signage visibility

[sjfcontrol]

Also, is it correct to say that the point of the TABC sign (Unlicensed carry...) is to make it clear that the area is considered "public" and/or the owner only is willing to tolerate CHLs?

Clearly, IANAL.

IANAL either, but I believe the purpose of the blue sign is it gives persons carrying illegally (or unlicensed persons carrying under the MPA, or carrying for another lawful purpose) notice of greater penalties inside that area than outside on the sidewalk, and that they, or rather their gun, should just stay in the car, where it's legal.

I LOVE the blue sign, It's a reason to get a CHL for some people, many of whom then educate themselves on other issues.

"You are going to the convenience store? Those places get robbed sometimes, you better take your pistol, oh wait, you can't .... better get your CHL"

I seriously doubt that very many people know that the sign doesn't apply to CHLs before taking the CHL class.

[C-dub]

A lot of people don't see things that are in plain sight all the time.

2C2C, be careful. Signs do not have to be at all entrances and by entering such a place one has already committed a crime. They just didn't know it yet. I totally agree with your second paragraph and hope that IF for some really wild reason that I am discovered to be carrying in a place that I missed the sign that I will be politely asked to leave instead of finding myself starring down the barrel of one or more officers' gun.

[RPB]

Also, is it correct to say that the point of the TABC sign (Unlicensed carry...) is to make it clear that the area is considered "public" and/or the owner only is willing to tolerate CHLs?

Clearly, IANAL.

IANAL either, but I believe the purpose of the blue sign is it gives persons carrying illegally (or unlicensed persons carrying under the MPA, or carrying for another lawful purpose) notice of greater penalties inside that area than outside on the sidewalk, and that they, or rather their gun, should just stay in the car, where it's legal.

I LOVE the blue sign, It's a reason to get a CHL for some people, many of whom then educate themselves on other issues.

"You are going to the convenience store? Those places get robbed sometimes, you better take your pistol, oh wait, you can't .... better get your CHL"

I seriously doubt that very many people know that the sign doesn't apply to CHLs before taking the CHL class.

Everyone I hear that's going to a convenience store for gas or anything at all, does, because that comment opens a discussion in which I tell them ( I was quoting myself)
So far, two more church members got theirs, (in addition to all the deacons except 1, and a former LEO and his girlfriend, and I'm working on another now)

All my cousins all over Texas, except 2, got theirs I think now. (5 or 6 are Pastors, most of the rest are deacons too, but above I was referring to my local church)

"You are going to the convenience store? Those places get robbed sometimes, you better take your pistol, oh wait, you can't .... better get your CHL"

[sjfcontrol]

Everyone I hear that's going to a convenience store for gas or anything at all, does, because that comment opens a discussion in which I tell them ( I was quoting myself)

"You are going to the convenience store? Those places get robbed sometimes, you better take your pistol, oh wait, you can't .... better get your CHL"

Ahh -- Guess I missed the irony.

[ssnstump]

Newby

witnessed a discussion between a store manager a LEO and a CHL holder that the red box around the entrance to his store signified no weapons allowed beyond that box. The LEO explained that was not sufficient notice. The CHL holder was paying for a shopping cart full of groceries and his shirt rode up and was outed to the manager. He ordered him to leave and had the cashier call 911. The CHL holder was waiting for the LEO outside the door with his two kids. The manager was red faced and very angry that someone would cross his magic boundary with a weapon. He was insisting that the LEO arrest the violator and confiscate his gun and permit. He informed the manager that no law was broken. The CHL holder informed both the manager and the LEO that the store could keep their products and he would not shop there again. It was explained to the manager several times about the sign versus his magic box. The LEO finally told the manager that the guy left the store as requested by the manager, so case closed. The LEO and holder walked to the cruiser, shook hands and both departed. The manager stood outside for a while telling everyone who would listen that his store was safer because he didn't allow gun totin paranoid people shop there. I wasn't carrying, yet...but we didn't either.

