This thread reminds me of a rather embarassing experience I had with border patrol that someone might be able to learn from.
I was heading out camping a year or two ago to west Texas. I was taking HWY 90 South, and if anyone is familiar with that, you have to take a 90 degree turn at a stop light to stay on HWY 90 or you'll head right into Mexico. And apparently the giant Mexico sign didn't mean anything to me.
Since this was a camping trip I had a good stash of guns in my trunk. I was about halfway across the bridge in bumper to bumper traffic (as always) when it finally hit me. I was about to take guns into Mexico! I panicked and made a u-turn right there on the bridge and headed back for US soil.
I told the guy at the booth what had happened and he gave me a piece of paper to take to the BP on the side to get searched. My wife and I got out of the car and I told them I had guns with me (in the trunk) before they asked (this was before I was a CHL). They opened up all my cases and quickly looked over my guns. Fortunately they didn't give me any problems. I was sure to ask for directions back to HWY 90 so I could get on my way.
So that's the protocal for getting searched on the way back. I'm sure my u-turn was suspicious enough. I still can't believe my sheer stupidity in how long it took me to realize where I was going.
Showing CHL to border patrol
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Flatland2D
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I'm glad I'm not alone. And I don't think the nephew mentioned above being proned out for being a "smart aleck" at a checkpoint was a positive learning experience. I'm sure he learned, but it wasn't good.Kalrog wrote:Kevin, you are not the only one. What would happen if you refused? What grounds would they detain / arrest / search you on? That whole pesky 4th amendment thing that some of us swore to protect and defend...KBCraig wrote:I have a real problem with these "interior" checkpoints, some of which are as far as 70 miles from the border.
Please explain the constitutional authority for Border Patrol stopping and searching, with no warrant or probable cause, a car that has not been across the border.
Kevin
Kevin
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Scott Murray
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I appreciate your concerns about the 4th amendment, and I don't know why the Border Patrol searches cars for contraband at these interior check points. That is supposed to be checked at the border.
The real reason for these interior check points is to control illegal immigration. Both the US and Mexico allow free crossing of the border without papers for a short distance (15 miles?). This allows us to visit border cities, and it allows mexicans to come to our side to shop. It seems like half the cars in a border town's Walmart have mexican plates.
So the only real control of immigration has to be done at the interior choke points. The ground along the highways for miles before these points are plowed and swept, so that anyone trying to get off a vehicle and walk around them will leave tracks. You'll see Border patrol cars driving slowly along the highway looking for them. I've never been harrassed at one of these points, because our family is obviously anglo, and I don't fit whatever profile they're looking for. I suspect it might be different if I looked hispanic.
As for my nephew, from a constitutional freedom point of view, I'm sure you're right. He shouldn't have been treated the way he was. I wasn't there to see exactly what happened. But at that time of his life, he was doing his best to look like a gang banger, with his hair, beard, and clothes. And then he apparently showed some disrespect to the agent. So at a personal level, he might have learned something from it.
Back to the immigration, I don't understand why so much emphasis is being placed on a fence at the border, or why so many illegals swim the river. They can cross at the bridge. The trick is getting inland.
Scott
The real reason for these interior check points is to control illegal immigration. Both the US and Mexico allow free crossing of the border without papers for a short distance (15 miles?). This allows us to visit border cities, and it allows mexicans to come to our side to shop. It seems like half the cars in a border town's Walmart have mexican plates.
So the only real control of immigration has to be done at the interior choke points. The ground along the highways for miles before these points are plowed and swept, so that anyone trying to get off a vehicle and walk around them will leave tracks. You'll see Border patrol cars driving slowly along the highway looking for them. I've never been harrassed at one of these points, because our family is obviously anglo, and I don't fit whatever profile they're looking for. I suspect it might be different if I looked hispanic.
As for my nephew, from a constitutional freedom point of view, I'm sure you're right. He shouldn't have been treated the way he was. I wasn't there to see exactly what happened. But at that time of his life, he was doing his best to look like a gang banger, with his hair, beard, and clothes. And then he apparently showed some disrespect to the agent. So at a personal level, he might have learned something from it.
Back to the immigration, I don't understand why so much emphasis is being placed on a fence at the border, or why so many illegals swim the river. They can cross at the bridge. The trick is getting inland.
Scott