Greg Abbott and OC

[suthdj]

Ya know Perry probably would have signed it also, how did that work out for us? Unless he is willing to call an extended session for it then it is nothing more then passive support...like Perry. We will all see at the end of the next session how much real support there is for it.

[mojo84]

It's not an observation on his personal beliefs, but in several issues I have seen him be somewhat of a fence sitter or going along to get along and with his parsing of his statements about OC it is cause for concern in my view.

What specifically would you like for him to say and do as governor? He is the governor elect, not a legislator. He signs the bills, vetos them or lets them pass in time. He said he would sign the OC bill if one gets to him.

[anygunanywhere]

Just because every discussion between Governor, Lt Governor, and legislators is not made public does not mean that these folks are merely playing media lip service.

I for one think Abbott will be the best governor in the history of this state. He is proactive and pro freedom.

If we do our part when Charles tells us to Abbot will do his. Let the system work.

[paxton25]

As I said before. He is the leader of the party in Texas, as Governor he sets the tone and priorities just like the president does. Specifically, as I mentioned before, I would like him to put his full effort behind passing constitutional carry, not equivocating on his support. Instead of just saying, "I will sign the bill" say "I am asking the legislature to pass the bill so that I can sign it" or something to that effect.

It's not an observation on his personal beliefs, but in several issues I have seen him be somewhat of a fence sitter or going along to get along and with his parsing of his statements about OC it is cause for concern in my view.

What specifically would you like for him to say and do as governor? He is the governor elect, not a legislator. He signs the bills, vetos them or lets them pass in time. He said he would sign the OC bill if one gets to him.

[Charlies.Contingency]

Just because every discussion between Governor, Lt Governor, and legislators is not made public does not mean that these folks are merely playing media lip service.

I for one think Abbott will be the best governor in the history of this state. He is proactive and pro freedom.

If we do our part when Charles tells us to Abbot will do his. Let the system work.

I agree, I am putting my faith in him, and there's not much else I can do. I will not openly criticize him for my lack of knowledge on the matter, because how can I criticize something for which I no not what all is going on behind closed doors. When he does DO something worth criticizing, then I will voice my opinions. But so far, he put himself as a good guy to us.

[RoyGBiv]

As I said before. He is the leader of the party in Texas, as Governor he sets the tone and priorities just like the president does. Specifically, as I mentioned before, I would like him to put his full effort behind passing constitutional carry, not equivocating on his support. Instead of just saying, "I will sign the bill" say "I am asking the legislature to pass the bill so that I can sign it" or something to that effect.

If you take a look at all the things Abbott wants to accomplish, then look at how the process works, then consider how many political "chips" a first-term Governor has to work with, then prioritize and distribute those "chips" among the various priorities... The thing that makes me sad is that a year ago, before Starbucks, Chipotle and Target, Open Carry needed fewer "Chips" to get through the legislature. Now, a Governor Abbott will need to consider how many chips he can spend on OC in light of the more difficult path it's on, vs. other priorities that will have a less-contentious path through the legislature.

I for one think Abbott will be the best governor in the history of this state. He is proactive and pro freedom.

I am also optimistic in this regard.

[paxton25]

And that's precisely where his leadership needs to come in. To be a full throated advocate for gun rights instead of just indicating that if it happens it happens. It's easy to do the right thing when no one is looking. Harder so when the spotlight is on you. I have great hope for Abbott as well as great concerns considering his vacillations and tendency to fence ride.

As I said before. He is the leader of the party in Texas, as Governor he sets the tone and priorities just like the president does. Specifically, as I mentioned before, I would like him to put his full effort behind passing constitutional carry, not equivocating on his support. Instead of just saying, "I will sign the bill" say "I am asking the legislature to pass the bill so that I can sign it" or something to that effect.

If you take a look at all the things Abbott wants to accomplish, then look at how the process works, then consider how many political "chips" a first-term Governor has to work with, then prioritize and distribute those "chips" among the various priorities... The thing that makes me sad is that a year ago, before Starbucks, Chipotle and Target, Open Carry needed fewer "Chips" to get through the legislature. Now, a Governor Abbott will need to consider how many chips he can spend on OC in light of the more difficult path it's on, vs. other priorities that will have a less-contentious path through the legislature.

I for one think Abbott will be the best governor in the history of this state. He is proactive and pro freedom.

I am also optimistic in this regard.

[RoyGBiv]

And that's precisely where his leadership needs to come in. To be a full throated advocate for gun rights instead of just indicating that if it happens it happens. It's easy to do the right thing when no one is looking. Harder so when the spotlight is on you. I have great hope for Abbott as well as great concerns considering his vacillations and tendency to fence ride.

