Will you shoot?

[shootthesheet]

If I can I will in order to discourage the bad guy from continuing and snapping them into the realization that they are not in control and the consequences of what they are doing. A person or people that do these things generally do so as an issue of control. Doesn't matter if it is for money or for terror. I think them knowing that they could be killed or worse for most wounded and lose control of how the situation will end would be enough to move them from their plan and hasten them killing themselves or looking to escape. Even if I can only get off one or two shots I think I could make a difference. I would have cover and a safe way to escape before I shot unless I was forced but I have little doubt I would shoot.

I think seeing a person who was shot and knowing others might be hurt or killed because I escaped might be more than I could stand though. Could I watch children being killed or even a mother or father in knowing the grief their loved ones would go thru. All because I was in fear I might be killed by a LEO who didn't know or another CHL holder doing their best to stop the shooter. Does my love extend to everyone or just those I know and my family? "No greater love has a man than to die for his friend." Who is my friend according to my beliefs. I think it is the same for my "neighbor" and that includes everyone.

[drjoker]

Even if I can only get off one or two shots I think I could make a difference. I would have cover and a safe way to escape before I shot unless I was forced but I have little doubt I would shoot.

Research shows that the old police tactic of setting up a perimeter while awaiting a SWAT team will just end up in lots of dead bodies because the response time is too slow. A SWAT team is unnecessary because these mass murderers and mad gunmen will usually commit suicide as soon as they lose control of the situation. For example, police arrive or a CHL arrives and fires a shot. The CHL doesn't even have to shoot the mass murderer. He/she can just fire one shot and hide and threaten to fire more. The mass murderer will then commit suicide and give up after that.

I am a big chicken and definitely no Rambo, but just the mere sight of someone else with a gun will cause any cowardly mad gunman to stop and kill himself or give up. Here is a school principal who did just that: http://www.davekopel.com/2a/othwr/principal&gun.htm . Just the mere sight of the principal's gun caused the gunman to give up or crash his car to kill himself. The principal never even had to fire a shot.

I have never been in a shooting before. I am not brave. I may try to help or I may be just drowned in nervous fear. The fact is, I don't know what I'm gonna do because I have never been in such a situation before. However, you can expect me to at least fire one shot and then hide. This will probably cause the BG to flee or kill himself. A mad gunman will probably kill himself upon hearing your shot. Almost all mad gunmen kill themselves when they hear sirens or guns. A robber will flee upon hearing gunfire. A robber is lazy, that's why they don't get jobs. A shootout is hard work that they are keen on avoiding. Even if I am drowned in fear, to save my fellow man, I will fire one shot and then hide. Just be sure to leave an exit path for the thug so you won't have to get into a shootout.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_shooter

Taking one surprise shot from a hidden position is no/low risk to you, so I hope you'd at least do the same for me. God bless,

[srothstein]

Research shows that the old police tactic of setting up a perimeter while awaiting a SWAT team will just end up in lots of dead bodies because the response time is too slow. A SWAT team is unnecessary because these mass murderers and mad gunmen will usually commit suicide as soon as they lose control of the situation. For example, police arrive or a CHL arrives and fires a shot. The CHL doesn't even have to shoot the mass murderer. He/she can just fire one shot and hide and threaten to fire more. The mass murderer will then commit suicide and give up after that.

This is the current police theory and training. The "active shooter" response has changed significantly after Columbine. BUT, as always, be very careful with general rules. Statistics can be very accurate and predict general behavior very well but they can never predict any individual behavior. As Heinlein put it in one of his stories, actuaries can tell you exactly how many people will die in any large group, but they can never tell you exactly which ones it will be. And I know you are asking what this has to do with the topic at hand, so I will explain.

In the shooting in Utah at the mall, an off duty officer responded to the active shooter since he was on scene with his wife for dinner. The shooter not only did not suicide, but got into a running gun battle with the off duty officer, exchanging shots until enough backup arrived for the officers to win. If you do respond to the shooter, do not count on it being a couple shots. You might very well find yourself still in a gun fight when cops arrive (and that might very well be the confusions the liberals always yell about). The odds are against it, but the odds are also against winning the lottery and people do every year.

[drjoker]

The odds are against it, but the odds are also against winning the lottery and people do every year.

Ooh, good point. As always, you have a very intelligent and thought out response whenever you reply.

These are very tough questions and I guess, we'll never really have an answer for this question until we face the situation. I guess we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

And you quoted Heinlein, one of my favorite writers, no less. I am very impressed. If you're in the big D, PM me. I'd like to go shooting with you and just chat. I'll buy the ammo!

[dac1842]

The only way you know how you will react is to be in the situation. In order to react properly you have to practice and train. There are numerous studies out there that show only 10% of the population will react to a fight or flight situation. In other words only 10% of the population will shoot and know when to shoot. The other 90% will freeze, panic or run.
If you do not train on how to react in a shoot/don't shoot situation the odds are you will not be able to do anything, or will react improperly.
Hopefully most who have a CHL are 10%ers!

[45 4 life]

Yes, if I am certain of who the BG is and death is eminent then I will plan and execute an assault. That being said I have advised the younger card carriers in my family that they are probably not ready to intervene and should back away if possible. I really don't think my son has it in him to back away and I am not sure about the daughter, so we spend allot of time training and discussing "what ifs". It is my belief the the gentlman who lost his life did a very brave thing by pulling his weapon and firing, however use caution and thought. Remember your goal is to save innocent lives and not just die first.