Confusing rules...

[Vader]

So is there somewhere that the places a CHL holder CAN'T carry listed clearly and in a non-confusing manner?

I've read the law booklet, but some things are not presented well. For instance, it says you can't carry in a church, but I've seen in several threads that you can because there is a provision that allows it if there are no 30.06 signs. If that's the case why is it still on the restricted list? And what about hospitals with no sign? I'm assuming school buildings are always off limits...

It would be nice to just have a list with no exceptions or provisions, black and white.

Sorry for the noobish question in advance.

[WildBill]

So is there somewhere that the places a CHL holder CAN'T carry listed clearly and in a non-confusing manner?

I've read the law booklet, but some things are not presented well. For instance, it says you can't carry in a church, but I've seen in several threads that you can because there is a provision that allows it if there are no 30.06 signs. If that's the case why is it still on the restricted list? And what about hospitals with no sign? I'm assuming school buildings are always off limits...

It would be nice to just have a list with no exceptions or provisions, black and white.

Sorry for the noobish question in advance.

Welcome to the forum. It is confusing, but the law is the final say on where it is legal to carry. Sometimes it's unfortunate that the law makers do just reissue the entire statute when it is revised, but that's the way it is. Just read and ask on the forum and you won't be a noob for long.

[AustinBoy]

This is a good place to start:

viewtopic.php?f=36&t=6994" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Jaguar]

Another good place to look is here,

http://texaschlforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=34571" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Vader]

Thanks for the help and welcome folks!

AustinBoy that link is exactly was I was looking for. I'm going to highlight those parts in my manual to keep in my truck.

[RoyGBiv]

So is there somewhere that the places a CHL holder CAN'T carry listed clearly and in a non-confusing manner?

You need to understand lawyer-talk to understand CHL-16..
FWIW..

http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/InternetFo ... CHL-16.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Offense:
PC §46.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE HOLDER.
(b) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of whether the handgun is concealed, on or about the license holder's person:
(6) on the premises of a church, synagogue, or other established place of religious worship.

The Church caveat: (still in 46.035)
(i) Subsections (b)(4), (b)(5), (b)(6), and (c) do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice under Section 30.06.

I believe the history for this particular bit of confusion is that (i) was added rather recently, well after the original law. Rather than re-write the entire section, lawmakers stuck on the changes/exceptions at the end. Less than elegant wordsmithing, but I suspect this was easier to execute for whatever reason.

[Purplehood]

And remember that the law only states where you cannnot carry. If a place is not covered, it is presumed that you can carry in that location unless Federal law applies.

[SewTexas]

Vader have you taken your class yet? this should have all been covered, including how to read the law?

[TexasGal]

The CHL16 is like marrying someone who doesn't speak your language
Still, it's the law and there is not likely to be a clearer version any tIme soon. I have found one way to help is to print it off the DPS website on full size paper. That will leave large margins. Put it in a binder and use pencil to write notes in the margins clarifying the parts that are confusing. Notice I said pencil and make sure your notes are accurate of course. You will likely go back and erase some things to add a better explanation now and then. Every legislative session, one or more laws are changed or added that affect CHL carry. Add those changes as they occur. Add pages that cover the federal laws affecting carry and knife laws if you carry one. It will become a reference that will help you a lot better. Hopefully, we will get ACOE land added to places we can carry soon. That will at least relieve you from keeping an encyclopedia of all the lakes and parks you have to avoid

[Vader]

Vader have you taken your class yet? this should have all been covered, including how to read the law?

Yeah I have but it was a while back. It was covered well but I haven't looked at the booklet in a while because I've become so used to where I carry and where I don't.

[AJSully421]

So is there somewhere that the places a CHL holder CAN'T carry listed clearly and in a non-confusing manner?

You need to understand lawyer-talk to understand CHL-16..
FWIW..

http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/InternetFo ... CHL-16.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Offense:
PC §46.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE HOLDER.
(b) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of whether the handgun is concealed, on or about the license holder's person:
(6) on the premises of a church, synagogue, or other established place of religious worship.

The Church caveat: (still in 46.035)
(i) Subsections (b)(4), (b)(5), (b)(6), and (c) do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice under Section 30.06.

I believe the history for this particular bit of confusion is that (i) was added rather recently, well after the original law. Rather than re-write the entire section, lawmakers stuck on the changes/exceptions at the end. Less than elegant wordsmithing, but I suspect this was easier to execute for whatever reason.

It was revised in 1997 - the first legislative session after CHL was passed. Seems they had to negotiate with the liberals to get it passed, then they made it into what they wanted all along. Chess v. Checkers.

I agree that we have to learn to read legalese. You also have to understand the tricks that legislators pull. It is sometimes hard to pass a bill that changes the text of a whole law... but it is pretty easy to slip something like a subsection (i) into a funding bill or something else unrelated. Works both ways.

I am REALLY hoping for licensed OC and Campus Carry this time.

[Oldgringo]

And remember that the law only states where you cannnot carry. If a place is not covered, it is presumed that you can carry in that location unless Federal law applies.

...or you are given verbal notice.

[Jim Beaux]

The CHL16 is like marrying someone who doesn't speak your language
Still, it's the law and there is not likely to be a clearer version any tIme soon. I have found one way to help is to print it off the DPS website on full size paper. That will leave large margins. Put it in a binder and use pencil to write notes in the margins clarifying the parts that are confusing. Notice I said pencil and make sure your notes are accurate of course. You will likely go back and erase some things to add a better explanation now and then. Every legislative session, one or more laws are changed or added that affect CHL carry. Add those changes as they occur. Add pages that cover the federal laws affecting carry and knife laws if you carry one. It will become a reference that will help you a lot better. Hopefully, we will get ACOE land added to places we can carry soon. That will at least relieve you from keeping an encyclopedia of all the lakes and parks you have to avoid

A Kindle (Nook?) is perfect for this as you can save all your notes/questions/comments to a common location with reference points. One day Im gonna get motivated and transfer Texas CHL law, Texas 30.06, & reciprocal states to my Kindle. I intend to try and set up a table of contents in the notes section for quick access. If it works like I hope it should be very handy.

I wished I had thought to utilized the Kindle before I took the CHL class.