As I said before. He is the leader of the party in Texas, as Governor he sets the tone and priorities just like the president does. Specifically, as I mentioned before, I would like him to put his full effort behind passing constitutional carry, not equivocating on his support. Instead of just saying, "I will sign the bill" say "I am asking the legislature to pass the bill so that I can sign it" or something to that effect.

If you take a look at all the things Abbott wants to accomplish, then look at how the process works, then consider how many political "chips" a first-term Governor has to work with, then prioritize and distribute those "chips" among the various priorities... The thing that makes me sad is that a year ago, before Starbucks, Chipotle and Target, Open Carry needed fewer "Chips" to get through the legislature. Now, a Governor Abbott will need to consider how many chips he can spend on OC in light of the more difficult path it's on, vs. other priorities that will have a less-contentious path through the legislature.

I for one think Abbott will be the best governor in the history of this state. He is proactive and pro freedom.

I am also optimistic in this regard.

Apparently my "limited number of chips" points sailed over your head.

(aside: we generally add new comments below quoted comments here. I'm with you on commenting above as a habit, but, following local conventions makes it easier to follow along sometimes... )

[paxton25]

And that's precisely where his leadership needs to come in. To be a full throated advocate for gun rights instead of just indicating that if it happens it happens. It's easy to do the right thing when no one is looking. Harder so when the spotlight is on you. I have great hope for Abbott as well as great concerns considering his vacillations and tendency to fence ride.

As I said before. He is the leader of the party in Texas, as Governor he sets the tone and priorities just like the president does. Specifically, as I mentioned before, I would like him to put his full effort behind passing constitutional carry, not equivocating on his support. Instead of just saying, "I will sign the bill" say "I am asking the legislature to pass the bill so that I can sign it" or something to that effect.

If you take a look at all the things Abbott wants to accomplish, then look at how the process works, then consider how many political "chips" a first-term Governor has to work with, then prioritize and distribute those "chips" among the various priorities... The thing that makes me sad is that a year ago, before Starbucks, Chipotle and Target, Open Carry needed fewer "Chips" to get through the legislature. Now, a Governor Abbott will need to consider how many chips he can spend on OC in light of the more difficult path it's on, vs. other priorities that will have a less-contentious path through the legislature.

I for one think Abbott will be the best governor in the history of this state. He is proactive and pro freedom.

I am also optimistic in this regard.

Apparently my "limited number of chips" points sailed over your head.

(aside: we generally add new comments below quoted comments here. I'm with you on commenting above as a habit, but, following local conventions makes it easier to follow along sometimes... )

OK here's a quote below. It will take some time to get used to it so please go easy until it is habit! No, the chips points didn't sail over my head. I just don't agree with the analogy, the only time politics is a zero sum game is at election time. When simply coming out and saying "these are my priorities this legislative session and I urge the legislature to pass bills in support of these priorities" he doesn't have to cash in a lot of chips. Yes there was the whole "we the people" platform when he was running but most of that was just do nothing fluff.

[RoyGBiv]

And that's precisely where his leadership needs to come in. To be a full throated advocate for gun rights instead of just indicating that if it happens it happens. It's easy to do the right thing when no one is looking. Harder so when the spotlight is on you. I have great hope for Abbott as well as great concerns considering his vacillations and tendency to fence ride.

As I said before. He is the leader of the party in Texas, as Governor he sets the tone and priorities just like the president does. Specifically, as I mentioned before, I would like him to put his full effort behind passing constitutional carry, not equivocating on his support. Instead of just saying, "I will sign the bill" say "I am asking the legislature to pass the bill so that I can sign it" or something to that effect.

If you take a look at all the things Abbott wants to accomplish, then look at how the process works, then consider how many political "chips" a first-term Governor has to work with, then prioritize and distribute those "chips" among the various priorities... The thing that makes me sad is that a year ago, before Starbucks, Chipotle and Target, Open Carry needed fewer "Chips" to get through the legislature. Now, a Governor Abbott will need to consider how many chips he can spend on OC in light of the more difficult path it's on, vs. other priorities that will have a less-contentious path through the legislature.

I for one think Abbott will be the best governor in the history of this state. He is proactive and pro freedom.

I am also optimistic in this regard.

Apparently my "limited number of chips" points sailed over your head.

(aside: we generally add new comments below quoted comments here. I'm with you on commenting above as a habit, but, following local conventions makes it easier to follow along sometimes... )

OK here's a quote below. It will take some time to get used to it so please go easy until it is habit! No, the chips points didn't sail over my head. I just don't agree with the analogy, the only time politics is a zero sum game is at election time. When simply coming out and saying "these are my priorities this legislative session and I urge the legislature to pass bills in support of these priorities" he doesn't have to cash in a lot of chips. Yes there was the whole "we the people" platform when he was running but most of that was just do nothing fluff.

