TexasCHLforum.com

Not sure if anyone has seen this video - I searched the forum and didn't see any references. I was reading on another forum and found these two videos. I know there are situations where folks want to talk to LEO's at a scene - but don't.

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http://texaschlforum.com/search.php?key ... 8z7NC5sgik" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Always do a search using the unique youtube tag which in this case is i8z7NC5sgik

Great subject though. Nothing wrong with bubbling it up to the top once a month. Heck, I even re-watched the vids once you posted them.

Good info. Never thought about inoccent persons incriminating themselves with the truth.
So does that mean that if you use your CCW, you should not talk to the police when they arrive? Saying nothing will get you arrested for murder, rather than being able to explain self-defense.

From this thread: http://texaschlforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=45759" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.gunsandammo.com/2011/05/26/v ... -shooting/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The beef..??

I think this is appropriate; "I acted in self defense and I am willing to cooperate fully but I would like my attorney to be present."

Letting the police know your cooperative but still wish legal counsel is whole-heartedly endorsed. That sounds a lot better and puts everyone at ease instead of telling the first officer "I'm not saying anything without a lawyer!"

knljr wrote:I know there are situations where folks want to talk to LEO's at a scene - but don't.

knljr wrote:I think this is appropriate; "I acted in self defense and I am willing to cooperate fully but I would like my attorney to be present."

Letting the police know your cooperative but still wish legal counsel is whole-heartedly endorsed. That sounds a lot better and puts everyone at ease instead of telling the first officer "I'm not saying anything without a lawyer!"

If I thought it was a bad shoot, I would follow the advice of a criminal attorney and shut up.

However, if I thought it was a justified shoot, I am going to act like an ordinary good citizen, not a criminal defendant. An ordinary good citizen is going to say something like ""Officer, I am the one who called you, this is the man who attacked me, he may still have a weapon, I do not know if there are any more." An ordinary good citizen is also going to take appropriate steps to protect his interests.

The primary value of Ayoob's "Five Points" shown above is it gives the responding office a starting point. Waiting 24 hours is too late, because there are a lot of things the cops need to know before they can establish in their mind who's the good guy and who's the bad guy.

We've all heard the standard saying that we only get one chance to make a first impression.

Basically, the police officer who is there on the scene will be the one whom the court will be looking to, to say, "what do you think?". The court, the prosecutor, and the investigating detectives will follow him. The tone of this whole investigation is going to be set in the seconds and minutes after the shooting has taken place. The four or five minutes after the shooting may determine where you get to live for the next 20 years.

Also, if you do not point out the evidence, it can disappear. Expended shell casings, for example, can get blown away or lodged in a tire tread. If you don't point out the evidence, the physical evidence that could have proved your innocence could be lost forever.

Similarly, you have to point out the witnesses. After a shooting the witnesses are thinking could this be some drug shooting or vengeful gang-banger? They don't know what's going on. "Do we really want to get involved?" If they leave, the testimony that would have proven you innocent leaves with them.

I would strongly strongly reccomend Charles Cotton's deadly force seminar, Which deals with this subject.

Liberty wrote:I would strongly strongly reccomend Charles Cotton's deadly force seminar, Which deals with this subject.

+1

I agree that you have to be helpful and non-combative in terms of clam'ing up and waiting for your attorney.

That said, if you make a statement there and start going off on all the details, chances are you'll probably regret it later, not to mention your attorney will probably kick your rear as well. As mentioned in the video series - the LEO's are not your character witnesses in court...what they have 'can' be used against you. Period. - no matter how little or insignificant you think it may be - it will most likely come back to haunt you.

Personally, I'd recant what I said in the 911 call. To the previous posters point, I'd probably help with any evidence collection and point out witnesses but when the LEO comes to me with a pen and pad asking what happened, that's where I'm done. If you set the right tone - ie; I think any LEO would be able to get heads/tales on who is the perp and who is the victim, especially if there are any witnesses around pretty quickly.

My brother is a federal LEO and was a patrol officer for HPD for many years. He said if anything ever happened and I talked to the Police, he'd shoot me himself.

I have been looking around and following links since I started browsing this wonderful forum, but can't figure out when Mr. Cotton plans to repeat that particular class...help!

Officer, here is my CHL, drivers license, and my weapon is laying on the hood, empty. I am waiting for lawyer to arrive and will not be saying anything until he arrives.

If you so much as give him your name, he will come right back with a question. And you will reply. Automatically.

knljr wrote:My brother is a federal LEO and was a patrol officer for HPD for many years. He said if anything ever happened and I talked to the Police, he'd shoot me himself.

That's enough convincing for me.

knljr wrote:I agree that you have to be helpful and non-combative in terms of clam'ing up and waiting for your attorney.

That said, if you make a statement there and start going off on all the details, chances are you'll probably regret it later, not to mention your attorney will probably kick your rear as well. As mentioned in the video series - the LEO's are not your character witnesses in court...what they have 'can' be used against you. Period. - no matter how little or insignificant you think it may be - it will most likely come back to haunt you.

Personally, I'd recant what I said in the 911 call. To the previous posters point, I'd probably help with any evidence collection and point out witnesses but when the LEO comes to me with a pen and pad asking what happened, that's where I'm done. If you set the right tone - ie; I think any LEO would be able to get heads/tales on who is the perp and who is the victim, especially if there are any witnesses around pretty quickly.

My brother is a federal LEO and was a patrol officer for HPD for many years. He said if anything ever happened and I talked to the Police, he'd shoot me himself.

I don't think recanting what you said in the 911 call will do much good. That has already been recorded. Just try to be just as careful when you make that call as you are when you talk to the officers who arrive at the scene.

RoyGBiv wrote:

knljr wrote:My brother is a federal LEO and was a patrol officer for HPD for many years. He said if anything ever happened and I talked to the Police, he'd shoot me himself.

That's enough convincing for me.

My father in law, who is an assistant Chief of Police (who worked his way up from patrol on up) for a local city gave me the opposite advice. He pretty much echoed what Jumping Frog said up there

if I thought it was a justified shoot, I am going to act like an ordinary good citizen, not a criminal defendant. An ordinary good citizen is going to say something like ""Officer, I am the one who called you, this is the man who attacked me, he may still have a weapon, I do not know if there are any more." An ordinary good citizen is also going to take appropriate steps to protect his interests.

He said after giving as brief a statement as possible to then let the office know you are very shaken up from being in fear for your life (or something to that effect) and that you just can't answer any more questions until you have a chance to consult with your attorney. But at least help them figure out in those first few moments who the BG is and that you were acting in self-defense. Don't get into details, just the shortest most factual statement possible.

Also, You must memorize your lawyer phone number ! If your are at a scene, your phone may be taken, if your are "Taken for Questioning" You may be allowed one phone call.. And may NOT have access to your phone or address book

Seems, now a days, I don't have very many numbers memorized

Has technology has made us lazy minded ?

BAT