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New article with one to soon follow. Questions/comments are welcome.

https://blog.westernpowders.com/2020/03 ... mpetition/

Just saw your post this morning! Well done. Although, I do wish you would hold off touting RMR so much before I get another order in! They are already running 3-4 weeks out due to the panic buying.

We've discussed it before but I've running RMR's 124 gr. JHP's at 1100fps with Silhouette and they are surprisingly soft and very accurate. I do need to run them longer and retest for accuracy in my 1911... I currently load them shorter (COL of 1.075") so that they will safely chamber in all of my 9mm guns.

You seem to really like Accurate #2, so I'm wondering if you could compare it to Silhouette for me... differences in feel, range, velocities, etc.?

Thanks for the research and effort that went into the article, I enjoyed reading it.

On last request... I KNOW you took a pic of the expanded RMR JHP from the water jug test... can you post it??

Thanks!

flechero wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:17 am Just saw your post this morning! Well done. Although, I do wish you would hold off touting RMR so much before I get another order in! They are already running 3-4 weeks out due to the panic buying.

Yep, haha!

I just got my first shipment of 147gr flat nose bullets from RMR. Going to load them up with Unique (because I have 8# of it) for use in my handguns and SBR’d Scorpion. Except for a few random cases of 115gr all my 9mm shooting these days is 147gr as about half of it is suppressed. I find it easier to standardize on this as I’m not necessarily shooting (pun) for the most accurate round from each gun but rather one that will work across all my hosts.

flechero wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:17 am Just saw your post this morning! Well done. Although, I do wish you would hold off touting RMR so much before I get another order in! They are already running 3-4 weeks out due to the panic buying.

We've discussed it before but I've running RMR's 124 gr. JHP's at 1100fps with Silhouette and they are surprisingly soft and very accurate. I do need to run them longer and retest for accuracy in my 1911... I currently load them shorter (COL of 1.075") so that they will safely chamber in all of my 9mm guns.

You seem to really like Accurate #2, so I'm wondering if you could compare it to Silhouette for me... differences in feel, range, velocities, etc.?

Thanks for the research and effort that went into the article, I enjoyed reading it.

On last request... I KNOW you took a pic of the expanded RMR JHP from the water jug test... can you post it??

Thanks!

I've mainly been looking at No 2 for minor power factor loads at around 130 PF, and for .38 Special plinkers. What was probably the most commonly used powder for the minor PF loads was Hodgdon Clays imported from ADI in Australia. Don't know exactly what happened, but Hodgdon is no longer able to get Clays and several other powders from ADI and they started having those powders produced in Canada. So far, the Canadian Clays isn't exciting anyone.

No 2 is a pretty good choice and recoil seems light. But the powder I'm surprised that not many are looking at as a replacement for Clays is Ramshot Competition. Ran across quite a coincidence in the past week when I was comparing .38 Special data for Competition to the Clays data at the Hodgdon Reloading Center. For several bullet weights that I use, the data is identical. I'm probably gonna get some Competition in the next month or so and start looking at it for .38 Special loads, and maybe 200 gr. SWC loads in .45 ACP where I've long used WST for that.

The writing I've done using No 2 was mostly for comp shooters because I do not load a lot of them for myself. I tend to make defense loads more than anything else, and Silhouette is what I use most often for 124 gr. JHPs. I use AA No 7 in my 147 gr. JHP loads, and if I set out to make an accuracy load, I use True Blue which is another good choice for 124 gr. defense loads and for up to 1050 FPS with 147 gr. JHPs without getting into +P pressure.

As you've seen, the RMR 124 gr. In-House JHP often requires a short OACL. That is not the case for my 9 X 19mm handload test pistol, the Canik TP9sa. The fastest I've pushed that bullet was 1181 FPS and it did well in the water test, but I'd say near its Max Potential. However, I used an OACL of 1.122"/28.5mm that is too long for many pistols. Shank length of the RMR 124 gr. JHP is pretty close to the SIERRA 125 gr. JHP. Lyman also used the SIERRA 125 in their data while both used an OACL of 1.075". The SIERRA Max Charge of Silhouette is 6.1 grs. and should produce pretty high velocity. Lyman didn't use Silhouette in the P & R III that I have.

