover you in the event of car theft.

Sorry to come back on here and reply so late. There are 4 LEO's out here right now. This crime had been a setup. Not only my uncle's truck got broken into, but 4 other SUV been broken into last night also on the same street. They stole a lot of electronics. DVD Screens, MP3 Headunits, wallets, cell phones, money, and credit card. Looks like these BG did their homework before they did all this.

I live in the Ghetto part of Arlington near Parks Mall. I'm right off of Mayfield and Collins if anyone here recognizes the streets. Just let everyone here know that if you around this area, its not your friendly nice neighborhood you see everyday.

Yeah going out to home depot today to get some motion lights and flood lights. LEO told us they we need more lights around the house to prevent something happening again.

TheYoungGuy wrote:No disrespect to your uncle intended, but come on...

A) Park in the driveway, put up a flood light, or get a better car alarm. Anything to make it less "desirable" to break into the truck.

B) Use common sense. If the thief only stole the iPod, stero unit, and sunglasses (ie: NOT THE TRUCK ITSELF), then why in the world would your uncle let his truck sit unattended for even one more second with his valuables clearly visible inside? Tell him to take his stuff into the house.

C) Try just a tiny bit harder not to seek out "justification [for] shooting". With all due respect to all of you, there is way to much desire to shoot someone from the members of this forum. As I've said before, I bet I'm the youngest person here, but I do know that my CHL is a license to protect myself with deadly force as a LAST RESULT, not a license to kill.

Just my two cents.

Oh, and whether he could have avoided the break in or not, my sympathies to your uncle. Having your property stolen from you just stinks. Period.

I talk to the LEO about shooting in this situation about an hour ago. He told me it's justified in this situation to shoot someone that is burglarizing your vehicle or home at night. He told me directly, you gotta do what you gotta do because if he was in my shoes he would have done the same thing.

I'm pretty young myself. I'm only 22 yrs old. If I saw someone at night broken into my car and trying to steal my stuff, I would have unloaded my entire mag through my windshield. Like stated above, Criminal Mischief during nighttime.

My uncle, like I stated earlier, looks like he didn't learn his lesson. He took all his face plate and IPod and shoved it in the glove compartment. He wouldn't think they will break in again because they don't see the stuff laying around, but I guess he was wrong.

My uncle just took his car to go get his windows done. I didn't get a chance to get the picture of smashed window.

(2) he intentionally or knowingly tampers with the tangible property of the owner and causes pecuniary loss or substantial inconvenience to the owner or a third person;

Even something as innocuous as TPing someones trees in their yard constitutes Criminal Mischief. I would hope that no one would ever shoot someone over something as juvenile as this (especially since it's mainly H.S. kids doing it) but you sure can be issued a citation for it.

NguyenVanDon wrote:If I saw someone at night broken into my car and trying to steal my stuff, I would have unloaded my entire mag through my windshield....

Please think about this: You can be legally in the right and still get into a lot of trouble.

Until September 1, the thief or his relatives can sue you.

Imagine if the thief is a young kid and unarmed. The newspapers and TV can make you look like a bloodthirsty killer. You could have people marching outside your house or vandalizing it.

Just something to think about.

He wouldn't think they will break in again because they don't see the stuff laying around, but I guess he was wrong.

They know that you will replace the things they stole, so they come back after a few months. I lost two batteries in a few weeks that way.

- Jim