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I was on my way back from the san antonio zoo on saturday and stopped to put gas. Im not famiar with san antonio so i dont know what parts to avoid. The store seemed decent so i go in with my 3 year old brother to get some gatorade and pay for gas. I usually am aware of whats going on around me . I dont know how yall feel but when i have a child with me im always extra cautious. We start drinking while the gas is pumping and a car of about 3 or 4 guys pull up with rap music blaring, didnt think much. They are all wearing blue and are covered in jail bird style tattoos so i assumed they were in a gang. One of the guys starts walking toward my car and i start to reach for the lock box my glock 17 is in. The guy gets closer and yells at me "are you james friend" i say no and he walks back to the car to wait for his friends. Gas is finished pumping so i put the hose back and left. Nothing else happened. Was i wrong for profiling? What did i do wrong? Should i have said anything back to the guy at all?

Set aside for a moment the superficial details (rap music, tattoos), your in a strange town with a child, in a vulnerable position-(pumping gas) when approached by one of several strangers-(out numbered) and asked a seemingly innocent but anachronistic question-(possibly being "interviewed") so you move yourself in a position to access your firearm and assertively deny being "James' friend".
Based on those facts I would say moving to condition orange was reasonable and you handled it well.
I guess there are a few possibilities:
1. You looked like a friend of James and they wanted to introduce themselves and enjoy the warm glow of a mutual friendship
2. You were being assessed as a target or perhaps a threat
3. They were there to meet someone for a "deal" of sorts and the "friend of James" was just code

Now if this had been a group of church ladies or something, all the other details would remain true but only you can say for sure if your alarm would have gone off

As we used to say in basketball, no blood no foul.

You did fine. I usually try to purchase fuel around 7:00 am. Most of society's scum is still sleeping it off.

liberty2014 wrote:I was on my way back from the san antonio zoo on saturday and stopped to put gas. Im not famiar with san antonio so i dont know what parts to avoid. The store seemed decent so i go in with my 3 year old brother to get some gatorade and pay for gas. I usually am aware of whats going on around me . I dont know how yall feel but when i have a child with me im always extra cautious. We start drinking while the gas is pumping and a car of about 3 or 4 guys pull up with rap music blaring, didnt think much. They are all wearing blue and are covered in jail bird style tattoos so i assumed they were in a gang. One of the guys starts walking toward my car and i start to reach for the lock box my glock 17 is in. The guy gets closer and yells at me "are you james friend" i say no and he walks back to the car to wait for his friends. Gas is finished pumping so i put the hose back and left. Nothing else happened. Was i wrong for profiling? What did i do wrong? Should i have said anything back to the guy at all?

Probably nothing, but you never know. Good job being aware and alert. At first I thought you left a number out of your brother's age until you said "child."

I profile everyone I see, everywhere I go, every day. Is it wrong? I don't care.

Perhaps you should consider wearing your pistol in a holster?

Profiling is not inherently wrong. What is right or wrong is what you do with your assumptions. Shooting at them or pointing a weapon at them based on what they did would have been criminal. Going on alert and reacting assertively was not.

If they had been four white skinheads with prominent tattoos, the same reaction would have been appropriate.

Most people who live in cities know what a gang member looks and acts like. When they do so, they should expect to be treating accordingly. Some young men put on a tough-guy image as fashion, but wearing gang colors is serious business.

BTW, I had a similar situation a while back, and the thought that I was being unfairly prejudiced never crossed my mind: http://texaschlforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=108&t=61104" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

- Jim

Munk wrote:I profile everyone I see, everywhere I go, every day. Is it wrong? I don't care.

While not everyone fits their stereotype, those stereotypes exist for a reason. I don't think you were wrong in what you did. Better to be prepared and watchful than politically correct and dead.

TexAg12 wrote:

Munk wrote:I profile everyone I see, everywhere I go, every day. Is it wrong? I don't care.

While not everyone fits their stereotype, those stereotypes exist for a reason. I don't think you were wrong in what you did. Better to be prepared and watchful than politically correct and dead.

Well said

Thanks for the input guys. I dont wear a holster because im still waiting for plastic from austin

What would you have done if; it was a little old lady church group on Harley's? If you'da said "no" to Knowing James they could have said "then get ready to meet Jesus"

As posted above, unfamiliar territory, fueling, and having custody of kid(s)? No harm done.

liberty2014 wrote:Thanks for the input guys. I dont wear a holster because im still waiting for plastic from austin

It doesn't have to be in a lock box, just concealed. Put it in the door pocket or some other more easily accessible place, but away from the kid, o'course. The lock box is for when you're away from the car.

No, I think you did very well. You're not wrong for keeping yourself and your loved ones safe. Some bad things have happened around self-service gas pumps. People lose situational awareness when they get focused on swiping the debit card, punching in the PIN, selecting the preferred grade of fuel, and pumping the gas. Just thinking about it now, I wasn't fully aware of my surroundings just this evening when I had trouble getting the pump to accept my card. Thanks for the reminder.

seamusTX wrote:Perhaps you should consider wearing your pistol in a holster?

Profiling is not inherently wrong. What is right or wrong is what you do with your assumptions. Shooting at them or pointing a weapon at them based on what they did would have been criminal. Going on alert and reacting assertively was not.

If they had been four white skinheads with prominent tattoos, the same reaction would have been appropriate.

This. People who think that profiling is wrong also think that the world is populated with unicorns that fart rainbows.

It's not the profiling that is wrong. It's treating someone poorly after you find out that their profile doesn't match your fears that is wrong. If someone looks like a gang-banger and is covered in prison tats, it's a pretty safe bet that they're not choirboys. If they turn out to actually be choirboys, then be pleasantly surprised and thank God that you were wrong.............this time.

seamusTX wrote: If they had been four white skinheads with prominent tattoos, the same reaction would have been appropriate.

From his desription, that's what I thought!

You did fine. Like what was said above, move form lockbox to concealed location for access...

The Annoyed Man wrote:It's not the profiling that is wrong. It's treating someone poorly after you find out that their profile doesn't match your fears that is wrong.

There's another aspect to profiling.

If an individual uses profiling to alter his awareness level and behavior, the person that he is profiling may not even know.

If someone in a position of power or authority, such as a LEO or hiring manager, profiles people carelessly, it can result in real injustice.

- Jim

You were exactly right.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a dick and quacks like a duck, are you going to wait for the results of the DNA test or are you going to assume that it is in fact a duck?

That you would even doubt for a second that your instincts and your gut were telling you something -- and that they were telling you the truth -- is an indication of just how deep the infection of liberalism has penetrated into society.

I've been at the gas station many a time when a car with one or more people in in pulled up blaring rap "music" and my radar didn't go off because they didn't approach me and didn't look or act like street thugs.