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The possession or use of weapons, including but not limited to, knives and handguns, whether concealed or carried openly, is strictly prohibited on premises, including property owned or leased by , unless otherwise expressly permitted by operative state or local law.

Not going to risk my job over it but does this this mean since I have a CHL I am permitted?

Vbsandler wrote:The possession or use of weapons, including but not limited to, knives and handguns, whether concealed or carried openly, is strictly prohibited on premises, including property owned or leased by , unless otherwise expressly permitted by operative state or local law.

Not going to risk my job over it but does this this mean since I have a CHL I am permitted?

Ours says the exact same thing and I started a thread about it a few months ago. Is your HR run by ADP by any chance? I was told in some pretty terse terms by a couple of members that it should be obvious, and it means I could be fired for carrying on the premises. With that said, I still don't know what it means. If you get a definitive answer, please let me know. I'm not going to be the guy to walk into HR and ask for a clarification.

Redneck_Buddha wrote:

Vbsandler wrote:The possession or use of weapons, including but not limited to, knives and handguns, whether concealed or carried openly, is strictly prohibited on premises, including property owned or leased by , unless otherwise expressly permitted by operative state or local law.

Not going to risk my job over it but does this this mean since I have a CHL I am permitted?

Ours says the exact same thing and I started a thread about it a few months ago. Is your HR run by ADP by any chance? I was told in some pretty terse terms by a couple of members that it should be obvious, and it means I could be fired for carrying on the premises. With that said, I still don't know what it means. If you get a definitive answer, please let me know. I'm not going to be the guy to walk into HR and ask for a clarification.

Yes ADP does run it. Im not the brave soul to call and have the riot act read to me

Vbsandler wrote:

Redneck_Buddha wrote:

Vbsandler wrote:The possession or use of weapons, including but not limited to, knives and handguns, whether concealed or carried openly, is strictly prohibited on premises, including property owned or leased by , unless otherwise expressly permitted by operative state or local law.

Not going to risk my job over it but does this this mean since I have a CHL I am permitted?

Ours says the exact same thing and I started a thread about it a few months ago. Is your HR run by ADP by any chance? I was told in some pretty terse terms by a couple of members that it should be obvious, and it means I could be fired for carrying on the premises. With that said, I still don't know what it means. If you get a definitive answer, please let me know. I'm not going to be the guy to walk into HR and ask for a clarification.

Yes ADP does run it. Im not the brave soul to call and have the riot act read to me

Right, just as I thought...it seems to be a boiler plate manual that ADP publishes for all its clients' workplaces. Hopefully we'll get some good clarification because to me it could be read several ways (i.e. 30.06).

The way I read this policy is that you may not carry while at work, but they can't stop you from carrying and storing your firearm in you vehicle (parking lot law). Now, my interpretation may or may not be correct, however, it is not 30.06 language, therefore you can legally ignore it and carry away, but you could be terminated if discovered. As usual, concealed means concealed. YMMV.

Just my $0.02.

What it means is that you work for a bunch of corporate liberals that are probably scared of their own shadows. Welcome to the club and sorry.

Their policy can get you fired if discovered, but unless someone with the authority to do so has actually told you that you cannot carry inside then you have not been given adequate notice and cannot be prosecuted if discovered carrying on their premises.

Redneck_Buddha wrote:Right, just as I thought...it seems to be a boiler plate manual that ADP publishes for all its clients' workplaces. Hopefully we'll get some good clarification because to me it could be read several ways (i.e. 30.06).

This cannot be legally construed as effective notice as it does not use the 30.06 language. Written notice must be 30.06.

C-dub wrote:What it means is that you work for a bunch of corporate liberals that are probably scared of their own shadows. Welcome to the club and sorry.

Their policy can get you fired if discovered, but unless someone with the authority to do so has actually told you that you cannot carry inside then you have not been given adequate notice and cannot be prosecuted if discovered carrying on their premises.

Haha...actually, our CEO is a Sean Hannity neo-con type.

RottenApple wrote: This cannot be legally construed as effective notice as it does not use the 30.06 language. Written notice must be 30.06.

'Preciate your input, RA.

