What would you say to a repair guy if you saw his gun

[CowboyEngineer]

Trust is something that is earned over time. A stranger in my home by definition hasn't earned my trust. I have friends and family who carry and they are welcome in my home because I know their character and how they will comport themselves. They have earned my trust. As far as others trusting me, as I said before, I don't really care. I carry where I am allowed. If they don't want me there all they have to do is post a sign or ask me to leave. No hard feelings about it. That is their right.

[jayinsat]

I think the "accidental reveal" is the key point. If you never saw the repair guys gun, there would never be a problem. Same as when we carry in public. If the g.p. don't see our CONCEALED gun, they don't panic and ask us to leave. We are not discussing open carry here. That is another matter all together. The original premise is, a repair guy, whom you don't know and is a stranger, has a gun in your home. I don't think Cowboyengineers response is a double standard at all. If someone spotted your CCW in walmart, most likely the cops would come and demand to see your CHL at best. At worst, you may be taking a ride downtown.

[Jaguar]

Let's suppose the repair guy has done work for you before. He fixed a leak under your bath tub, then a sewer line blockage, and this time he is laid out on the kitchen floor with his head under the sink and arms above his head when his shirt rides up and you see a pistol.

Both times before he was professional, courteous, and very fair with his prices. Are you going to make a big deal of it now?

If you ask about it - he always carries, even when he was at your house the last two times.

Just wondering if the "stranger" factor has worn off yet?

[The Annoyed Man]

In January of 2008, we had a similar discussion.

My own participation begins here: viewtopic.php?p=152497#p152497" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (page 3)

You'll see me beging to come around in attitude here: viewtopic.php?p=152725#p152725" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (page 4)

I have evolved even further since, and today I honestly just don't worry about it at all. But I think that my posts on pages 3 and 4 of that thread neatly summarize the OP's concerns. To the OP, eventually you'll relax about the whole thing.

[jayinsat]

Let's suppose the repair guy has done work for you before. He fixed a leak under your bath tub, then a sewer line blockage, and this time he is laid out on the kitchen floor with his head under the sink and arms above his head when his shirt rides up and you see a pistol.

Both times before he was professional, courteous, and very fair with his prices. Are you going to make a big deal of it now?

If you ask about it - he always carries, even when he was at your house the last two times.

Just wondering if the "stranger" factor has worn off yet?

I believe the previous visits define an established relationship. That person is no longer a stranger. I have a trusted AC repairman who I know carries. He's always welcome. If CPS sends a repairman out that I've never seen and he reveals a firearm, we have a (potential) problem. If it remains concealed, no prob.

[flechero]

Let's look at it from the other side. You as a repairman/delivery guy, etc. were specifically called to a location. You don't know why they homeowner chose you instead of any of the other 100 delivery/service guys in the area. Statistically I think the service industry is the victim most often when things do go bad or are a set up. It's not like the repair guy said I hope "joe blow" calls me to fix his ____, I'd like to rob him.

It seems to me that there are 3 ways that having a stranger with a gun in my house doing work for me can play out:

1. He is a good guy and nothing bad happens
2. He is a good guy and something bad accidentally happens.
3. He is a bad guy with evil on his mind.

Replace "he" with "homeowner" - There are also 2 of the 3 ways it can go bad for the other guy... not to mention, he can't set you up as you chose him, the time and place. From the other side, it could very easily be a set up.

I think that we who carry all the time look awfully hypocritical if we assume all other people with a gun are bad.

At least answer this, as I'm really curious: Do you stop all persons at your front door and ask if they are carrying? Or do you let the service company know your policy up front and ask them to send only unarmed servicemen to your house; so they have the choice to say no thanks and not waste the time and fuel getting there? Or do you reserve this treatment for those that accidentally expose the weapon?

