TexasCHLforum.com

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 1:45 pm**

I have copied Alice Tripps's report on the meeting with DPS personnel on Wednesday, April 16, 2008 below. I was not in attendance at this meeting, but I was briefed on it immediately after it was concluded.

Yesterday, April 16th, Chairman Joe Driver of House Law Enforcement Committee asked DPS to a meeting regarding complaints from Texas CHL licenses and renewals that licenses are running well beyond the length of time listed in statute.

TSRA collected information over the weekend from members responding to an email alert sent out on Friday. A large number of responses supported the problem.

Information gathered went well beyond finger print problems. Most of these folks had returned perfect packages to DPS and were running as much as 100+ days. The time allowed for a renewal is 45 days and original applications have 60 days.

Jan Coffey, Valerie Fulmer, and Chief Burton Christian represented DPS. Chief Burton was the highest ranking DPS person attending.

Former Senator Ken Armbrister attended at Chairman Driver's invitation. Ken Armbrister is currently Governor Perry's Legislative Director.

In December 2007 a large and unexpected spike occurred in new CHL applicants. The bottle neck was blamed on this sudden surge in applications plus a litany other problems: 5 data processing jobs unfilled, flawed licenses due to a new license fabrication process, fewer applications on line than expected causing more data entry by staff, finger print rejects, incomplete packages returned, etc.

TSRA brought up the fact that we have this meeting with DPS on late CHL applications every two years and asked what could be done to help the situation so it would not happen in the future.

We were told that currently 25% of the all applications and renewals with perfect packages (good pictures, good finger prints, and everything correct) are running beyond statute.

It appears that the entire DPS process is broken at least for now. By this we mean, there is something wrong at every step.

The universal complaint from DPS, which may be justified, was more money and authorization to hire more employees. They have added 12 temps to the 40 full time employees working only on CHLs. We were also told the number of employees has not increased since the beginning of the program in 1996.

For now, Chairman Driver will be receiving a weekly status report on the CHL backlog problem.

We appreciate Rep. Joe Driver and his staff taking the lead on this problem and for Ken Armbrister gathering information for Governor Perry.

The problems noted in Alice's report deal primarily with staffing and this is a problem that requires a legislative fix. Since this can't happen before the 2009 legislative session, and since it's a budget issue, there is no reason to expect improvement before Sept. 2009 at the earliest.

So what can we do in the interim? Here are some suggestions:

1. Use the on-line application process for both initial and renewal CHL applications. This will dramatically cut the amount of data entry by DPS;

2. Use digital fingerprints, if possible. This may not be practical for some people, due to location and time constraints, but if you can submit digital prints, then this greatly reduces the chance of the FBI rejecting prints;

3. On renewals, be sure to start the process as soon as you get your renewal notice; i.e. 6 months before expiration;

4. Triple check your application packet to be sure you haven't missed anything! (The CHL check list here on the forum is a good resource.)

I realize this is not the answer anyone wanted to hear; me included. However, this is the reality of the situation and nothing is going to change until the legislature fixes it. In addition to funding and personnel, I have some ideas to greatly streamline the process for CHLs and the DPS and it will reduce DPS' workload, but this too will require legislative action.

I want to echo Alice's comments and express my appreciation to Chairman Joe Driver and Governor Perry for taking an interest in this problem. Chairman Driver is rated A+ by TSRA, as was former Senator Ken Armbrister, Gov. Perry's Legislative Director. The fact that Chairman Driver arranged this meeting and is going to be getting weekly progress reports shows that he is taking CHL complaints seriously and is doing what he can to address the problem, within the current statute. Sending his Legislative Director to the meeting, thereby showing the DPS that the Governor is concerned, also proves that Governor Perry is continuing his long-standing support of CHLs.

I don't like being told to be patient; I like having to say that to others even less. Legislative remedies are already being drafted and you can rest assured that TSRA, the NRA, Governor Perry and our friends in the Texas House and Texas Senate will make this a priority issue in 2009. You also have my commitment to make this a personal priority item in the 2009 Legislative Agenda.

Chas.

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 2:41 pm**

Thanks for doing this, and thanks to Rep. Driver.

DPS issued about 90,900 licenses in fiscal year 2007 (source here).

They don't say how many are new licenses and how many are renewals. Let's say the average fee is $100. That's over $9 million a year in revenue from license applications.

Their budget is fixed for two years.

Charles, do you have any idea what the budget for the CHL division is?

I think it would make sense for DPS CHL division to be able to spend the license revenue that they actually receive, instead of putting it into the general fund. That way they could hire temps when they needed to, or upgrade equipment.