I read the tone of what you wrote above (full throated advocate) and lastly below (simply saying these are my priorities) as being very different. If you intended something different, I'll chalk it up to the nuances of communicating in this format... but.. to me... "full throated" would require spending chips.

Either way, it seems like we've reached an understanding, I think...

Here's MY opinion..... through whatever avenues of advocacy, OC is on the agenda this session in a way that it has not been before. I want it to pass. I want "Constitutional Carry" to pass. Just like the Speaker race, I understand it will be left up to my representatives to assess the inside baseball and make the best play they can. I'll keep phoning my rep as Charles indicates doing so would be most helpful. I'll keep feeling unsatisfied, knowing I can do more and looking for ways to do so as constructively as possible. That said, we lost our rights incrementally, we need to be prepared to win them back incrementally. As much as I want Constitutional Carry, I need to be prepared to accept licensed open carry, if that's what the people I trust tell me is the only thing that can pass. I'll push for more this year and more in the years ahead, but I won't burn bridges or do things that scare soccer moms. Open holsters is a positive message. Long guns at Starbucks is not.

I'll fight along side you, but not under the same leadership. Not until the tactics stop scaring my neighbors.

[paxton25]

And that's precisely where his leadership needs to come in. To be a full throated advocate for gun rights instead of just indicating that if it happens it happens. It's easy to do the right thing when no one is looking. Harder so when the spotlight is on you. I have great hope for Abbott as well as great concerns considering his vacillations and tendency to fence ride.

As I said before. He is the leader of the party in Texas, as Governor he sets the tone and priorities just like the president does. Specifically, as I mentioned before, I would like him to put his full effort behind passing constitutional carry, not equivocating on his support. Instead of just saying, "I will sign the bill" say "I am asking the legislature to pass the bill so that I can sign it" or something to that effect.

If you take a look at all the things Abbott wants to accomplish, then look at how the process works, then consider how many political "chips" a first-term Governor has to work with, then prioritize and distribute those "chips" among the various priorities... The thing that makes me sad is that a year ago, before Starbucks, Chipotle and Target, Open Carry needed fewer "Chips" to get through the legislature. Now, a Governor Abbott will need to consider how many chips he can spend on OC in light of the more difficult path it's on, vs. other priorities that will have a less-contentious path through the legislature.

I for one think Abbott will be the best governor in the history of this state. He is proactive and pro freedom.

I am also optimistic in this regard.

Apparently my "limited number of chips" points sailed over your head.

(aside: we generally add new comments below quoted comments here. I'm with you on commenting above as a habit, but, following local conventions makes it easier to follow along sometimes... )

OK here's a quote below. It will take some time to get used to it so please go easy until it is habit! No, the chips points didn't sail over my head. I just don't agree with the analogy, the only time politics is a zero sum game is at election time. When simply coming out and saying "these are my priorities this legislative session and I urge the legislature to pass bills in support of these priorities" he doesn't have to cash in a lot of chips. Yes there was the whole "we the people" platform when he was running but most of that was just do nothing fluff.

I read the tone of what you wrote above (full throated advocate) and lastly below (simply saying these are my priorities) as being very different. If you intended something different, I'll chalk it up to the nuances of communicating in this format... but.. to me... "full throated" would require spending chips.

Either way, it seems like we've reached an understanding, I think...

Here's MY opinion..... through whatever avenues of advocacy, OC is on the agenda this session in a way that it has not been before. I want it to pass. I want "Constitutional Carry" to pass. Just like the Speaker race, I understand it will be left up to my representatives to assess the inside baseball and make the best play they can. I'll keep phoning my rep as Charles indicates doing so would be most helpful. I'll keep feeling unsatisfied, knowing I can do more and looking for ways to do so as constructively as possible. That said, we lost our rights incrementally, we need to be prepared to win them back incrementally. As much as I want Constitutional Carry, I need to be prepared to accept licensed open carry, if that's what the people I trust tell me is the only thing that can pass. I'll push for more this year and more in the years ahead, but I won't burn bridges or do things that scare soccer moms. Open holsters is a positive message. Long guns at Starbucks is not.

I'll fight along side you, but not under the same leadership. Not until the tactics stop scaring my neighbors.

Yes they are different, I would love to see a full throated support form Abbott, having a "come to jesus" meeting with leadership in the house and senate and tell them to pass the bill. Knowing Abbott I don't expect that to happen, but at very least a public statement that he WANTS them to pass it not just that he will sign something if it happens to come across his desk would go a long way and wouldn't require any "chips" to be cashed in. My view, if constitutional carry is the real goal and if Licensed OC passes instead of constitutional carry it will be harder to get constitutional carry passed. It may never pass. I have no problem calling out the politicians that are standing in the way of that. Doesn't matter if I like them or not, doesn't matter if they are on my side 90% of the time. They are hurting not helping. What are you bringing up Starbucks for? What leadership am I under? I am my own man.

