workplace concealed carry issues

[carlson1]

Silence is Golden!

is the definition of CONCEALED

[NcongruNt]

I think I am going to take everyone's advice and not mention it specifically, and just get my hands on all the policy documentation I can and take it from there. If the other employee (I'm never mentioning anything CHL-related to her again) pushes the issue with management for some reason (like she suspects I am carrying), then I guess I'll deal with it then, as well as pulling the "you have us work in a dangerous area rampant with crime, sometimes alone with no steps taken to ensure our safety" card.

My understanding is that the notice from an employer does have to be the 30.06 language specifically, only that carrying in general is prohibited. CHL instructors, any clarification?

[NcongruNt]

Sounds like 6th street in Austin, or that general area.

I would not be without my pistol under similar circumstances.

Don't ask, Don't tell.

Right you are. A few blocks East of the interstate.

[KBCraig]

My understanding is that the notice from an employer does have to be the 30.06 language specifically, only that carrying in general is prohibited. CHL instructors, any clarification?

I'm not an instructor. I'm not even a CHL, just someone with an intense interest in reading and understanding the law.

That said, PC 30.06 is about "criminal trespass by a concealed handgun licensee". The section is clear about what notice is required: any written notice (whether it's a sign in 1" letters, or a workplace policy in 12 pt. Times New Roman) must contain the exact 30.06 wording to be legally binding.

And 30.06 allows any verbal notice to be sufficient, with no specific language required. Anyone in authority telling you verbally that "you can't bring any guns here" is sufficient notice.

Of course, proving that you were verbally notified, and that you heard and understood the notice, would be something for the lawyers to fight about.

All of this has nothing to do with getting fired. You can be fired for having a gun whether or not any notice was given. You can be fired because the boss woke up on the wrong side of the bed and decides it must be All Your Fault.

[NcongruNt]

I'm not an instructor. I'm not even a CHL, just someone with an intense interest in reading and understanding the law.

That said, PC 30.06 is about "criminal trespass by a concealed handgun licensee". The section is clear about what notice is required: any written notice (whether it's a sign in 1" letters, or a workplace policy in 12 pt. Times New Roman) must contain the exact 30.06 wording to be legally binding.

And 30.06 allows any verbal notice to be sufficient, with no specific language required. Anyone in authority telling you verbally that "you can't bring any guns here" is sufficient notice.

That's good to know. I know for sure that I was never given any documentation with the specific 30.06 language, and that I have never been told by any member of management that I am not allowed to carry. The Austin office has been like the red-headed stepchild of the company, historically. I doubt anyone in Chicago took the time to look up specific handgun laws in Texas and then work the specific language requirements into a document. I will get the documentation, of course, but I think it's highly unlikely that 30.06 is written into the company manual.

[stevie_d_64]

"Gun" in Chicago is a four letter word...













Steve is illustrating absurdity, by being absurd!

("Wife-Unit" would agree that Steve is mostly absurd!)

[RPBrown]

Concealed means concealed. DADT vote here also

[Rex B]

And remember, "written notice" in the employee manual has to exactly match the 30.06 verbiage to count legally. Of course, they could still fire you, but they could do that even if firearms aren't mentioned in the employee handbook.

So, if the employee manual says no firearms, but that notice is not 30.06 compliant, then they could fire you but they could not file charges?
Would you then have a case to file suit for wrongful termination?

[carlson1]

Concealed means concealed. DADT vote here also

I have heard those same words somewhere else

[Scott Murray]

DADT. And if she ever inquires about it in the future, you can say something like "I wouldn't want to do anything to upset you," which in this case would mean telling her about the pistol you're packing.

Scott

[razoraggie]

[quote="Right2Carry"]Once again another reason to keep your CHL to yourself. You never know how anyone is going to react. I wouldn't have told her squat when she inquired what I was searching for and if that is not an option I would have made something up. If you can't find it in the company manual, and the site is not posted 30.06 I don't think I would have worried to much about it.



Some things are best left unsaid when testing the waters.

[lrb111]

I know for sure that I was never given any documentation with the specific 30.06 language, and that I have never been told by any member of management that I am not allowed to carry. ........
....... I will get the documentation, of course, but I think it's highly unlikely that 30.06 is written into the company manual.

I would not even bother. If you have not been notified, verbally or in writing, why invite trouble? Get something easy to conceal....

[NcongruNt]

My understanding is that the notice from an employer does have to be the 30.06 language specifically, only that carrying in general is prohibited. CHL instructors, any clarification?

I'm not an instructor. I'm not even a CHL, just someone with an intense interest in reading and understanding the law.

That said, PC 30.06 is about "criminal trespass by a concealed handgun licensee". The section is clear about what notice is required: any written notice (whether it's a sign in 1" letters, or a workplace policy in 12 pt. Times New Roman) must contain the exact 30.06 wording to be legally binding.

And 30.06 allows any verbal notice to be sufficient, with no specific language required. Anyone in authority telling you verbally that "you can't bring any guns here" is sufficient notice.

Of course, proving that you were verbally notified, and that you heard and understood the notice, would be something for the lawyers to fight about.

All of this has nothing to do with getting fired. You can be fired for having a gun whether or not any notice was given. You can be fired because the boss woke up on the wrong side of the bed and decides it must be All Your Fault.

and posted in the "Need some opinions please" thread at http://www.texasshooting.com/TexasCHL_F ... 7459#67459 :

We had some similar discussion on this topic regarding a post of mine (http://www.texasshooting.com/TexasCHL_F ... sc&start=0)in this forum. Does the handbook/policy specifically have the 30.06 wording in it? If no, you are not legally obliged to not carry unless you are verbally told by your manager that you cannot carry.
The situation you're in seems to be far and above better than mine, as you report directly to the owner, and he is a CHL holder. If he does not tell you specifically that you cannot carry, and the specific 30.06 wording is not in the handbook, then you are legally covered. I'd personally be comfortable carrying in such a situation. My guess is that a CHL-carrying boss isn't gonna fire you for carrying, and he should know the law well enough to tell you specifically that you cannot carry if those were his wishes.

No. it can be written or verbal from an employer. the company manuel does not have to be 30.06 wording.

Is there someone who can give an authoritative answer?

[KBCraig]

See my reply there quoting the law. Written communication must have the exact wording to be effective under 30.06.

[NcongruNt]

So an update on this...

Apparently, the coworker told my manager something... not sure what. He said that he heard that I was carrying a handgun at work. I told him no, that I was not, and that I never had. I explained that I was looking into company policies, as my CHL was pending. He told me that having a gun would put others at higher risk, introducing an element of escalation in conflict. I promptly explained to him that a gun is an absolute last resort, only used when life is threatened, and that I would never pull my gun unless there is imminent risk to the life of myself or someone else, and there was no other alternative. I was told not to bring it on the premises unless I was given permission by him.

So that's that.