TexasCHLforum.com

Just thought I'd double check my own conclusions with those
more experienced and wiser than myself...

Our cub scout pack is chartered by the elementary school, and
has pack meetings at the school, but other activities are typically
elsewhere.

Other than the obvious case of not being able to carry at the
school, I've not found any information suggesting that carrying
elsewhere during official cub scout activities/events is not
permitted (unless explicitly forbidden such as at scout camp,
etc.). I'm also a Den Leader, but I don't think that is relevant.

E.g. attending a pack campout at a state park shouldn't exclude
carry, right?

Nothing on the BSA website or Googling turned up anything as
far as BSA restrictions, aside from rules about when/where the
boys are allowed to handle firearms and rules at particular official
scout camps.

Anyone know of anything I might be missing?

Thanks.

patrickstickler wrote:Just thought I'd double check my own conclusions with those
more experienced and wiser than myself...

Our cub scout pack is chartered by the elementary school, and
has pack meetings at the school, but other activities are typically
elsewhere.

Other than the obvious case of not being able to carry at the
school, I've not found any information suggesting that carrying
elsewhere during official cub scout activities/events is not
permitted (unless explicitly forbidden such as at scout camp,
etc.). I'm also a Den Leader, but I don't think that is relevant.

E.g. attending a pack campout at a state park shouldn't exclude
carry, right?

Nothing on the BSA website or Googling turned up anything as
far as BSA restrictions, aside from rules about when/where the
boys are allowed to handle firearms and rules at particular official
scout camps.

Anyone know of anything I might be missing?

Thanks.

Texas Penal Code 36.05 covers where you cannot carry any firearm, and 46.035 covers where you cannot carry your handgun under your CHL.

http://tlo2.tlc.state.tx.us/statutes/do ... m#46.03.00

txinvestigator wrote:

patrickstickler wrote:Just thought I'd double check my own conclusions with those
more experienced and wiser than myself...

Our cub scout pack is chartered by the elementary school, and
has pack meetings at the school, but other activities are typically
elsewhere.

Other than the obvious case of not being able to carry at the
school, I've not found any information suggesting that carrying
elsewhere during official cub scout activities/events is not
permitted (unless explicitly forbidden such as at scout camp,
etc.). I'm also a Den Leader, but I don't think that is relevant.

E.g. attending a pack campout at a state park shouldn't exclude
carry, right?

Nothing on the BSA website or Googling turned up anything as
far as BSA restrictions, aside from rules about when/where the
boys are allowed to handle firearms and rules at particular official
scout camps.

Anyone know of anything I might be missing?

Thanks.

Texas Penal Code 36.05 covers where you cannot carry any firearm, and 46.035 covers where you cannot carry your handgun under your CHL.

http://tlo2.tlc.state.tx.us/statutes/do ... m#46.03.00

I'm wondering if "any grounds or building on which an
activity sponsored by a school or educational institution is being
conducted" applies. Is a cub scout event "sponsored" by a school
if the school is the chartering organization for the cub scout pack?

If yes, then that would seem to preclude carrying at any cub
scout event. If not, then I would conclude I am OK carrying.

patrickstickler wrote:I'm wondering if "any grounds or building on which an
activity sponsored by a school or educational institution is being
conducted" applies. Is a cub scout event "sponsored" by a school
if the school is the chartering organization for the cub scout pack?

If yes, then that would seem to preclude carrying at any cub
scout event. If not, then I would conclude I am OK carrying.

A chartering organization can provide several different levels of support. If your chartering organization only provides you a place to hold Pack Meetings and/or Den Meetings, but doesn't provide any other material support, I'd say that it doesn't qualify as a school-sponsored activity when you go on an outing (such as to the Museum District).

If, on the other hand, your chartering organization provides you with a meeting place, a bus to use getting to your outings, support (such as someone to help organize your trip), funding assistance for things like dues or Boys Life subscriptions, you may be in a much grayer area.

FWIW, most of the chartering orgs I've dealt with are more like the first than any of the second types. If you fall into the second category, you may want to pursue either a different Pack that uses a different chartering org or get your Pack to change chartering orgs.