(The state does this with fees in a lot of areas. Personally, I think it's dishonest. The fees are charged so that the state can provide a service, and then the state scrimps on the service.)

- Jim

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 2:53 pm**

Jim:
I don't know what the budget it and I have to admit that I don't know anything about the budgeting process. I believe the budget is for all of DPS and not by dept. I say that because the question was asked "how can we be sure any additional funding will be used for this purpose?" I'm not sure there was a definite answer.

Chas.

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 2:58 pm**

I'm not sure that the excuse of needing more people holds water. Using the numbers from above - and then adding in a fudge factor let's say that DPS issues 100,000 licenses per year. With 40 people, that is 2500 licenses per person per year or 10 per day (based on a 50 week year). That doesn't seem excessive, but I don't know exactly how much work each one is. But does it really take an hour (roughly) per CHL?

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 3:11 pm**

Not everyone in the division processes applications. Some of the people are supervisors and by definition do no work.

At least one is a lawyer. Some answer the phone. Some are instructors of instructions.

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 3:18 pm**

seamusTX wrote:Not everyone in the division processes applications. Some of the people are supervisors and by definition do no work. At least one is a lawyer. Some answer the phone. Some are instructors of instructions.

Anygun

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 4:13 pm**

Thanks for posting it up Charles. Not exactly what we wanted to read but it does put things into perspective.

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:17 pm**

Finally, some answers to the delays. Not that anything is likely to be done at least until next year, but hopefully it will be fixed by the time I need my first renewal. I used to work for the state, and believe me when I say they always go the cheapest route. With the money we pay them for the applications, not to mention our taxes, were used responsibly, they could easily afford to double their staff. I dont know what the CHL employees are paid, but if its anything like they pay correctional officers, their probably isnt much incentive to go any quicker or more efficiently. Unfortunately more tax dollars are wasted on things I wouldnt mention to my ten year old daughter than are spent wisely. Case in point - Why is it that every time a new road is proposed, its a toll road? We pay good money to register and inspect our vehicles and that money is supposed to go toward building and maintaining roads. Why should we have to pay the state to drive on the roads that we paid to build?

Sorry bout the rant.

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:22 pm**

Thanks for posting this.

I received my renewal about a month ago and now I know that I need to get on it right away.

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:35 pm**

Not that I believe the world totally revolves around some things, but I am curious to know if this particular website, and the content of a section on this forum was used in anyway or discussed at this meeting...

The temperament (of the participants/members) and good natured discussions regarding the "waiting room" area, to me, is very insightful, from a certain perspective...There is some hard data in there that could be spreadsheet'd out to give a general idea about some of the processing times and hurdles some of the folks have had over the last few years...

I've always thought that the information in there really could be used to identify where some deficiencies were in the system, and where there could be some improvements and cost effective measures implemented to improve the services to the CHL community...

But then again we are talking about a government agency here, and sometimes those types of solutions are hard to come by...

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 10:09 pm**

Another interim solution is to get a non-resident license in a state with reciprocity, but pick one with a shorter wait time. (not Utah

)

It's win+win because you get a license quicker and it also reduces the workload for DPS to help other Texans get licenses quicker.

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 10:24 pm**

Frankly, it sounds to me like it is not something that needs fixed by the Legislature (more money and/or more employees).

Sounds to me like it is an internal problem within the State Department (DPS) that is running the program. It is my understanding that the CHL program was supposed to be funded by the fees charged. If this is the case, then the money goes up the same as the applications numbers goes up. If it was calculated correctly in the first place, then it should be self sustaining. I think it is a problem with the money being directed away from the CHL program and on to other programs thereby leaving the CHL program short.

Now, I will admit that certain fees have changed since the inception of the program and some are free or significantly reduced. I seriously doubt that this number would have an adverse effect such as we have witnessed.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2008 1:00 am**

While I am waiting on my Texas CHL, is it possible to apply for an out-of-State one from a reciprocal state?

And if the reciprocal license arrive first, can I use it to carry?

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2008 1:05 am**

It seems like for the most part, that those of us waiting for our license's are just going to have to wait a little longer. I just hope that the answer the legislature gives is to increase the amount of people helping to prcess the applications, and not to increase the allowable wait times from 60 days to 90 or even 120 days.

I would and many others would start some kind of movement if they did that.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2008 6:59 am**

Rayden wrote:While I am waiting on my Texas CHL, is it possible to apply for an out-of-State one from a reciprocal state? And if the reciprocal license arrive first, can I use it to carry?

Yes and yes.

- Jim

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