TexasCHLforum.com

My son has a handgun that we keep for him while he is in college (a PT92). Next week, he will be traveling from Brownwood to Medina, Texas to see his girlfriend. Her dad has a range at his house and told him to bring his guns. Although I know he can have a handgun (just not buy one from an FFL) I am apprehensive about his traveling with one, should he get pulled over for anything. Thoughts? And, can a 19 yo be covered under MPA or must it be over 21?

I see no age limit in MPA.

Sec. 46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS.
(a-1) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun in a motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control at any time in which:
(1) the handgun is in plain view; or
(2) the person is:
(A) engaged in criminal activity, other than a Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance regulating traffic;
(B) prohibited by law from possessing a firearm; or
(C) a member of a criminal street gang, as defined by Section 71.01.

...MPA covers anyone legal to possess the handgun...at 18 he may possess a handgun in Texas...younger with parents' written permission...he's good to go...

My daugter is 19 and she drives my car at times with my gun in the console. (She might even park it on a college campus...but based on her grades I can't be certain!) I've told her that should she ever be pulled over to make sure the officer knows that she is carrying in the console under the MPA. The insurance verification isn't in the console, so she also knows that if the officer doesn't bring it up, she shouldn't either.

speedsix wrote:...younger with parents' written permission...

Citation please?

Thomas wrote:

speedsix wrote:...younger with parents' written permission...

Citation please?

...here's Texas to keep you busy while I'm looking up the Feds...

PC46.06(a)(2) and (c) and 46.13


...and the feds' version: http://www.atf.gov/publications/downloa ... 5300-2.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

speedsix wrote:

Thomas wrote:

speedsix wrote:...younger with parents' written permission...

Citation please?

...here's Texas to keep you busy while I'm looking up the Feds...

PC46.06(a)(2) and (c) and 46.13


...and the feds' version: http://www.atf.gov/publications/downloa ... 5300-2.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The mentioned Texas code is referring to someone who sells to a minor. It doesn't refer to the legality of the minor actually possessing the handgun. Written verification isn't needed to give a handgun to a child, only to sell. A parent can give a handgun to a minor under 18, but would be responsible if the the gun is used inappropriately.

PCCode wrote: (c) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution under Subsection (a)(2) that the transfer was to a minor whose parent or the person having legal custody of the minor had given written permission for the sale or, if the transfer was other than a sale, the parent or person having legal custody had given effective consent.

...read the code PC 46.06 again and you'll see that it covers a great deal more than sales....including giving...and specifies "person"...not dealer...so the code applys to any PERSON who does any of the things enumerated in the code, including giving...parents included

...if you'll read 46.06 (c), "...had given written permission for the sale or, if the transfer was other than a sale, the parent or person having legal custody had given effective consent." in actual practice, this can be either by saying or, if you're not there to say...by writing your permission, which is what I did...loaning and giving are listed examples of a transfer other than a sale...

...if you'll read both of the Texas Codes I quoted, you'll find that they tell us under what conditions it's legal to transfer or allow access of the handgun to, in one case, a person younger than 18, and in the other case younger than 17(child)...if it's legal to put it in their hands, it's legal for them to possess it...that's common sense...so they DO deal with it being legal for them to possess...if you're not breaking a written law, you're not illegal...unless you can show me a Texas law that says what you're claiming...

...please show me in the law where it says that, having complied with both of the Texas Codes I quoted, "...a parent can give a handgun to a minor under 18, but would be responsible if the gun is used inappropriately." neither code says this, and 46.13 only applies to children, which are by legal definition 17 and younger...a person 17 years of age is not a child in Texas, he or she goes to big jail if they break the law...the only way a parent would be held responsible is if he did NOT comply with the two codes...and the Federal code...civil suits might be something else...but we're dealing/talking/discussing CRIMINAL law in this case...

...the Federal law I quoted has a lot to say about written consent being required for them to have possession, also...

Thanks guys... I had understood it was ok, but a pit in my stomach of his being pulled over by Barney-one-bullet who doesn't have a clue, and getting an "illegal possession of a weapon."

...unfortunately, some LEOs, as well as a lot of civilians, don't bother reading the laws carefully, and some will still argue...so, even with copies of the laws in her possession, she could run into the kind you described...and that would have to be sorted out...later...such is life...I'm glad to see you're giving her what she needs to be safer...the Boogeyman IS out there!!!

Blindref757 wrote:My daugter is 19 and she drives my car at times with my gun in the console. (She might even park it on a college campus...but based on her grades I can't be certain!)

wgoforth wrote:Thanks guys... I had understood it was ok, but a pit in my stomach of his being pulled over by Barney-one-bullet who doesn't have a clue, and getting an "illegal possession of a weapon."

It may make you feel better that in the case of MPA, there is no duty to notify as there is with CHL. She should of course say something if during the interaction she is passing a hand anywhere near it. Mine keeps papers apart from where the weapon is for just this reason.

Rex B wrote:

Blindref757 wrote:My daugter is 19 and she drives my car at times with my gun in the console. (She might even park it on a college campus...but based on her grades I can't be certain!)

yea me too, never know if they really go to class or to the pubs

Agree with thoughts posted here re: it's okay for anyone who is legal to "possess" a handgun to carry one in an automobile under MPA. Relative of mine between 18 and 21 yrs old and I were discussing this and he raised an issue I'd like to post for feedback. He said when he's been pulled over, he has been asked, consistently, if he had a firearm in the vehicle. Then, they have searched his vehicle (with his consent I believe) on multiple occasions. I advised that there is really no reason for him to consent to the search and we had a good discussion about the pros and cons of that. My questions:
1. If a LEO asks if you have a firearm, I presume you are required to answer that question and of course, truthfully, CHL or not. Correct?
2. I would also assume that possesssing a loaded firearm under the MPA is not reasonable cause for a search of your property. Is that correct also?

I advised him not to give consent to the search, but also of course not to resist if they go forward with it anyway. I am guessing they have no legal authority (solely on the basis of legal possession of a loaded firearm) to search the vehicle. I don't understand what's going on, as I have never been asked if I had a loaded firearm (pre-CHL) nor had my vehicle searched. I realize that there could be other reasons (pot smoke wafting out the window, etc.) and am not interested in that discussion.

Thanks in advance for any feedback!

SlowDave wrote:1. If a LEO asks if you have a firearm, I presume you are required to answer that question and of course, truthfully, CHL or not. Correct?
2. I would also assume that possesssing a loaded firearm under the MPA is not reasonable cause for a search of your property. Is that correct also?

re: 1 I cannot quote the statute, but I believe it is a crime in and of itself to lie to a police officer.

re: 2 Depends on why he is stopped. If he is stopped for a traffic infraction, that is "reasonable articulable suspicion that a crime was committed and a valid stop. During a valid stop, then SCOTUS allows a search of the "lunge area" for weapons to ensure officer safety. Thus does not translate to the right for a full-blown search of the car.