IIRC, I posted a pic of the RMR 124 gr. JHP that chrono'd 1181 FPS in one of the past articles I did for the Western blog. I'm in a bit of a time crunch at the moment, but later I'll check for the particular article and I'll also check my files to see if I still have the pic. That's not to say, however, that the bullet needs to be pushed to 1181 FPS. I think it would do fairly well even down to around 1100 FPS. And, unfortunately, I've used all of those I had. It compares very well to the Nosler 124 gr. JHP that has provided excellent accuracy in the past, but even above 1200 FPS I could not get the Nosler 124 to expand much, or any. Not a problem with the RMR 124 gr. JHP and you can find the comparison done at the RMR website where it was compared directly to the Nosler 124, and compared very well as far as consistency in weight and diameter.

SigM4 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 10:46 am

flechero wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:17 am Just saw your post this morning! Well done. Although, I do wish you would hold off touting RMR so much before I get another order in! They are already running 3-4 weeks out due to the panic buying.

Yep, haha!

I just got my first shipment of 147gr flat nose bullets from RMR. Going to load them up with Unique (because I have 8# of it) for use in my handguns and SBR’d Scorpion. Except for a few random cases of 115gr all my 9mm shooting these days is 147gr as about half of it is suppressed. I find it easier to standardize on this as I’m not necessarily shooting (pun) for the most accurate round from each gun but rather one that will work across all my hosts.

One of the best deals I've found of late is the WIN 147 gr. JHP at Midway. Really exceptional deal but out of stock last time I checked. I've water tested at 1117 FPS and it performs very well. Plus its long and slender ogive allows for longer OACLs in short thoated 9mm pistols. My load at 1.142"/29mm passed the plunk test in my shooting partner's HK VP9 which has about the shortest throat among the 9mm pistols we have.

K-Texas wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:36 pm

SigM4 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 10:46 am

flechero wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:17 am Just saw your post this morning! Well done. Although, I do wish you would hold off touting RMR so much before I get another order in! They are already running 3-4 weeks out due to the panic buying.

Yep, haha!

I just got my first shipment of 147gr flat nose bullets from RMR. Going to load them up with Unique (because I have 8# of it) for use in my handguns and SBR’d Scorpion. Except for a few random cases of 115gr all my 9mm shooting these days is 147gr as about half of it is suppressed. I find it easier to standardize on this as I’m not necessarily shooting (pun) for the most accurate round from each gun but rather one that will work across all my hosts.

One of the best deals I've found of late is the WIN 147 gr. JHP at Midway. Really exceptional deal but out of stock last time I checked. I've water tested at 1117 FPS and it performs very well. Plus its long and slender ogive allows for longer OACLs in short thoated 9mm pistols. My load at 1.142"/29mm passed the plunk test in my shooting partner's HK VP9 which has about the shortest throat among the 9mm pistols we have.

Good to know, I’ll be loading for a VP9 and a CZ P-07 among others. Hadn’t heard about the VP9 but did know that CZs tend to have short throats.

flechero wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:17 am Just saw your post this morning! Well done. Although, I do wish you would hold off touting RMR so much before I get another order in! They are already running 3-4 weeks out due to the panic buying.

We've discussed it before but I've running RMR's 124 gr. JHP's at 1100fps with Silhouette and they are surprisingly soft and very accurate. I do need to run them longer and retest for accuracy in my 1911... I currently load them shorter (COL of 1.075") so that they will safely chamber in all of my 9mm guns.

You seem to really like Accurate #2, so I'm wondering if you could compare it to Silhouette for me... differences in feel, range, velocities, etc.?

Thanks for the research and effort that went into the article, I enjoyed reading it.

On last request... I KNOW you took a pic of the expanded RMR JHP from the water jug test... can you post it??

Thanks!

flechero, looks like you'll have to go here for the pic:

https://blog.westernpowders.com/2019/01 ... different/

In the SIERRA data, they show velocity in groups of 50 FPS increases. The data I have was from a 4" Hi-Point. Not that I mean to disparage an economical pistol that some may need to buy. It does, however, inspire confidence for using that data in a high quality 9mm. They show the 6.1 gr. Max Charge as being able to reach 1150 FPS from the 4" Hi-Point which chrono's faster from my 4.47" Canik TP9sa. As you will see from the pic, I would consider 1180 FPS as the velocity threshold for the 124 gr. RMR JHP.