[C-dub]

+1 for the LEO in Denison!

[HotLeadSolutions]

Newby

witnessed a discussion between a store manager a LEO and a CHL holder that the red box around the entrance to his store signified no weapons allowed beyond that box. The LEO explained that was not sufficient notice. The CHL holder was paying for a shopping cart full of groceries and his shirt rode up and was outed to the manager. He ordered him to leave and had the cashier call 911. The CHL holder was waiting for the LEO outside the door with his two kids. The manager was red faced and very angry that someone would cross his magic boundary with a weapon. He was insisting that the LEO arrest the violator and confiscate his gun and permit. He informed the manager that no law was broken. The CHL holder informed both the manager and the LEO that the store could keep their products and he would not shop there again. It was explained to the manager several times about the sign versus his magic box. The LEO finally told the manager that the guy left the store as requested by the manager, so case closed. The LEO and holder walked to the cruiser, shook hands and both departed. The manager stood outside for a while telling everyone who would listen that his store was safer because he didn't allow gun totin paranoid people shop there. I wasn't carrying, yet...but we didn't either.

Out of curiousity, what was the name of THIS store. I have to know....Magic Red Line.... "We don't need no stinkin' lines!"

[RPB]

Magic YELLOW curb means "hurry up" ?

[foreman]

Went to BJ's in Temple last night. Considered leaving the gun in the car assuming a brew-house would be TABC posted. I didn't see any signs at the door so went in and at the hostess station is the blue sign in english and spanish. After we ate, stopped by the restroom(next to the bar area) and saw a red 51 sign. There is nothing seperating the eating/bar areas. Opinions on carry/leave in car.

[MeMelYup]

That means you can not sit at the bar while you are loaded.

[SWAMPRNR]

Went to BJ's in Temple last night. Considered leaving the gun in the car assuming a brew-house would be TABC posted. I didn't see any signs at the door so went in and at the hostess station is the blue sign in english and spanish. After we ate, stopped by the restroom(next to the bar area) and saw a red 51 sign. There is nothing seperating the eating/bar areas. Opinions on carry/leave in car.

I eat there a couple of times a week and have only seen the blue sign posted to the right of the hostess station. Have never been over by the bar but now i am going to have to go take a look. I know some of the other places in town treat the bar area as a separate business.

[ScottDLS]

Went to BJ's in Temple last night. Considered leaving the gun in the car assuming a brew-house would be TABC posted. I didn't see any signs at the door so went in and at the hostess station is the blue sign in english and spanish. After we ate, stopped by the restroom(next to the bar area) and saw a red 51 sign. There is nothing seperating the eating/bar areas. Opinions on carry/leave in car.

I eat there a couple of times a week and have only seen the blue sign posted to the right of the hostess station. Have never been over by the bar but now i am going to have to go take a look. I know some of the other places in town treat the bar area as a separate business.

Sounds like it's not a 51% location. It's pretty unusual unless it's just a drinks only, or minmal bar food, type of place.

[bigmoney]

I thought i remembered my instructor saying that signs had to be at entrances to be enforcable, but i don't see that in the PC. So it a 30.06 isn't at an entrance, but further back in a store somewhere, what do you think the chances are that one could argue entrapment for allowing you to enter the store, therefore breaking the law, before seeing the sign? assuming you get caught and things go down hill.

[ScottDLS]

I thought i remembered my instructor saying that signs had to be at entrances to be enforcable, but i don't see that in the PC. So it a 30.06 isn't at an entrance, but further back in a store somewhere, what do you think the chances are that one could argue entrapment for allowing you to enter the store, therefore breaking the law, before seeing the sign? assuming you get caught and things go down hill.

You're not breaking the law until you "receive notice" and fail to depart. Presumably, you don't receive notice until you see it.


While the statute doesn't say the entrances have to be posted, it does say that the sign must be... "displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public". If it's not displayed in such a manner you'll have a good argument that you didn't "receive notice".