[CowboyEngineer]

I have never said a tradesman doesn’t have the right to carry or to self defense. I have no problem with tradesmen carrying concealed or in their trucks. I put myself through college working as a tradesman and I understand that there is risk in going to a stranger’s house. The question, however, was what would I say if he was carrying in my house and I became aware of it. In my house, I am the one in control and I get to decide who is allowed to have a gun on my property. I am an engineer not a lawyer but my understanding is that on my property I can carry a gun anyway I want, openly or concealed. I could wear my Glocks as ear rings if I wanted to. A tradesman who is carrying illegally has absolutely no right to carry any gun on my property. A tradesman who is carrying legally with a CHL only has the right to carry that weapon as long as I agree. If I say no he has no legal right to carry on my property. I am not violating his rights in any aspect by saying no, merely asserting my own rights as property owner. I see no reason why my rights should be abrogated just so he can assert rights he doesn’t actually have. If he is scared and doesn’t want to work my job without a gun on his person he can quit. There is no job that he can do for me that someone else can’t.

In the past I haven’t told service companies that I only want unarmed service men but I think that is a good idea. Truth is, as an engineer with 25 years experience in construction, I do most of my own repairs or when I lack the skill or the muscle get tradesmen I know to do the work for me. They wouldn’t be strangers. About the only time I can think of when I would call a service company would be for warrantee repairs of appliances. My guess is Sears and the other big box companies I usually deal with have a no gun policy for their personnel but it would be better to be up front about that requirement to avoid confusion.

Some on this thread and the other one have suggested that I am not supporting RKBA or the right to carry concealed. Nonsense. I am as strong a supporter of the 2nd amendment as anyone on this board. I support the 2nd amendment with my votes, my money, and my constant harangue of anyone who will listen. I don’t carry a gun to show my support of the RKBA, I carry a gun to protect my family. While the two are not mutually exclusive they are not the same either. My gun is a tool to mitigate risk to the people I care most about. In the three possible outcome scenarios I listed earlier, I will agree that the first is probably the most likely by far, nothing bad happens, everyone goes away happy. The probability of the other 2 outcomes is small, probably miniscule, but the consequences are catastrophic. If someone steals your TV, you go buy another TV, probably a bigger and better one. If someone in your home with a gun injures or kills your loved ones, either accidentally or intentionally, you have a pain that never ends. The cost of mitigating the risk is next to nothing, at most paying for the same job twice.

If I can easily mitigate the risk and remove the possibility of the catastrophic consequence for virtually nothing, why wouldn’t I? Why would I risk my family on a roll of the dice, even if the odds are overwhelmingly in my favour? In the responses I have read on here, I haven’t come across a good answer to that question. Frankly, I don’t think there is one.

[flechero]

CowboyEngineer,

Although we differ in our opinion, I appreciate the explanation.

[Wes]

You're question is the exact one being used against us to remove our rights, "if we can do this one, small thing and it can mitigate the risk, even a little, then why wouldn't we do it!". Everyone who carries needs to be a proponent for our rights, as they can quickly be taken away. No, we do not carry just to support the RKBA but we need to support them so we can carry. Treating someone as a criminal for exercising a right is not being a proponent for it. Even the courts have said that simply carrying a weapon is not justification enough to require an id in US v Black. I know you have the right in your home to do it, just as a business has the right to post a 30.06 sign, but shouldn't we try to be better than those who want to restrict our rights? Isn't there other ways to mitigate the risks that don't make the gun out to be the bad guy? I'm sorry, maybe I'm being naive, but I still believe in innocent until proven guilty. Thanks for trying to be thorough and thoughtful in your responses though Cowboy. It's easy to take conversation personally when it's just written.

[FishInTx]

I guess people could put a gunbuster sign up or maybe even a 30.06 sign on their front door? At first, it would freak me out to see a person in my house with a gun I didn't know about beforehand, but it wouldn't last for more than a minute or 2. I did call them. Hopefully they are a professional and respected business and that they don't mind I carry as well.

[tommyg]

I would tell him that his gun was printing and leave it at that

[jayinsat]

Our church has an annual "Great Event" where we go into the community and do various service projects to help families or organizations with general chores or projects they've not been able to do themselves because of life events etc. Anyway, yesterday I participated for the first time since getting my CHL and was assigned to a couple who needed general home upkeep since the wife was debilitated with a recent illness. As I was working in the yard, I was very diligent and more than a little paranoid about an accidental reveal of my SR9c. I kept thinking "what would I say to the guys on this forum if I got harrased or arrested for an accidental reveal after the stance I made here." All I could hear in my head was Anygun's voice (as I imagined it) saying "see, that's what you get!"

Made me triply diligent about being concealed.

[AJSully421]

“Oh, cool... you are carrying. Good!”