Remember, there's no rule anywhere in BSA that says you have to go to the Pack that is chartered through your kid's school. Here in The Woodlands, almost every church and school (including NHMCCD) sponsor one or more Troop, Crew, Team or Pack.

Mithras61 wrote:

patrickstickler wrote:I'm wondering if "any grounds or building on which an
activity sponsored by a school or educational institution is being
conducted" applies. Is a cub scout event "sponsored" by a school
if the school is the chartering organization for the cub scout pack?

If yes, then that would seem to preclude carrying at any cub
scout event. If not, then I would conclude I am OK carrying.

A chartering organization can provide several different levels of support. If your chartering organization only provides you a place to hold Pack Meetings and/or Den Meetings, but doesn't provide any other material support, I'd say that it doesn't qualify as a school-sponsored activity when you go on an outing (such as to the Museum District).

If, on the other hand, your chartering organization provides you with a meeting place, a bus to use getting to your outings, support (such as someone to help organize your trip), funding assistance for things like dues or Boys Life subscriptions, you may be in a much grayer area.

FWIW, most of the chartering orgs I've dealt with are more like the first than any of the second types. If you fall into the second category, you may want to pursue either a different Pack that uses a different chartering org or get your Pack to change chartering orgs.

Remember, there's no rule anywhere in BSA that says you have to go to the Pack that is chartered through your kid's school. Here in The Woodlands, almost every church and school (including NHMCCD) sponsor one or more Troop, Crew, Team or Pack.

It's definitely the first type of chartering. In fact, the pack often
makes "donations" from various fund raisers to the school's PTO
and such. The school only provides the meeting space, nothing
more (and if I recall correctly, the pack may even pay a small
fee to cover custodial services and such).

So I think I'll interpret the above bit of the penal code as not
applying in this case. Let's hope it doesn't become a "test case"
for anything

Thanks for the input.

Patrick Stickler:
Just make sure concealed means concealed. If they find out that you are carrying then you and your child might be thrown out of the troop. BSA is very concerned over liability issues particualry on child protection. It is silent on concealed carry, but could become very anti carry if it exposed another liability real or probably imagined.

John R. Fuller wrote:Patrick Stickler:
Just make sure concealed means concealed. If they find out that you are carrying then you and your child might be thrown out of the troop. BSA is very concerned over liability issues particualry on child protection. It is silent on concealed carry, but could become very anti carry if it exposed another liability real or probably imagined.

Definitely.

I am a cub scout den leader and at our school the pack is chartered by the elementary school. Also the school is the one who approves the chairman of the pack and also the cub scout leader. In the chain of command the chartered organization is on the top. So I would assume the that it is a school sponsored event. But I am a person that leans on caution. And I remember reading somewhere.

This is a quote from the guide for safe scouting (which is the rulebook for scouting activites)

Except for law enforcement officers required to carry firearms within their jurisdiction, firearms shall not be brought on camping, hiking, backpacking, or other Scouting activities except those specifically planned for target shooting under the supervision of a currently certified BSA or National Rifle Association firearms instructor.

http://www.scouting.org/pubs/gss/gss08.html

So that would also say no.. They can only fire you not arrest you so do what you would like. I personally carry but leave it in my car when we go hiking, camping or anything like that.

Aric wrote:I am a cub scout den leader and at our school the pack is chartered by the elementary school. Also the school is the one who approves the chairman of the pack and also the cub scout leader. In the chain of command the chartered organization is on the top. So I would assume the that it is a school sponsored event. But I am a person that leans on caution. And I remember reading somewhere.

This is a quote from the guide for safe scouting (which is the rulebook for scouting activites)

Except for law enforcement officers required to carry firearms within their jurisdiction, firearms shall not be brought on camping, hiking, backpacking, or other Scouting activities except those specifically planned for target shooting under the supervision of a currently certified BSA or National Rifle Association firearms instructor.

http://www.scouting.org/pubs/gss/gss08.html

So that would also say no.. They can only fire you not arrest you so do what you would like. I personally carry but leave it in my car when we go hiking, camping or anything like that.

Thanks! Excellent info. Exactly what I feared I was missing. Interesting that the site search didn't find that, as I did search on "firearms" in addition to other keywords. Oh well. No site is perfect. My expectation
was in any case to just leave it in the car, and this reinforces that.

Thanks again.