Something else I've done very rarely is load FMJ; in any handgun caliber. In the most recent article I did load the RMR 147 gr. TC FMJ at 130 PF with No 2 and True Blue. With the 50 I have remaining I'll likely load them faster with True Blue. I chose it over the roundnose 147 gr. FMJ in hopes that I could load longer, which proved to be the case.

In the past when there were great deals on bulk pack bullets, I always bought JHPs. FMJs were just too close to the same price, so in terms of economy I loaded hard-cast lead with bullets .001" larger than the barrel's groove dia., .356" and never had any problems with leading but I did not load for pistols with polygonal rifling, and I don't really have an opinion on that where opinions are both Pro and Con. I suspect poly-coating makes that a moot point and will be looking into that in the near future.

I have another article that should go up in the next few days where I used the SNS 125 gr. RN (SWC) that due to the smaller dia above the bullet's shoulder can be loaded longer for short chamber 9s. That's also the case for the 124 gr. Golden Saber that I touched on at the end of that article.

Thanks for the info on Accurate #2, I appreciate your perspective.

I looked closely at buying Competition a few months ago when my LGS was closing down and liquidating... what ultimately made the decision for me was the 12 oz container (instead of 1lb) and the fact that I was sitting on about 6 lbs of clays... and the fact that they had Silhouette on a super blowout pricing, so I spent the discretionary dollars on it instead.

Thanks for the link to the pics!

flechero wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 4:24 pm Thanks for the info on Accurate #2, I appreciate your perspective.

I looked closely at buying Competition a few months ago when my LGS was closing down and liquidating... what ultimately made the decision for me was the 12 oz container (instead of 1lb) and the fact that I was sitting on about 6 lbs of clays... and the fact that they had Silhouette on a super blowout pricing, so I spent the discretionary dollars on it instead.

Thanks for the link to the pics!

Glad to help!

As you might imagine, I have and use all of Western's handgun powders except TCM to include the new 11 FS which is a flash suppressed version of W296/H110. Fairly impressed with it so far. Very low flash, not just as far as magnum handgun powders go, it also flashes less than No 9 or No 7 in magnum revolver loads. Competition I'll get in a 4# jug. Never been much for buying 3/4# bottles either, but they'd likely have to use a larger bottle to sell 1# and still have the requisite airspace.

I have other powders as well, but they've mostly been replaced by Accurate or Ramshot. One of the perks for writing articles for them. My favorite handgun powder of all is True Blue. It was the powder that P.B. Clermont in Belgium originally furnished to FN Herstal to load the 5.7 X 28mm, yet it can be exceptional in low pressure cartridges as well. It can be used for every caliber we're likely to handload from .32 ACP up to .454 Casull loads at around 54,000 PSI. It is definitely a one of a kind powder. Very pressure stable and uniform. I use it for .45 ACP 230 gr. JHP loads and it's about as good as it gets for .357 Magnum loads for revolvers under 4". It may not start out with as much velocity, but it loses much less as barrel length decreases and comes by low flash naturally.

I may look into true blue after I run through a few lbs of other powders. Am I correct in the understanding that it's slower than Silhouette and faster then No 5?

flechero wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 8:23 pm I may look into true blue after I run through a few lbs of other powders. Am I correct in the understanding that it's slower than Silhouette and faster then No 5?

I'd say correct. True Blue will do anything that No 5 will do, but that doesn't work in reverse. True Blue is more pressure stable which Lyman seemed to catch on to with their Pistol & Revolver III where they loaded to higher pressure with True Blue than any other powder in some cases, and not necessarily for a velocity increase.

Nothing wrong with No 5 near 35,000 PSI in cartridges like the 9 X 19mm or .40 S&W, while that's Max Pressure for the .40 S&W and should not be exceeded. Going above 35,000 PSI/33,000 CUP with the 9 X 19mm is not something you'd want to use No 5 for while TB is stable enough for +P at 38,500 PSI. There are cases where you could say that TB is slower burning than No 5. Such things tend to vary by cartridge, whereas burn rate is determined in a vessel of one particular size.