TexasCHLforum.com

I was reviewing their site and noticed this line:
"The exhibit hall is a City owned facility..."
from this page:
http://www.fwgunshow.com/mapsdirections.html

City owned means they can't post 30.06, right?

Is Will Rogers' Memorial Center actually owned by the city of Fort Worth?
Their downloadable rules state, "No concealed handguns", but its a far cry from 30.06 wording.

I am thinking about going this weekend and maybe taking the wife to look for a little .22 plinker for her. I'm really curious about this, since most gun shows are posted.

Does anyone know for sure?

P.S. Oh, and if anyone else is thinking about going, don't forget to print your coupon
http://www.fwgunshow.com/coupon.pdf

Although it may be owned by the city, it is leased by the show promoter giving them control. Similar to leasing an apartment or office.

The liability insurance that the promoter carries is what dictates no loaded firearms.

You will not be allowed to bring a loaded weapon into the show. There will be a table at the entrance with several FW police officers. If you wish to bring in a gun for any reason you will have to allow them to check it and then secure it with plastic ties.

Who is leasing or "controlling" the facility does not matter. PC30.06 does not apply if the property is owned by a government entity, regardless of who is leasing it from said government entity. If I owned a home that was zoned by the city forbidding a home day-care, for example, and I leased it to someone else, they could not run a home day-care, because the zoning laws still apply to them as the lessee. A lessee cannot gain rights/priviledges not given to the owner.

I would bet the show will be posted, because, as RPBrown stated, the show's insurance carrier will require it. The signs should be meaningless because the property is owned by the city, but don't expect the LEO's to know/understand/care about that. If you decide to try to carry, and are made, expect to be hassled tremendously, at the least. If you're arrested, you'll likely win in court, but at what cost?

1) As noted, 30.06 notices (either signs or verbal notice) are meaningless when the city owns the property.
2) Concealed means concealed.

Unless they're doing metal detectors or pat-downs (which would be illegal if performed by police officers), there's no issue.

Kevin

barres wrote:Who is leasing or "controlling" the facility does not matter. PC30.06 does not apply if the property is owned by a government entity, regardless of who is leasing it from said government entity. If I owned a home that was zoned by the city forbidding a home day-care, for example, and I leased it to someone else, they could not run a home day-care, because the zoning laws still apply to them as the lessee. A lessee cannot gain rights/priviledges not given to the owner.

I would bet the show will be posted, because, as RPBrown stated, the show's insurance carrier will require it. The signs should be meaningless because the property is owned by the city, but don't expect the LEO's to know/understand/care about that. If you decide to try to carry, and are made, expect to be hassled tremendously, at the least. If you're arrested, you'll likely win in court, but at what cost?

As much as I would love to be the test case for this, I really want to see the show. After throwing a fit and citing all of the laws I can think of to support my claim, I would probably be denied admittance altogether even sans firearm.

Oh well, what can ya do

kauboy wrote:After throwing a fit and citing all of the laws I can think of to support my claim, I would probably be denied admittance altogether even sans firearm.

Why would a fit be required? Do you plan walking up and announcing that you're carrying anyway?

See my post above.

Oh I know. I was going on the assumption that illegal searches were taking place and I was "made".

I guess I'll just walk up and look for such acts taking place and decide then and there based on the situation.

I've thought about approaching the officers at a gun show and stating something to the effect of "I'm complying by letting you examine/tie wrap all firearms currently in my possession, but not because the law requires me to." And explain to them that PC30.06, the law by which they are deriving their authority over a CHL holder, has no effect on government-owned property. Then see how they react. They can't do anything to me, because I'm complying, but their response would tell me whether they know that they don't have the authority on government property to disarm CHL'ers or not.

At least then I'd know what I was up against next time. And so would they. Unfortunately, I always seem busy when the gun shows hit my neck of the woods.

I talked to these officers at the last show. They aren't really hard over about CHL's. I mentioned that the show wasn't properly posted and they admitted that they were just safetying the "honest" CHL'ers (the ones who admit they are carrying).

If you go in loaded, they will keep your loaded mags at their desk as all ammo has to be in a "box".

MAFWG wrote:I talked to these officers at the last show. They aren't really hard over about CHL's. I mentioned that the show wasn't properly posted and they admitted that they were just safetying the "honest" CHL'ers (the ones who admit they are carrying).

If you go in loaded, they will keep your loaded mags at their desk as all ammo has to be in a "box".

An "honest CHL'er" knows what the "C" means. I'm not required to admit anything to them unless they ask for ID.

I always carry into gun shows. I know it isn't coming out for anything.

Once, when I needed to check fit in a prospective holster, I returned to my truck, unloaded it, and returned, allowing the pistol to be tied at the door.

The last time I was 'honest', I let them tie my pistol but they wouldn't let me in with the loaded magazine. I had ridden with a friend who was already inside, so I couldn't return it to the vehicle.

I could have trashed the ammo, but it was the principle.

Eventually, my friend came to check on me.

If anybody else is going, I'll have on the brightest orange hat in the place. Its got the new Joint Strike Fighter on it.

Maybe I'll see a few of ya there.

I was at the Ft. Worth show this morning.

There was a sign saying no loaded guns... but no 30.06 notice.

FWIW


Chuck

Yup, thats right. They actually had it right. Not a single 30.06 sign anywhere. I was very happy.

The wife ended up choosing a Walther P22. We went to the range right after, and she fell in love with it.