Vbsandler wrote:

Redneck_Buddha wrote:

Vbsandler wrote:The possession or use of weapons, including but not limited to, knives and handguns, whether concealed or carried openly, is strictly prohibited on premises, including property owned or leased by , unless otherwise expressly permitted by operative state or local law.

Not going to risk my job over it but does this this mean since I have a CHL I am permitted?

Ours says the exact same thing and I started a thread about it a few months ago. Is your HR run by ADP by any chance? I was told in some pretty terse terms by a couple of members that it should be obvious, and it means I could be fired for carrying on the premises. With that said, I still don't know what it means. If you get a definitive answer, please let me know. I'm not going to be the guy to walk into HR and ask for a clarification.

Yes ADP does run it. Im not the brave soul to call and have the riot act read to me

Ill call, give me the number.

We use ADP and pretty much just their default handbook. I just double-checked and found no mention of possessing weapons in ours. I'm actually the boss and couldn't remember (it was put together prior to my CHL days and pretty much the only part anyone cares about is the PTO section!). So, I'm guessing it much be an intentional add to the policies.

Vbsandler wrote:The possession or use of weapons, including but not limited to, knives and handguns, whether concealed or carried openly, is strictly prohibited on premises, including property owned or leased by , unless otherwise expressly permitted by operative state or local law.

Not going to risk my job over it but does this this mean since I have a CHL I am permitted?

I would construe the section in red to include a handgun, carried under the terms of your CHL. When you look at the whole of CHL law with a fine eye, at least in my mind, the CHL law *DOES* expressly permit under operative state law (to use their terms). I base this on the fact that under Texas law, the carrying of a handgun is expressly prohibited, and your CHL serves as an exception to this prohibition.

That said, I wouldn't ask permission, you won't likely get it. The wording of the policy simply puts you in the position of being "safe" under the law -- e.g. you cannot be prosecuted for carrying a handgun unless you were carrying in some place that was OTHERWISE off-limits (say a Post Office or "infrastructure" location).

Of course remember that Texas is an "at will" employment state, which has implications to both parties. What it means to you is that you can be fired for any reason, and you can quit for any reason, and neither party has any recourse.

Just my 2 cents worth. I'm not a lawyer.

IANAL. However, I am a human resources consultant and hold the Senior Professional in Human Resources certification.

I have written quite a few employee manuals. I have to say, if I were to write a policy intended to allow CHLers to carry at work, I don't think I could have composed a better sentence. (In fact, I may plagiarize it in the manual I'm currently writing.) It seems to contain prohibitive language applicable to most employees, then (oh, by the way) gives permission to those who have gone to the trouble to obtain a CHL. Unless the workplace is one of those places where CHL carry is prohibited by law, I would say you could carry. It allows for the parking lot law, as well as open carry, should that come about. I wouldn't bet against there being a closet CHLer somewhere at the executive level (maybe the CEO?) of the organization.

One caveat: concealed means concealed, and you could not only get fired but also be arrested (and possibly lose your CHL) if you break the rules.

I see you are new to the forums, so WELCOME.

E10 wrote:IANAL....

One caveat: concealed means concealed, and you could not only get fired but also be arrested (and possibly lose your CHL) if you break the rules.

This isn't entirely accurate. Although anyone can be arrested for anything, it wouldn't be a legitimate arrest and one certainly would not lose their CHL. An employee could be fired, but that is about it unless there was verbal notice given. Notice in an employee handbook would only be valid with the 30.06 language.

"Expressly permitted" is the term whose definition must be clarified. Though the CHL makes certain offenses not apply to the holder, does it "expressly permit" carrying at work? A contrast to consider is that the parking lot bill expressly permits you to have the gun in your car because it positively states that you may. But the laws regarding CHL do not positively state that you can carry; they just don't make it an offense.

Vbsandler wrote:The possession or use of weapons, including but not limited to, knives and handguns, whether concealed or carried openly, is strictly prohibited on premises, including property owned or leased by , unless otherwise expressly permitted by operative state or local law.

Not going to risk my job over it but does this this mean since I have a CHL I am permitted?

What's confusing? You are not allowed to posses or use weapons on company premises unless you are permitted to by state or local law. With a CHL, the state permits you to carry a concealed handgun everywhere you go with certain statutorily defined exceptions.