[srothstein]

Paxton25,

I think you are asking for something that is not how politics in general works. I think when any politician makes a statement on an issue, they are telling people what their policy will be. When the governor makes a statement that he will sign a bill, he has just told all of the legislators that he expects to see the bill passed. This is especially true when the statement is made in public and to the media. Abbott just told all of the legislators that this bill is important to him, and did it in a manner that keeps them working with him on other issues also.

Think about how things could go if Abbott went to someone and said I expect this bill to be passed. He could get it done, but it would cost him some other bill. If he did like you proposed and said in public that he wants this bill passed, it would set up a situation where someone would oppose it just to set up a confrontation with him for other purposes.

This statement lets everyone know that the bill is one of his priorities while avoiding the outright costs. It also removes one argument against it, which is that it would never get signed anyway. Good politicians are rarely as blunt as you or I would be, and whether you support him or oppose him, no one can say Abbott is not a good politician.

[paxton25]

Oh, you mean like all of the republicans that made statements they would stop Obamacare and then didn't do what it took to defund it when they had the opportunity and instead took a few dozen cover votes to repeal it knowing nothing would happen? Sorry but the landscape of politics is littered with politicians having a different policy that what their statements would lead one to believe. I am not saying Abbott doesn't personally like the idea of OC or constitutional carry, just that he doesn't want to shoulder most of the burden for sticking his neck out for it. The only real cost to a politician making a stronger stand than, "if it shows up on my desk I will sign it", is he has to fade heat from the other side. You are correct, Abbott is a very good politician. Good at trying to avoid costly controversy and trying to get both sides of an issue to believe he is with them or at least not hostile to them. Perfect example with Abbott, voters across Texas have been demanding an outright statewide red light camera ban, a statewide camera ban is part of the Texas GOP platform. But the local politicians love the camera revenue and the state gets half of it too. In fact, holding onto dedicated trauma funds from the cameras is the only reason the state could claim they had a balanced budget. So what does Abbott do? He comes out and says if the voters want to go out and petition their city (considering all that has to happen, money spent, time, resources, volunteers, lawsuits by camera vendors etc.) they should be able to do that. Bingo, the cameras get to stay for the most part pumping in revenue while violating due process rights, (which he should be defending as AG and has refused to do so) and he gets to tell the angry voters he supports them petitioning to remove the cameras. It's classic fence sitter policy. I believe he even said something like "both sides have good points" It's wishy washy leadership, I was hoping for better, not surprised, but definitely had higher hopes.

Paxton25,

I think you are asking for something that is not how politics in general works. I think when any politician makes a statement on an issue, they are telling people what their policy will be. When the governor makes a statement that he will sign a bill, he has just told all of the legislators that he expects to see the bill passed. This is especially true when the statement is made in public and to the media. Abbott just told all of the legislators that this bill is important to him, and did it in a manner that keeps them working with him on other issues also.

Think about how things could go if Abbott went to someone and said I expect this bill to be passed. He could get it done, but it would cost him some other bill. If he did like you proposed and said in public that he wants this bill passed, it would set up a situation where someone would oppose it just to set up a confrontation with him for other purposes.

This statement lets everyone know that the bill is one of his priorities while avoiding the outright costs. It also removes one argument against it, which is that it would never get signed anyway. Good politicians are rarely as blunt as you or I would be, and whether you support him or oppose him, no one can say Abbott is not a good politician.

[infoman]

I'm against constitutional carry, but I'm in support of licensed open carry. Just my 2 cents.

[RoyGBiv]

Paxton25,

I think you are asking for something that is not how politics in general works. I think when any politician makes a statement on an issue, they are telling people what their policy will be. When the governor makes a statement that he will sign a bill, he has just told all of the legislators that he expects to see the bill passed. This is especially true when the statement is made in public and to the media. Abbott just told all of the legislators that this bill is important to him, and did it in a manner that keeps them working with him on other issues also.

Think about how things could go if Abbott went to someone and said I expect this bill to be passed. He could get it done, but it would cost him some other bill. If he did like you proposed and said in public that he wants this bill passed, it would set up a situation where someone would oppose it just to set up a confrontation with him for other purposes.

This statement lets everyone know that the bill is one of his priorities while avoiding the outright costs. It also removes one argument against it, which is that it would never get signed anyway. Good politicians are rarely as blunt as you or I would be, and whether you support him or oppose him, no one can say Abbott is not a good politician.

Thanks for saying this better than I did.