Recourse at a Bar?

[Thiggy]

Great insight and advice. Well put, Steve.

Thanks,

[dihappy]

The bad thing is that even if you had a copy to prove to the TABC officer that he was incorrect about the law, you may have still been arrested just for bruising his ego.

I doubt Steve would even encourage trying to get your point across to a misinformed TABC officer.

[srothstein]

I have posted before that my advice is to never argue or debate with the officer at the scene. That is not the place where you stand a chance of wining. If it is ignorance, the best way is to get with a supervisor later in a calm environment. If it is an arrest or charge, then you debate it in court. You can win in either case, but only by using the system as it was designed. Fighting the system will make you lose.

[rgraham541]

And unfortunately the law of .08 is null/void when you are carrying concealed, even 1 beer can be and infraction if you choose to carry, if you drink..leave the piece at home!

Can you cite any references for this, (highlighted part of statement above) other than the occassional addled-brained CHL instructor?

Well fine..it says "intoxicated" but I will bet you if you get nailed...it doesn't matter if you blow a .01 or whatever...the anti's will throw a fit and the news outlets will plaster "a Drunk CHL'er"

I don't want to be the one to test this but this was a matter of discussion with my CHL instructor. I couldn't believe the law would just throw out the word "intoxicated" without definition. TPC 49.01 clearly states the definition of the term "intoxicated" and no where can I find any special circumstances for CHL.

If I were to follow my instructors view I would be in violation if I had a beer before coming home from a neighbors.

Haven't received my plastic yet (58 days down) and I'm just trying to get the lay of the land so to say. I guess the best rule of thumb is if in doubt don't do it.

[frankie_the_yankee]

I don't want to be the one to test this but this was a matter of discussion with my CHL instructor. I couldn't believe the law would just throw out the word "intoxicated" without definition. TPC 49.01 clearly states the definition of the term "intoxicated" and no where can I find any special circumstances for CHL.

If I were to follow my instructors view I would be in violation if I had a beer before coming home from a neighbors.

Haven't received my plastic yet (58 days down) and I'm just trying to get the lay of the land so to say. I guess the best rule of thumb is if in doubt don't do it.

Your instructor was full of baloney. I hope he didn't pass out any other misinformation or opinion disguised as fact during your class.

I would have no problem with an instrustor who said something like, "While the law allows you to drink while carrying as long as you don't get intoxicated, my advice is to not drink at all if you are carrying." But according to the occassional report, and my own experience at last April's renewal class, this isn't the case.

These issue make me think that DPS should set up a program of auditing CHL classes. Kind of like the way a place like Wal-Mart will hire people to go and shop their stores to report on whether their experience was good, whether the store and employees were following company procedures, etc.

I think if this were done, instructors would be a lot more careful about handing out their opinions - at least without making it clear that it WAS simply an opinion.

[lrb111]

These issue make me think that DPS should set up a program of auditing CHL classes. Kind of like the way a place like Wal-Mart will hire people to go and shop their stores to report on whether their experience was good, whether the store and employees were following company procedures, etc.

I think if this were done, instructors would be a lot more careful about handing out their opinions - at least without making it clear that it WAS simply an opinion.

That tool is already inplace and has been for quite sometime.
Instructors are told during their classes that part of the reason for notifying DPS in advance of holding classes, is exactly for that possibility.
otoh, I have also been told that it may be possible for DPS to audit a class at the instructor's request, to possibly improve the delivery of the information. I have no idea if this part happens, or how often DPS might show up unannounced.